Cingular Pay Cuts and Bitterness

Originally Posted by SuxBeingU

This is the way of the world. Stan needs a new boat adn a new vacation house. Do you really expect him to pay for it. HELL NO, you will buy it for him.

I do find the timing suspicious, you would think it would be wise to keep employees happy during "THE SEASON?. They arre apparently thinking if we stick them now we'll get a bigger cut

Originally Posted by thechosenway

So then last year in January our commissions went up ??? I don't recall that at all. I am sure this is a big deal as I heard higher ups trying to coach MGRs on how to position the paycut in a way that makes us accept it. They legally have to explain the new compensation plan to each of us. Either in a group meeting (like ours this saturday) or individualy. I have called CWA several times but to no avail. They seem to be no help at all.

Originally Posted by thechosenway

So Sauturday is here and I was RIGHT.... If your a retail COR RSC you heard about it. Its not one of those paycuts to kills durring the holidays YAY.. doesn't go into effect until 2007....

250-230=20 not 270 LOL

SO I repeat as one of the previous posts thought.... It is not a holiday thing but a full restructure taking place first of 2007

Originally Posted by Soopafly

...
So I guess they're right.... this job is no longer for good and smart sales people...

Originally Posted by ivwshane

The focus seems to be on features since the feature pay out is higher only if you meet the minium feature goal.

Unfortunately this does a couple of things; it causes reps to focus more on feature per opp rather than just helping customers. Second it only penalizes those that sell a lot but are not necessarily the top sellers (those that sell a lot but aren't top salesmen typically have lower feature numbers and therefore will be taking a pay cut). Third, it basically re-enforces that those that bottom feed are doing the right thing by doing the bare minimum (since no matter what, their minimum feature pay out will be $500, they can continue to not sell anything and make as much as those that sell more but aren't able to reach the minimum goal).

Originally Posted by SoCal91302

Still have not heard anything about it. So everyone is guaranteed $500 in commision no matter what?

Originally Posted by ivwshane

From what I could understand it does seem that no matter what you are guaranteed to hit $500 in feature money.

Sounds like a good reason for the slackers to keep on slacking

Originally Posted by ivwshane

Ok so I got clarification and it's worse than I thought.

Depending on your store there is a base amount your feature commision is based on.

lets say $500.

So if you hit $13 in features the you get 100% of $500.
If you hit $15 per opp you get 115% ($15 / $13) of $500 = $575
If you only hit $10 per opp then you get 77% of $500 = $385

Now the $500 is dependant on the stores volume and has nothing to do with how much you actually make.


The above example is a rough idea (there are some other factors that play into the actual payout amount). No matter what though it's a pay cut.

Just a quick comparison:

$2000 in features = $1700 currently
$30 per opp regardless of the actual revenue = $1153 ($30/$13 * $500) for new com plan

Originally Posted by Freakshow105

Wirelessly posted (LGE-VX9800/1.0 UP.Browser/6.2.3.2 (GUI) MMP/2.0)

makes me happy i am not there anymore...i think it is the same with all companies. I am now working for vzw...the grass is a lot greener there but it is the same bs, quota, metrics, accessory ratio but the one different thing i see there is the positive atmosphere,..people love working for vzw...i think the ultimate job at cingular is hr...dont see customers and u get a free phone

Originally Posted by SoCal91302

There has to be more to it than that. Do you have anything on paper? Why is it that there are so many conflicting pieces of information?

Originally Posted by monstars02

Commissions go up and down thorought the years, now just happens to be the up side. The down side will come and it will go back up again. That is just how it is.

Originally Posted by KaBaL666

Cingular makes us the least amount of revenue. (thats why i bring customers over to either alltel or sprint).

Originally Posted by Superpimp

You know it's not so much pay cuts I'm mad about it's people feature flipping causing me to get a chargeback, if it's a feature I added I take it back but then I get a chargeback for the next month I've got like 300 in chargebacks for next month just because some clown not on the up and up took my stuff

Originally Posted by mentalcase

take them back then.

Originally Posted by tkdlove

on the brighter side, this should wash out some of the dead weight and allow you to make your sales better.

Originally Posted by Soopafly

Anyway you look at it, it is a paycut. Sounds like someone here has had corporate feed them some bs...

Run the numbers... it's less than 85% payout... way less...

Originally Posted by tkdlove

never said it was better, just that you would survive

Originally Posted by Soopafly

Depends on how much you rely on feature revenue for your paycheck... And currently its more than half of my commission check.

Originally Posted by tkdlove

just sat through an 8 hour meeting that went over the comp plan... yea 8 hours

let's see if i can break it down:

features: March 2007

currently you make 85% of your feature sales and have to maintain something like $12 per opp. (this is in GA)
in 2007 you will not have to worry about the whole per opp thing. they are switching to a more P&L type layout.
basically:
you get a bucket number for features: let's say $1200 (example) then for the payout you have an at risk of $500 (once again example) if you hit 80% to 100% you get the $500 at risk but here is the good part, hitting 120%-130% and 131% to 140% nets you your at risk plus a % more. the best part is hitting the 150% and higher gets you just that, 150% and up and up and up.
the neat thing here is you do not have to worry about your activations to get the higher % payout.

now opps and subs are completely different.... Jan 1st 2007

you HAVE to hit your gross adds! have to... if you do not hit your goal then you will not be eligible for excellence and the higher tier opp payout.

example:

jimmy has a gross add goal of 45 as a full time rep. he also has an opp goal of 100.
he kills the sales floor and pulls in 90 upgrades and 200 opps, over $70 per opp in accessories and gets 200% of his feature goal.

problem is jimmy only hit 44 gross adds. now normally jimmy would be on his way to excellence and a fat paycheck but... that 1 gross add kept him from his excellence tier.

sucks, i know but this is the system.

all you good sales reps should not worry though, you will find a way to maximize your commissions but those who want to hang in the back and try and coast by will be SAM'd and thats just the reality of it...

chin up guys... you will do just fine!

on the brighter side, this should wash out some of the dead weight and allow you to make your sales better.

*please realize that all numbers are for explination and example purpose only.*

Originally Posted by BniceBwareBfair

This would be nice if growth year over year was factored in as a % of reality and not designed to make up for lost revenue on overstated budgets. I'm sure you know the challenge is more complex than what is stated. I bleed orange too, however goals set as a result of a coordination of different depatments sales activities must be important enough to involve increased incentification on At Risk levels. Compensation should be viewed like a marketing plan for the year. Incentive should vary based upon significant IDENTIFIED events during the year. Currently the incentive plan reduces per unit compensation on anticipated business. In essence whenever the RSM team needs to work the hardest they make the least. An RSM is sales driven and needs to see positive reinforcement to define his path. This plan does not[U] show that Formula. Increased Efforts = INCREASED REWARD

Originally Posted by BniceBwareBfair

Understand December comp reflects the yearly budgetary controls adjusted for reasons by NYC senior VP's. Each month the goal is adjusted to reflect a financial target. At risk RSM comp is not adjusted because of the need to level out the RSM team comp uniformly. What Senior VP's have failed to understand (as they did last year in December until pressured to change) is that all the ducks are in a row for this season except RSM mindset. Most locations are at a 42% raise in quota, which translates to a 42% reduced Comp for the RSM team. If an investment was made to make this season the best ever someone forgot the people who will be supporting the 42% increased effort. I truly believe they do not care.

Originally Posted by BniceBwareBfair

This would be nice if growth year over year was factored in as a % of reality and not designed to make up for lost revenue on overstated budgets. I'm sure you know the challenge is more complex than what is stated. I bleed orange too, however goals set as a result of a coordination of different depatments sales activities must be important enough to involve increased incentification on At Risk levels. Compensation should be viewed like a marketing plan for the year. Incentive should vary based upon significant IDENTIFIED events during the year. Currently the incentive plan reduces per unit compensation on anticipated business. In essence whenever the RSM team needs to work the hardest they make the least. An RSM is sales driven and needs to see positive reinforcement to define his path. This plan does not[U] show that Formula. Increased Efforts = INCREASED REWARD

Originally Posted by ariez

with these changes, will it be possible for a part-timer to make $3k a month total compensation after taxes?

Originally Posted by ivwshane

No offense guys but I don't see how management could be responsible for good numbers. Sales people are going to sell no matter what and will sell what makes them money (and cingular dictates that). I'm not saying that management has no affect at all, I just don't think the affect is as big as you guys are making it out to be.

Originally Posted by SoCal91302

possible? yes. likely? no.

Originally Posted by ivwshane

No offense guys but I don't see how management could be responsible for good numbers. Sales people are going to sell no matter what and will sell what makes them money (and cingular dictates that). I'm not saying that management has no affect at all, I just don't think the affect is as big as you guys are making it out to be.

Originally Posted by thechosenway

I have happily come across this forum and truly feel the same way as many of the bitter RDC's here. Cingular and all wireless companies are a racket. When working there you take it from both ends. They are pressureing you on quota's and metrics constantly. Then when you meet quota they move the target higher. It is a joke. Then the customers always complaining about problems, overages, equipment malfunctions, dropped calls, and everythingelse they can think of.

As far as pay goes its the second best job I have had, yet I am willing to sacrafice pay for sanity. Trust me the turnover is sickening. I have seen 5 different managers in my three years. Not one person I started with three years ago is still there. I over heard conference call about the upcoming comission restructure and YES its a paycut. 2 minus 1 is 1 not 3. They will use verbage to make it seem like they arent shafting you, when in reality they truly are cutting our comissions.

I believe I am a huge part of the success at My Cingular store. We have increased our numbers dramaticaly. and we get a paycut as a thank you. F** these idiots in the front office trying to find a way to stiff the little guy on the front lines servicing the customers.

We have a union CWA and they are good for nothing. I was trying to organize a walk out for this saturday after they announce our paycuts, yet too many people are too chicken to stand up to the almighty Cingular. I feel like a paycut right now going into the holidays is a major slap in the face. I am disgusted with Cingular both as a customer as well. "its the network fools"

Fewest dropped calls ?? Only because instead of dropping the call you or who you are talking to fade in out and out. So what if it doesnt drop if I cant hear people 20 percent of the time.

"that is a problem and we are working on it" Is a statement made by employees at my store to customers !! We had no incoming calls on TDMA phones for 3 months. Where do you think VZW got the idea for the commercial. Beacuse it is something customers have heard over and over.

Trust me.. I am one of the most positive people you could know. Cingular will make you bitter. The average RSC lasts less than 2 years. You have to have a thick skin and be willing to put up with quotas that move higher and higher.

Once your superman then you must be super superman then you must be super super superman.

They suck the life out of you. Our former ARSM and I quote "use them up chew them up then spit them out" in reference to RSC's.

I would highly encourage anyone whom might think of working there to consider somthingelse. Yes the money is good..But money aint happiness.

As for me I am stuck because I support a big family. It will be hard to find a better paying job but very easy to find one that is more likeable.



Anyonelse aware of the comission restructure? Trust me they don't change pay structure unless it benefits Cingular not the employee.

Originally Posted by Alfred_Neuman

im still confused on cingulars new pay. while i no longer work for cingular ( i now work for t-mobile), is this essentially a "no more profit off features"?

i know i made most of my money off features.

it made up for the lack thereof on the rate plans.

Originally Posted by mulletwireless

AT&T will be a boost for wireless indirect's money and perks as well as the CORS. Oh the good old days of AT&T trips to the biggest sporting events....Super Bowl... KY Derby...Indy 500...tickets to the Academy Awards, the perks were unlimited with the old AT&T then AT&T Wireless. I am sure you can expect the same from the new AT&T.

Was it just me or did Cingular really got the idea its all about personal incentives when selling?

Originally Posted by Alfred_Neuman

is there any cor rep left who recalls when payout for blackberries were $50?

man that was some good money. remember when reciepts were a page from the printer?

Originally Posted by cingulargal

Not to brag, I left Cingular about a year ago and I dont know what took me so long, I work for a company where I get regular promotions and raises, and make 4x in commission than I did at CIngular, and though very few of you will know who this but the person in my new company who is our Nancy Garvey(CIngular Midwest VP, i think) comes out at least once a month and takes most everyone in this region to dinner or lunch, we are welcomed to call people in a higher up positions if we feel the need exist, and they answer their own phones. And its just so much more flexible, in everyway shape and form, it takes three months of not making quota to even get a preformance imporvment plan meeting with your manager, and there is no constant threat of termination. And we allow upgrades at 18 months, not 21 and thier arpu doesnt matter, we dont charge for sim cards, we dont charge an upgrade fee and I really feel like we can better "serve" our customers because we are not so worried about the other little stuff that I had to at cingular. ALso the health package is cheaper and I have not noticed any difference in coverage, also I was able to recieve benefits my start day, and part timers get the same benefits. I can truely say that unless I move and the absolute only place I can work is cingular it will always be last on my list of places to even apply for, if I even can.... I am working with my old boss to determine that right now...

Originally Posted by leftcoastgsm

So why does a VP of Cingular come over and buy you lunch? I'm a little lost here.

Originally Posted by cingulargal

Not to brag, I left Cingular about a year ago and I dont know what took me so long, I work for a company where I get regular promotions and raises, and make 4x in commission than I did at CIngular, and though very few of you will know who this but the person in my new company who is our Nancy Garvey(CIngular Midwest VP, i think) comes out at least once a month and takes most everyone in this region to dinner or lunch, we are welcomed to call people in a higher up positions if we feel the need exist, and they answer their own phones. And its just so much more flexible, in everyway shape and form, it takes three months of not making quota to even get a preformance imporvment plan meeting with your manager, and there is no constant threat of termination. And we allow upgrades at 18 months, not 21 and thier arpu doesnt matter, we dont charge for sim cards, we dont charge an upgrade fee and I really feel like we can better "serve" our customers because we are not so worried about the other little stuff that I had to at cingular. ALso the health package is cheaper and I have not noticed any difference in coverage, also I was able to recieve benefits my start day, and part timers get the same benefits. I can truely say that unless I move and the absolute only place I can work is cingular it will always be last on my list of places to even apply for, if I even can.... I am working with my old boss to determine that right now...

Originally Posted by mulletwireless

AT&T will be a boost for wireless indirect's money and perks as well as the CORS. Oh the good old days of AT&T trips to the biggest sporting events....Super Bowl... KY Derby...Indy 500...tickets to the Academy Awards, the perks were unlimited with the old AT&T then AT&T Wireless. I am sure you can expect the same from the new AT&T.

Was it just me or did Cingular really got the idea its all about personal incentives when selling?

Originally Posted by Alfred_Neuman

uh that was the original at&t.

good luck seeing SBC/Bellsouth give you that. i know you flipped from tmobile to cingular, but take my word: you wont be getting those incentives the original AT&T Wireless gave.

Originally Posted by mulletwireless

I hope the AT&T brings back checks instead of them silly visa gift cards... and instant discounts on handsets! God only knows if we could dump the mail in rebate process all together customer would be happier if they just come in, sign up, fill out a simple slip, where it can be direct deposited in 3-4 or a check sent out!

Originally Posted by bumfights

I've been working for Cingular for roughly six months but came out on the first day guns blazing. From day one I have charmed each and every customer, sold my *** off, quit smoking so I could work more, skipped breaks, been physically assaulted by an irate customer (hit me in the face for his overages,) learned quite a bit of Spanish, put up with authorized resellers screwing customers, the whole bit. Last month I had $3,900 dollars in commissions. I was very happy with this, and it almost made up for all the times I had to show someone how to set a wallpaper or a ringtone. We were informed of the new commission plan in October. I decided that I would start preparing myself for the new compensation and just pretend that it was already in effect. I work in a slower store that is already overstaffed in my opinion, but whatever, I'll deal with it. There are only two people in the store worth worrying about. Another rep who is insane at closing new adds, and myself, excellent at metrics. So I hit my 45 gross adds, 161 total opps, $14 FPO, $82 APO and reaped in a nice fat check of $3,900. Keep in mind I worked myself to the point of exhaustion to reach this. I'm talking when it's slow I'm punching in random numbers and checking their bill for overages just to get a Media Bundle out of them to save them money. This month? I am already ahead of where I was last month, and there's still 10 days left for commissions. The result? My-comp is showing me for around $1,700. Combine this with the constant threat of termination for erroroneous discounting and wrong codes and not doing returns correctly and audits...it really makes one hate what they're doing. Things change on a day to day basis and we are ill informed by our manager, and also things change with no warning. Did any other COR employees notice the prices on handsets set to be effective on the 21st actually changed today? Why are we liable for this? It also makes you wonder why you're selling even harder and being extra thorough for about a 1/3rd of the payout. My manager looks me in the eyes and lies and tells me that the new compensation plan isn't that bad, even when I've showed her the difference in work vs payout amount. I would go to the union rep but last time I saw her she pulled up in a 7-series...so how much could someone making 250k a year really care about us? Personally...I hate to say it but I'm looking for work elsewhere. It's just disappointing to me that right when I join the company it turns south. Trust me when I say this...ATT doesn't give a flying **** about their employees. They are just trying to get the smart and good salesmen out so they can hire someone happy with $1,000 in commissions.

Originally Posted by thechosenway

I have happily come across this forum and truly feel the same way as many of the bitter RDC's here. Cingular and all wireless companies are a racket. When working there you take it from both ends. They are pressureing you on quota's and metrics constantly. Then when you meet quota they move the target higher. It is a joke. Then the customers always complaining about problems, overages, equipment malfunctions, dropped calls, and everythingelse they can think of.

As far as pay goes its the second best job I have had, yet I am willing to sacrafice pay for sanity. Trust me the turnover is sickening. I have seen 5 different managers in my three years. Not one person I started with three years ago is still there. I over heard conference call about the upcoming comission restructure and YES its a paycut. 2 minus 1 is 1 not 3. They will use verbage to make it seem like they arent shafting you, when in reality they truly are cutting our comissions.

I believe I am a huge part of the success at My Cingular store. We have increased our numbers dramaticaly. and we get a paycut as a thank you. F** these idiots in the front office trying to find a way to stiff the little guy on the front lines servicing the customers.

We have a union CWA and they are good for nothing. I was trying to organize a walk out for this saturday after they announce our paycuts, yet too many people are too chicken to stand up to the almighty Cingular. I feel like a paycut right now going into the holidays is a major slap in the face. I am disgusted with Cingular both as a customer as well. "its the network fools"

Fewest dropped calls ?? Only because instead of dropping the call you or who you are talking to fade in out and out. So what if it doesnt drop if I cant hear people 20 percent of the time.

"that is a problem and we are working on it" Is a statement made by employees at my store to customers !! We had no incoming calls on TDMA phones for 3 months. Where do you think VZW got the idea for the commercial. Beacuse it is something customers have heard over and over.

Trust me.. I am one of the most positive people you could know. Cingular will make you bitter. The average RSC lasts less than 2 years. You have to have a thick skin and be willing to put up with quotas that move higher and higher.

Once your superman then you must be super superman then you must be super super superman.

They suck the life out of you. Our former ARSM and I quote "use them up chew them up then spit them out" in reference to RSC's.

I would highly encourage anyone whom might think of working there to consider somthingelse. Yes the money is good..But money aint happiness.

As for me I am stuck because I support a big family. It will be hard to find a better paying job but very easy to find one that is more likeable.



Anyonelse aware of the comission restructure? Trust me they don't change pay structure unless it benefits Cingular not the employee.

Originally Posted by savinggrace

$12.35 Per Hour