vB Easy Archive - iPhone as a PDA?

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iPhone as a PDA?
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Posted by: MetsFan46

Does anybody know if there is a way to use the iphone as a pda without having to activate it?

Posted by: soulja63

no can do right now

Posted by: xcharliemx

The iphone is more a pmp (personal media player) and i dont think it should ever be considered a pda

Posted by: wibrandy

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcharliemx

The iphone is more a pmp (personal media player) and i dont think it should ever be considered a pda

I would completely disagree with that statement. Compared to the Blackberry, PalmOS, and WinMo, I think the iPhone has the nicest calendar and contact apps out there. While it's scary to think of iTunes as a sync tool, it just works and works well.

Posted by: melmac

Quote:

Originally Posted by wibrandy

You cannot use the iPhone in an enterprise or corporate environment. Period. No Exchange support, no Outlook sync (doesn't matter how pretty it is if it don't work with your company's system, and NO corporation uses iTunes LOL), etc, etc, etc = not a PDA replacement. It is a phone/iPod, but definately NOT a PDA. I work in IT at a large hospital, and chuckle when people call for support for their iPhones (which we don't support anyways, everyone uses Treo or BB cause they WORK). You can't even get on our wireless guest network with WiFi because Safari can't accept the security certificate.

Posted by: drrjv

There are ways to unlock the iPhone and add apps, 'activate without really activating' etc. Use Google.

The term PDA is too general.

Exactly what do you want to do?

Posted by: GeeK.dLL

You can use this to unlock it so you can use it without activating it. It worked for me

http://www.pqdvd.net/iphone-unlock-toolkit.html

Posted by: Kar98

Quote:

Originally Posted by drrjv

The term PDA is too general.
Exactly what do you want to do?

The term PDA is quite defined: a small computer that fits into a pocket, combines address book, calendar, notes, to-do list, e-mail, and which can be synchronized with desktop computers. Everything else, e-books, music player, phone etc is icing on the cake, but a common addition.

That said, why the hell is there a notes function on the iphone, but not in OSX?

Posted by: JerryNY

Personal Digital Assistant can mean different things depending on whom you ask. It isn't a corporate tool but for calenders and contacts it is far better than most regular phones.

Posted by: Kar98

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryNY

Personal Digital Assistant can mean different things depending on whom you ask.

Uhm. No, it can't.

PDA
noun
a palmtop computer used to store information such as addresses and telephone numbers, and for simple word processing and spreadsheeting.

Posted by: BeoWuff

Quote:

Originally Posted by wibrandy

I respectfully disagree. My iPhone has a wonderful and whimsical GUI but I prefer Palm's one-screen editing, the fact that the Palm's calendar can schedule repeating appointments by day of month (every 3rd Thursday), and its more aggressive predictive text filling using past entries as a guide for Locations.

Posted by: JerryNY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kar98

Uhm. No, it can't.

PDA
noun
a palmtop computer used to store information such as addresses and telephone numbers, and for simple word processing and spreadsheeting.

Um, I can find many different definitions:

http://computing-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/PDA for example:

"Definition of: PDA

(Personal Digital Assistant) A handheld computer for managing contacts, appointments and tasks. It typically includes a name and address database, calendar, to-do list and note taker, which are the functions in a personal information manager (see PIM). Wireless PDAs may also offer e-mail, Web browsing and cellular phone service (see smartphone). Data are synchronized between the PDA and desktop computer via a cabled connection or wireless."

or

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/PDA

"Noun 1. PDAPDA - a lightweight consumer electronic device that looks like a hand-held computer but instead performs specific tasks; can serve as a diary or a personal database or a telephone or an alarm clock etc"

Thank you for making me look it up and seeing that iPhone is in fact a PDA

Posted by: Kar98

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryNY

Um, I can find many different definitions

They all say what I said.

Posted by: toomer

Quote:

Originally Posted by melmac

Um, no.

I work for a 30,000+ employee corporation, Nasdaq-100 listed, with offices in several dozen countries ... and we have zero Exchange in our organization. Thousands of us have iPhones and are quite satisfied with them for business use.

Still think it is not corporate, "Period." ?? Not every corporation works the same as your little hospital does.

Posted by: JerryNY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kar98

They all say what I said.

I haven't found any that say " and for simple word processing and spreadsheeting." though. Sure it is a commonly used thing today on handhelds but there are many people that don't use spreadsheets or edit word processing docs on them. We could sit here and list definitions all day long and still not come to a consensus but the short of it is the original poster was asking if you could use the iPhone as a PDA and for him all that matters here is what his definition of PDA is.

Posted by: moralpanic

Quote:

Originally Posted by wibrandy

Maybe if CUTTING AND PASTING worked, it could pretend to be a decent PDA.

Posted by: rickpaul2

Yes, the iPhone is indeed a PDA.
Can it keep contacts, a calendar, notes, and a to do list? If so, then it meets the criteria of a PDA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by toomer

ok mr exception to the rule...

The iPhone is not designed for mission critical corporate use. It is incompatible with most corporate infrastructures, and has many mission critical disabilities.

Many IT professionals are pulling their hair out because their Supervisors and such force them to try to get their iPhones to integrate with their current infrastructure. It is easy to tell most people "No" but it is more difficult to tell your CEO or supervisor "No".

Posted by: toomer

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickpaul2

ok mr exception to the rule...

Exception? Not really...

You do realize, don't you ... that Microsoft Exchange does not own 90%+ of the corporate email seats in the world ... right?

http://www.edbrill.com/ebrill/edbri...052PMEBRPJ4.htm

And yes - before you say anything, that post is 3 years old. I'm expecting that Microsoft might have moved up to more like 50-55% by now (I'd be surprised if they didn't).

So, let's say roughtly half the world runs Exchange? That leaves roughly another half that doesn't. Hardly an "exception to the rule".

Unless there is some other capability that you were referring to? The only one I can think of that is missing (and it's up to each organization to decide how important it is for them) is the remote-wipe that Blackberry always had, and WM just got recently. Other than that, is there some other glaring lack of capabilities that I'm missing that makes the iPhone inappropriate for the corporate world?

EDIT: 2 years ago, 48-51% according to IDC and Gartner, as quoted by Forbes. Looking for more recent #s. http://www.forbes.com/technology/20..._0823lotus.html

Posted by: MetsFan46

I am looking for something to sync my calendar. I have a mac and there isn't a pda that will sync well with it. I don't want to activate it if all I really need is a calendar.

Posted by: nicxtk

I am in a company of a few hundred and many people had blackberrys and switched to iphones. I am in no way saying the iphone is better than a blackberry is but the iphone would deffinitly fit the bill in many corporate envirornments.

Posted by: Standog

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcharliemx

The iphone is more a pmp (personal media player) and i dont think it should ever be considered a pda

Why? It can do everything that my previous PDAs did and more. Email, Datebook, Internet, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesmac

The previous poster said it wasn't a PDA, a PDA isn't determined by whether or not a device has Exchange support, but by the applications. So when you add a third party company like Synchronica, which allows you to sync email, does this change things? Hmmm. I think you're a bit short sighted in your definition.

Basically, a PDA should have calendaring, notes, contacts, email (is not a requirement) as there have been and are many PDAs that couldn't do email, though they could sync contacts only.

Posted by: mib1800

I don't think Iphone can ever be a good PDA because it does NOT support multi-tasking. Only foreground process is executed while any background processes are put into a limbo (except the ipod music).

Posted by: sr1329

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickpaul2

Yes, the iPhone is indeed a PDA.
Can it keep contacts, a calendar, notes, and a to do list? If so, then it meets the criteria of a PDA.

ok mr exception to the rule...

The iPhone is not designed for mission critical corporate use. It is incompatible with most corporate infrastructures, and has many mission critical disabilities.

Many IT professionals are pulling their hair out because their Supervisors and such force them to try to get their iPhones to integrate with their current infrastructure. It is easy to tell most people "No" but it is more difficult to tell your CEO or supervisor "No".

Contacts, calendar and notes? Then my 4 year old Nokia 6230 would be a PDA as would pretty much any free after rebate phone. Oh, also it synced over Bluetooth like a champ and had e-mail support.

Posted by: toomer

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

I don't think Iphone can ever be a good PDA because it does NOT support multi-tasking. Only foreground process is executed while any background processes are put into a limbo (except the ipod music).

Oh my. And where exactly did you get that little gem of misinformation from? Because if you'd used the iPhone for even a few minutes, you'd realize how truly ridiculous that statement is. Heck, even if you hadn't used the phone, just knowing it's running OS X would make "it does NOT support multi-tasking" a really hard argument to sell.

I'd really enjoy seeing a link to someone who has actually tried to make that statement... or is that something you're just pulling out of thin air? Perhaps you should try reading up any of the first few links here to educate yourself further...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...G=Google+Search

Which might lead you here...

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=308322

or here...

http://www.operationgadget.com/2007...ltitasking.html

or, well, here on Apple.com itself...

http://www.apple.com/iphone/internet/
"iPhone is fully multi-tasking, so you can read a web page while downloading your email in the background over Wi-Fi or EDGE."

Posted by: mib1800

Quote:

Originally Posted by toomer

There were many things that was in SJ keynote that didnt really make to the iphone, isnt it? My statement was based on these user experience.

http://www.howardforums.com/showthr...ht=multitasking

and the following mobile-review.com review. (The site was DOS recently after this article was out):-

http://www.mobile-review.com/articl...e-name-en.shtml

Quote:

But it is not the worst thing. Today’s smartphones are characterized by a tiny feature that brings them together – multitasking. Even feature phones are coming to grips with it – platforms A100, A200 Sony Ericsson, Nokia S40 5th Edition FP2 (Q1, Q2, 2008) and later on – Motorola’s LJ.

The iPhone has not multitasking whatsoever, of course if you don’t count its ability to play music in background mode. In a word, you can’t handle your mail and organizer at the same time, switching between them, copying data from the latter and pasting it into letters, adding some notes etc. This means the iPhone doesn’t have to goods to allow you manage your time with ease. Instead of that, you are down to perform one task in one sitting. Is that bad? By no means, there is nothing to be ashamed of, many phones can’t do that either. So, we finally come to the verdict that the iPhone is not a smartphone but a feature phone remarkable solely for its touch-sensitive display.

Posted by: FlyPenFly

Actually I did get Exchange sync to work but not over Activesync.

Entourage can sync iCal and Addressbook with an Exchange server and in the latest patch does so very well.

There's also a simple apple script out there that will accept Outlook/Exchange meeting invites into iCal/Mail.

No, it's not a great Exchange solution but if you have a Mac it works pretty well.

NOw if they only gave us Wifi/Bluetooth sync support...

Posted by: JerryNY

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

I don't think Iphone can ever be a good PDA because it does NOT support multi-tasking. Only foreground process is executed while any background processes are put into a limbo (except the ipod music).

Where is this confirmed that the iPhone is treating running processes this way? I get email when I am surfing or doing other things so those processes are not put into limbo. So if Apple adds copy and paste the machine is suddenly multitasking? Even if what you post is true multitasking on handhelds is an illusion. On my desk I have four 3.0 GHz Xeon cores at my disposal. If I want to render something in FCP, edit out the commercial in an HD transport stream or even rip a DVD using handbrake I can still use the machine to write some emails or surf the web and post to this forum all while the machine stays nice and responsive. What exactly are you going to do on a handheld besides copy and then switch to another application and paste? That isn't multitasking that is serial task switching. The iPhone can switch between apps as fast as you can click the home button and jump to another. You'd better hope that Apple doesn't implement copy and paste because with the speed of the GUI and the relatively fast CPU in the iPhone it would be the king of this so-called multitasking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

There were many things that was in SJ keynote that didnt really make to the iphone, isnt it? My statement was based on these user experience.

What things did Jobs say that didn't make it into the phone? There were only two things I have noticed. They didn't include the clown fish wallpaper and it didn't end up with a Cingular logo in the upper left.

Posted by: mib1800

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryNY

Where is this confirmed that the iPhone is treating running processes this way? I get email when I am surfing or doing other things so those processes are not put into limbo.

Email/sms notification comes thru the gsm/edge stack. That's just a popup notification and may not have anything to do with email/sms program (i.e even if your email/sms prog is not started the notification still come thru).

But can the browser continues to load pages in the background while you are doing other stuff like PIMs? Or if you load up multi-pages in multi-tab, does all the pages load simultaneously or only the current active page is loaded.

Will you be able to start a new SMS while the current one is being send. From mobile-review.com review, you cannot do that. Or can you type a new email while the current one is being sent or new emails being retrieved?

Quote:

That isn't multitasking that is serial task switching. The iPhone can switch between apps as fast as you can click the home button and jump to another. You'd better hope that Apple doesn't implement copy and paste because with the speed of the GUI and the relatively fast CPU in the iPhone it would be the king of this so-called multitasking.

That's not the issue here. You can have many tasks opened at same time and ability to switch between them. For iphone, the cpu is fully dedicated to the current foreground task. That does not make it a true multi-tasking OS. Unlike WM/Symbian, Iphone OS behaves like Palm OS or Windows 3.1.

Posted by: cowboy1964

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

For iphone, the cpu is fully dedicated to the current foreground task.

Where did you find that info?

Posted by: FlyPenFly

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

That does not make it a true multi-tasking OS. Unlike WM/Symbian, Iphone OS behaves like Palm OS or Windows 3.1.

By this definition Symbian S60 isn't a true multitasking OS either. Have you ever even used Windows 3.1?

Besides, I've put "Mail" in the background and had it notify of emails and not through auto-check, that is it checked email while I went to a New Email screen.

Palm OS and the iPhone DO TASKS IN THE BACKGROUND. IT IS MULTI-TASKING.

PocketTune and the music function are BACKGROUND TASKS.

Posted by: DialekT

But those tasks dont count (or at least in my opinion). Its the other apps that really matter. Being on irc, while aiming/yahoo messaging/google talking, while listening to music, while browsing the web in multiple tabs and each page loading at the same time, and sending an sms and email

. Palm had that limitation of "suspending" applications when using something else. I use to really hate that. I hope something about this is untrue or else I could get that Centro Treo 800 or whatever Sprint has coming in October instead. I ditched my iphone but miss it truly for its multimedia capabilities. I'm on a lightning fast Blackberry Curve that does pretty much everything I need it to do. Just quite boring and small compared to the GIGANTIC iphone SEXYNESS SCREEN.

Posted by: FlyPenFly

I use an E61i daily also and I don't think you realize that S60 puts stuff on "Suspend". Actually on the N95 with 4mb less free ram on boot, it'll actually just quit. Try browsing around Hofo 3 or 4 links in, it'll die.

If you have an E90 or something else with 128mb of RAM from the factory (which the iPhone does come with), you can have those apps open without crashing.

But because S60V3 can't seem to handle memory fragmentation very well so eventually you'll need to reboot to have the same capacity as a clean boot.

Posted by: mib1800

S60/Symbian dont put tasks in suspend. Whether there is enough RAM to have many tasks opened at the same time is another matter all together.

Posted by: FlyPenFly

By suspend I meant it quits the app in the BG altogether but with most apps, if you reopen the app, it loads it from the last state.

Posted by: DialekT

I believe mib1800 to be completely correct about NOT placing apps in suspend. The E90 was robust in RAM so I never had any issues while keeping about 10+ apps open continuously. But anyhow.. I just want to find out more detail about the iPhone in terms of multitasking. For instance the web browser when you load multiple tabs. I noticed that some of the pages stay blank even though you have clearly visited certain sites within those tabs. But after returning to the home screen and you come back, the only page that stays open is the first initial tab. Has the update fixed the crashing of the ipod/music player while web browsing? haha.

Posted by: toomer

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

I can't even tell what you're saying any more, as I think you are desperately trying to still make your point - despite quite enough evidence that the phone does multitask.

If I leave my phone in the YouTube app overnight, and then check it in the morning, all my latest emails are downloaded, for all my accounts. Not just "notifications" (I don't even know what you mean by "notifications"). Fully downloaded emails, attachments and all. Why? Because the email app is constantly running in the background.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

But can the browser continues to load pages in the background while you are doing other stuff like PIMs?

Yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Or if you load up multi-pages in multi-tab, does all the pages load simultaneously

Yes. And if I start 4 tabbed pages loading, then go switch over into email to catch up on a few messages - when I go back to Safari they're all done loading.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Will you be able to start a new SMS while the current one is being send. From mobile-review.com review, you cannot do that.

Correct. But that is an issue of the interface design (if you had actually used an iPhone, you would know these things) that Apple followed when designing the SMS app. Ideal? No. But are you trying to infer from an UI design point in one app, that the entire phone OS is not multitasking? Hahahahaha.....

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Or can you type a new email while the current one is being sent or new emails being retrieved?

Yes. I do that one all the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

For iphone, the cpu is fully dedicated to the current foreground task.

Incorrect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Unlike WM/Symbian, Iphone OS behaves like Palm OS or Windows 3.1.

And wrong again.

Posted by: aristoBrat

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Or can you type a new email while the current one is being sent or new emails being retrieved?

With your obvious lack of knowing how the iPhone works, do you really feel comfortable making such strong assumptions about its multitasking abilities?

Posted by: sr1329

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyPenFly

Why not? On S60 you can have Symtorrent downloading bit torrent files while composing and sending e-mails or watching video or surfing the net all simultaneously.

Posted by: FlyPenFly

Quote:

Originally Posted by sr1329

Why not? On S60 you can have Symtorrent downloading bit torrent files while composing and sending e-mails or watching video or surfing the net all simultaneously.

The initial assertion was incorrect.

Quote:

Has the update fixed the crashing of the ipod/music player while web browsing? haha.

Not anymore than when my E61i does something even more retarded and closes the foreground task and quits the browser when out of memory.

Posted by: h0mi

Quote:

Originally Posted by wibrandy

What (and how) would you sync it with in windows? I mean, do I enter contact info in itunes?

Posted by: aristoBrat

You tell iTunes where you contacts are (Outlook/Outlook Express/Yahoo! address book) and if you have a calendar (Outlook) and it will sync them with your iPhone.

Posted by: parsec

Good grief people. I got so frustrated reading this thread that I couldn't finish it, so I appologize if this has already been pointed out. The OP didn't post to start some essoteric debate about whether the iPhone is a PDA or not. Did anyone bother to read beyond the topic? He's asking if he can activate the iPhone and use the non-phone features without signing up for service from AT&T. He even clarified in a later post that he just wants to sync his calander with OS X's iCal. The answer is yes. Check here.

As for everyone else, I don't know what to say. Some people just seem so eager to bash the iPhone that they'll do it in whatever thread they can. There are plenty of threads in this forum debating the merits of the iPhone. If you want to bash or defend it, do it there. Otherwise, answer the OP's original question and move on.

Posted by: jhollington

Agreed. It's also not really relevant to get into a hair-splitting semantic discussion about whether the iPhone is a "PDA" by definition or not. The real question is "Does it meet your needs for what you're trying to accomplish?"

While I won't argue the fact that the iPhone is technically a PDA within the principle of most definitions (semantics aside), there are a number of little annoying omissions that make it sub-par to many of the other PDA solutions out there. For me things like the lack of any kind of notes synchronization and the lack of any support for tasks probably enough to rule it out as a PDA for practical purposes (for my own needs). Couple this with the fact that e-mail support is limited to IMAP (hence problems with many Corporate firewalls) rules it out of many corporate environments as a mobile e-mail device, and not just those environments running Exchange.

The bottom line is that the iPhone was not designed primarily with the corporate user in mind. The independent business professional? Yes. The corporate user? Not really. Then again, this should come as no surprise from Apple, which has not traditionally been geared toward the Enterprise environment in the grander scheme of things.

As for the iPhone, though, it's really very disappointing, because what the iPhone does do, it does exceptionally well. It just doesn't do enough.... yet.

Posted by: manchuia

Quote:

Originally Posted by sr1329

Why not? On S60 you can have Symtorrent downloading bit torrent files while composing and sending e-mails or watching video or surfing the net all simultaneously.

That is assuming it doesn't run out of memory and close the application first..

Sorry .. I know OT .. but really just asking for it

Posted by: cowboy1964

Quote:

Originally Posted by sr1329

Why not? On S60 you can have Symtorrent downloading bit torrent files while composing and sending e-mails or watching video or surfing the net all simultaneously.

Good grief. Who wants to download bit torrents on a phone? Let alone on EDGE? Even if the phone can multitask it I can't compose an email, watch a video, and surf the net simultaneously. This thread is getting a bit ridiculous!

Posted by: MetsFan46

Quote:

Originally Posted by parsec

Good grief people. I got so frustrated reading this thread that I couldn't finish it, so I appologize if this has already been pointed out. The OP didn't post to start some essoteric debate about whether the iPhone is a PDA or not. Did anyone bother to read beyond the topic? He's asking if he can activate the iPhone and use the non-phone features without signing up for service from AT&T. He even clarified in a later post that he just wants to sync his calander with OS X's iCal. The answer is yes. Check here.

As for everyone else, I don't know what to say. Some people just seem so eager to bash the iPhone that they'll do it in whatever thread they can. There are plenty of threads in this forum debating the merits of the iPhone. If you want to bash or defend it, do it there. Otherwise, answer the OP's original question and move on.

The he is actually a she. And I was able to get it to work without activating w/ at&t. Thanks for all of the help.

Posted by: MetsFan46

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeeK.dLL

You can use this to unlock it so you can use it without activating it. It worked for me

http://www.pqdvd.net/iphone-unlock-toolkit.html

This does work!

Posted by: Shawn Parr

For the person who inquired about why the iPhone has notes when the Mac OS does not, this is a new feature that will be in Leopard. It is a new function in Mail.app, and for those curious why the Notes look so different than anything else on the phone (handwriting font, etc.), it looks exactly like that in Mail.app.

Since Leopard will also include a new ToDo system service with Mail.app able to handle ToDo features, and the Leopard team and iPhone teams were so closely intertwined, I'm curious if after Leopard ships there will be an iPhone update that adds ToDo functionality.