vB Easy Archive - Cingular Q1 Numbers are horrible. What a poor reflection on Stan Sigman

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Cingular Q1 Numbers are horrible. What a poor reflection on Stan Sigman
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Posted by: cellphonegal

189,000 new customers is laughable.
Verizon added net subs of 800,000 new customers
Nextel Added over 5-600,000 new customers.
AWE(AT&T) 283,000 Net revenue was 3.9 billion higher then numer 2 Cingular.
T Mobile next week.

While Cingular did not have a net loss this 1/4 their net adds are absolutly horrible compared to competition. JAX should be fired!

This is a reflection of the worst damn rate plans around. Cmon 50% more minutes but no night and weekends. HA HA. Who are they fooling?
Cingular is only service provider without Unlimited Night and weekends.
Cingular needs to get their head out of their butt and reorganize their rate plans.
I read their 50% more advertising and the ads are so confusing.
Too many choices.
They should give the night and weekends and choose between rollover, m2m and or 50% more minutes. Why should you have to pay for N/W minutes.
If you select the old plans you don't get enough competitive minutes compared to other carriers and you don't get unlimited night and weekends.
Helppppppppppppppppppppppppp Were confused!

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by cellphonegal

While Cingular did not have a net loss

which, at this time and place is a tad more important to overall corporate survival. If the company was to continue to bleed money there would be nothing for new subscribers to use

Posted by: unomeuhame

The plans here in CT are good I can`t complain, but the GSM service is BASURA...

Posted by: cellone1234

I thought for sure with the new plans they would have 500,000 new net ads.
I am a little surprised at the number. Analyst were looking for 250k net new subs.
These numbers still are not good enough for a future IPO. Considering other peerss had much larger numbers it will be tough for investment community to jump on Cingular bandwagon.
Results Results Results are whats demanded.
Stan has his work cut out for him. Peer performence is very important. When your number 2 and you only grow business by 189 k while number 1 grows business by 800k that is a problem.
Number had over 5 billion in revenue and number 3 had 3.9 billion revenue. Number 2 had 3.5 billion revenue.
Number 1 has 33 million subs
Number 2 has 22 million and
Number 3 has 21.5 million subs.
There is a true disconnect with number 2.

Number 2 needs to get down, get tough and get dirty.

Number 2 Cingular is still headed in wrong direction. Stan, and the rest of his gang want to make a lot of money. The only way they can accomplish making more money is to lay off more people, generate more revenue and give away the most amount
of minutes.
Stay Tuned this will get very interesting!

Posted by: sonichrome

Why hasnt it occured to people yet that not everyone wants unlimited nights and weekends ? I dont! Im glad Im not paying for something I dont use

Posted by: cellone1234

Only real way to make money if your Stan is to get this company puplic. IPO needs to happen. Stock Options etc.......
But how will Stan create shareholder equity?
Answer
Reduce SG&A--------------- Which means cut cost, expenses , employees and offer more minutes.
America has voted and no Cingular Employee Job is safe. I know this sounds mean but its reality.
Sales and General Administrative Expenses must come in line with the business plan.
Andy Wilson always says do more with less and he's right!

Posted by: cellone1234

Quote:

Originally posted by sonichrome
Why hasnt it occured to people yet that not everyone wants unlimited nights and weekends ? I dont! Im glad Im not paying for something I dont use

So on April 30th you join Verizon and good luck to you!
see you on the Verizon board............................................. .

Posted by: doclloyd

Quote:

Originally posted by cellone1234
I thought for sure with the new plans they would have 500,000 new net ads.
I am a little surprised at the number. Analyst were looking for 250k net new subs.
These numbers still are not good enough for a future IPO. Considering other peerss had much larger numbers it will be tough for investment community to jump on Cingular bandwagon.
Results Results Results are whats demanded.
Stan has his work cut out for him. Peer performence is very important. When your number 2 and you only grow business by 189 k while number 1 grows business by 800k that is a problem.
Number had over 5 billion in revenue and number 3 had 3.9 billion revenue. Number 2 had 3.5 billion revenue.
Number 1 has 33 million subs
Number 2 has 22 million and
Number 3 has 21.5 million subs.
There is a true disconnect with number 2.

Number 2 needs to get down, get tough and get dirty.

Number 2 Cingular is still headed in wrong direction. Stan, and the rest of his gang want to make a lot of money. The only way they can accomplish making more money is to lay off more people, generate more revenue and give away the most amount
of minutes.
Stay Tuned this will get very interesting!

How do you see this getting interesting? Know about some upcoming plans the rest of us would like to know?

While their subscriber add wasn't as good as desired, a plus is a good thing. How much longer will it be until subscribers adds aren't a good measure of growth because of market saturation? Maybe we're still not there yet...

What is everyone else doing right to have so many more people signing up with them and not with Cingular? Is it the mixed GSM/TDMA and possibly confusion in different rate plans, phones, coverage maps? Is it a lack of good phones? Is it really the rate plans? Is it CS, as discussed before (though I've had good experiences lately)?

We'll see if more minutes will be what draws people in... though more SMS and data plans would be helpful too (as a geek). :-)

Posted by: gsmornot

doclloyd,

To answer your question from my point of view..

Quote:

What is everyone else doing right to have so many more people signing up with them and not with Cingular? Is it the mixed GSM/TDMA and possibly confusion in different rate plans, phones, coverage maps? Is it a lack of good phones? Is it really the rate plans? Is it CS, as discussed before (though I've had good experiences lately)?

We'll see if more minutes will be what draws people in... though more SMS and data plans would be helpful too (as a geek). :-)

It is a little bit of all of that except for customer support. I have to say that Cingular has the best support staff I have dealt with. Other than that, everything just sort of stinks. I have been with Cingular (Bell South Mobility) since 94' and for the first time I feel like I am with the wrong company. The GSM service is going to be nice but I can't wait it out while they get their stuff together. I loose most of the calls I make and have to redial over and over to complete a call. If you depend on your phone for business you know this will not work. Signal wise, my TDMA phone had a much better signal and can't remember loosing a call unless it was really bad. One problem, the call quality was bad.

About the rate plans...I understand them very well. I can tell you exactly what you’re going to get without any confusion. They are so clear that I can see I pay too much for the minutes I get. Other carriers are just offering more for less. When you do, word gets around and most business is "word of mouth". Another point about subscribers....When you have one person in a multi-user family that makes the choice to stay or go you can loose 2,3,4, or maybe 5 subscribers at a time. Take my family for instance. I have two phones here, four at my parent’s house, and three at my in-laws. NO, not all the phones are mine but the reason they all have them with Cingular is me. That makes nine phones that may be leaving very soon for a better rate plan or plans.

To keep from rambling on any further, CS has been nothing but good. GSM service for the time being stinks in this area on my new phone and others that have GSM that I know. Calling plans are a big factor but mean nothing if the service stinks. I think it fair to pay more for better quality, who doesn’t? But how long will it take to get there?

Sorry for the long post and if you made it this far, you really have nothing to do. HA HA Just giving readers a hard time. Be Good

Posted by: bobolito

Some of you forget that we are in a recession and the wireless market is just about saturated, not to mention that the competition is extremely high. All these factors combined are not a good formula for good numbers with any company. Just look at Sprint reporting losses like crazy. In these times, there will necessarily be winners and losers.

Posted by: cheerioboy26

The US is not near saturation. According to CTIA, we're at about 50% penetration ( http://www.wow-com.com ) 144.8M users

Saturation would be some countries in Europe. 70-75%+, so to reach that level there are still millions more customers to go....

Posted by: roamer1

Quote:

Originally posted by doclloyd
What is everyone else doing right to have so many more people signing up with them and not with Cingular? Is it the mixed GSM/TDMA and possibly confusion in different rate plans, phones, coverage maps? Is it a lack of good phones? Is it really the rate plans? Is it CS, as discussed before (though I've had good experiences lately)?

Here's what I think Cingular's major problems are:

- Above all else, the GSM/TDMA split network and conversion and associated issues (SuperHome plans in new GSM markets not including all areas old TDMA local plans did, selling GSM-only phones in converted TDMA markets before the entire Cingular network and roaming partners in nearby markets are GSM -- IMO, Cingular should be selling GAIT phones exclusively right now, service quality issues caused by carving off TDMA bandwidth to provide for GSM, what seems to be a brute-force approach to "minimize roaming costs" at the expense of coverage, customer satisfaction, etc. [and Cingular still has never addressed quite longstanding issues with total lack of coverage/roaming in some rural areas -- Cingular still refuses to roam with certain carriers, particularly VZW, even if those carriers are the ONLY carriers in a given area])
- Phone-based data services that are all but a joke (atrociously poor selection of WAP content e.g. no "agreement" with AOL so no AIM/etc., ridiculously high rates for GPRS in GSM markets/being unable to GPRS roam in areas where Cingular roams on T-Mobile, virtually no Java phones/apps to be found, etc.)
- No "claim to fame"/poor marketing and innovation -- AT&T has mMode, VZW has "best network" and GIN, Nextel has DC, T-Mo and SPCS have camera phones, T-Mo has CZJ, SPCS has Vision - what in the world is Cingular's "claim to fame"? Rollover minutes it is NOT, IMO...
- A bad rap for CS -- but the major complaint seems to be almost always limited hours compared to other carriers, not ineffective/rude CSRs
- Lingering bad tastes in people's mouths in CA, southeast TN, and other areas where Cingular has been oversold and/or has had poor coverage

-SC

Posted by: JohnnyK

Well I can speak from experience. Around here, nobody (and I mean NOBODY) is getting Cingular.

Why?

Simple.

They have the smallest and most uninspiring lineup of tepid feature-poor phones of any carrier out there.

In my area, these bland phones must compete with:

-Sprint PCS, whose CDMA phones are always cutting edge...where they work

-Verizon, which, although it has a rather uninspiring phone lineup, offers extensive coverage and more feature-rich phones, even if they are bland.

-AT&T Wireless, which went from TDMA to GSM 9 months ago or so, and has been aggressively adding exciting new feature-rich phones to their lineup

-T-Mobile, with its unbeatable SMS plans, and wide variety of phones (also they have an established network of non-direct dealers who are at liberty to sell GSM phones beyond what T-Mobile itself has.

Yep, around here, Cingular is dead last. Their GSM system is up, though, so hopefully things will get better.

Wait, no, I'm a competitor! die, Cingular die!

Posted by: bobolito

As I said, 50% is near saturation because growth dramatically slows down....just read some experts articles. 70% is well into saturation.

Posted by: cellone1234

Othe ways to measure Cingular besides subscriber growth:

ARPU-Cingular $47 Lowest of all the majors Thats average revenue per user.............not a good number

Revenue-22.1 million subscribers 3.5 billion revenue
ATT- 21.5 million- 3.9 billion
Verizon 33.4 million- revenue 5.5 billion

Things will get interesting

Posted by: cellone1234

How does Cingular increase their Average Revenue per User?
Cingular is $47 average while AT&T is $58 and Verizon and Nextel are much higher.

$99 unlimited plan certainly would attract the high rollers.
In the low end arena Cingular has been most competitive on the $29.99 rate plan. Beyond 29.99 they are marginal fair.
Cellphonegal somewhat right about new plans. Cellphonegal basing opinion on Atlanta market would be correct about competition.
Atlanta offers 39.99 400 anytime with n/w and rollover or 600 50% more minutes and no n/w. Verizon and AT&T offer 600
anytime with unlimited night and weekends. No Cingular bargain there. CPN plans also at disadvantage against number 1 and 3 carriers.
49.99-AT&T offers 900 and Verizon 800 home while Cingular either gives 600 with N/W or 900 with nothing. Again CPN plans at similar disadvantage.
TMobile-3000 plan is a nice plan and popular

Now to Cingular benefit-their 69.99 and99.99 home and CPN plans are very competitive. However SPRINT has everyone beat with their plans and Vision deal.

Cingular biggest downfall is no real data and no coast to coast single network. GAIT phone are only solution and customers are not being enticed by their looks. Cingular truely needs to do an unlimited CPN plan and they will hit a home run and increase their
ARPU very quickly.
Otherwise:
No IPO and no big bucks for the employees. What Wall Street Firm would back this IPO.
Lowest ARPU among majors
Slowest Growth of new subs by the majors
Fragmented network of old TDMA and New GSM

Regarding saturation I disagree with Bobolito.

50% penetration leaves a lot of room for growth. Eventually many users will have two handsets. A data and communicator device provided by their employer. Totally used for business.
Then a personal handset for liesure lifestyle...family and fun

Also, 26% of all subscribers change their carrier affiliation every 18 months. 144 million subscibers.....Thats a lot of churning each year.

Posted by: bobolito

Another thing to consider is that Cingular is cheaper than Verizon, AT&T and Nextel. Maybe that's why their revenue is lower.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by cheerioboy26
The US is not near saturation. According to CTIA, we're at about 50% penetration ( http://www.wow-com.com ) 144.8M users Saturation would be some countries in Europe. 70-75%+, so to reach that level there are still millions more customers to go....

maybe - maybe not - I'm not so sure that Europe is a good model for US cellular phone penetration rates...

Take a look at Internet use as a model - it is far cheaper and easier than a cell phone (you can do it at your local library for no cost) yet 42% still don't use the Internet (see article below) and don't plan to...

that would imply that saturation for cell phones in the US is closer to 58%-60%, not the Euro figures in the 70's...

funny - no one here has said anything about a merger - with T-mobile or AT&T - both of whom have GSM upgrade paths as well...

---------------
washingtonpost.com
Many Americans Still Aren't Going Online, Survey Finds
By Ellen McCarthy
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, April 17, 2003; Page E05
Now that people can log on at work, at home, in coffee shops, in airports and even in public parks, the Internet seems like a pervasive, nearly seamless entity in most American lives.
Most, but certainly not all. Forty-two percent of Americans still don't use the Internet and the majority of them do not believe they ever will, according to a study released yesterday.
Missing out on the most popular movement of the 1990s didn't seem to bother the unwired survey respondents. More than half of nonusers said they don't want Internet access or don't need it, a study by the Pew Internet and American Life Project found.
It's not just a matter of not being able to afford a computer or a connection, although cost did play a role for about a third of the nonusers. What PC enthusiasts overlook, but skeptics don't, is the time it takes to learn to use these technological tools, and the fact that the technology is often frustrating. Those issues play a role in why the dramatic rate of growth in Internet use has flattened out since the end of 2001, the survey's author said.
"What we've seen since the end of 2001, is that net growth has really stalled," said Amanda Lenhart, principal author of the study. But the population of Net users is not static, with "people coming online and people dropping offline."
Half of the people not using the Internet are over 50 years old, Lenhart noted, while people enrolled as students are the group most likely to use the Net.
Internet use also continues to vary by race, income and education level, according to the Pew report. While only 40 percent of white Americans are nonusers, 55 percent of African Americans and 46 percent of English-speaking Hispanics are offline as well. Forty-one percent of nonusers have a yearly household income below $30,000 and a quarter of them did not graduate from high school. People living in rural areas and in the South are also less likely to go online.
Thirty percent of nonusers said the price of going online is a major reason for their abstention, and nearly as many said they don't have time or that the Internet is "too complicated and hard to understand." Fifty-two percent of this group said they simply don't want or don't need the Net. Nearly a quarter of nonusers said they have never tried going online and know few others who log on regularly.
"There will always be a certain portion of the population that doesn't see any need or any urgency to adopt new technologies -- or see any benefit of what those new technologies bring," said Daniel E. Hess, vice president of ComScore Networks Inc., a Reston-based research firm.
A fifth of nonusers live in houses that are connected to the Net. The study found that some of these people are intimidated by the technology and some live with people who monopolize the computer. Another group views their nonuse as a source of pride and "are delighted to reject such a popular technology," the report said.
Phone interviews with 3,553 people in the spring of 2002, along with group interviews conducted in the Washington and Baltimore areas, provide the basis for the report. The survey had margin of error of 2 percentage points.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by bobolito
Another thing to consider is that Cingular is cheaper than Verizon, AT&T and Nextel. Maybe that's why their revenue is lower.

...
Meanwhile, other cell-phone companies also posted positive results on two critical measures: higher revenues and decreased customer turnover.

AT&T Wireless, the third-largest carrier, said it earned $135 million (5 cents per share) on revenue that increased 9.3 percent, to $3.9 billion. The second-largest carrier, Cingular Wireless, reported that revenue increased slightly, to $3.6 billion, from $3.5 billion a year earlier. It said it reduced the rate of customer defections slightly, to 2.6 percent, from the previous quarter.

Earlier in the week, industry-leading Verizon Wireless announced a 14.8 percent boost in year-over-year revenue. Sprint PCS, the industry's No. 4 player, announced a 3.5 percent increase in revenue, to $2.9 billion, while reporting a loss of 18 cents per share.

Analysts say both Cingular and Verizon would post profits if their parent companies -- Cingular is owned by SBC Communications Inc. and BellSouth Corp.; Verizon by Verizon Communications Inc. and Vodafone Group -- reported the net income from their wireless divisions separately.

During the first three months of the year, companies stopped trying to compete by slashing prices, and focused on trying to keep existing customers by offering them better deals on handsets, said Craig Mallitz, an analyst with Legg Mason Wood Walker. (Both Mallitz and his firm own stock in Nextel.)

Later this year, however, the gears of the competitive machine are likely to start up again.

In November, federal regulators are scheduled to start requiring cell-phone companies to allow customers to keep their numbers when they switch carriers. That is expected to make life easier for users but harder for the cell-phone companies, which may have to spend more money to attract and retain customers.

In addition, the parent companies of Verizon and Cingular could turn up the heat by marketing bundled packages of local, long-distance and wireless service that could leave the others, who are not owned by local phone giants, at a disadvantage.

This is unlikely to have much effect on Nextel because it plans to stick to its business-customer niche, said Thomas Kelly, Nextel's executive vice president and chief operating officer. Between 130 million U.S. workers and a growing government business, "we have plenty of opportunities left," he said.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy...-2003Apr23.html

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Consultant: I read that article last week. I'm not sure you can draw too many similarities from it to cellular use. Cell phones are not nearly as potentially technically challenging as a computer ( a reason give in the article). Plus, a significant percentage (1/2!) of those people are in the older age brackets (and probably the same for cell phone-less people). And, the price of entry. You can get a cell plan for free. You can't get a computer for free (generally). Plus, Americans are addicted to monthly payments. They'll figure out a way to get something if they can justify the monthly expense. CAller ID, cable/satellite, bottled water, cell phones, etc.

Bobolito - not all carriers are having the growth problems (net subscribers) that Cingular is having. Verizon continues to fly, and TM has done very well in the last year as well. Nextel consistenly adds 400-500K every quarter. Yes, growth rates (as a percentage) are lower, but that's just the rule of big numbers. TM grew over 40% in 2002. Cingular's problem is that their offering is not compelling in a very competitive marketplace. As you said, "In these times, there will necessarily be winners and losers".

http://www.wow-com.com/images/surve...002_Slide_8.gif

96-97 25% growth 11M new subs
97-98 25% 14M
98-99 24% 17M
99-00 27% 23M
00-01 17% 19M
01-02 10% 12M

OK, if you'd like to propose nearing saturation, I won't argue that anymore

But there is still, in my estimation, about 40M more new subs to be had over the next couple of years to get to 70% penetration. The problem for other carriers is that TM and Verizon acquired about half of all new net subscribers (VZ about 3M and TM 2.9M)

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by cheerioboy26
Cell phones are not nearly as potentially technically challenging as a computer ( a reason give in the article).

Really?...that premise can be debated hotly - I would venture to say that the majority of cellular users don't use more than 10%-20% of the features in their phone - just like about only 40% of the features of any common word processing software are used...

Example: note that SMS hasn't really taken off in the States as it has in Europe..

also, in many European counties, historically land-line phone service was very bad (in many cases operated by a government entity), and cell phones were a substitute for that..hence the greater penetration statistics...

the only advantage in familiarity that cell phones have (over a computer) is that people are used to talking on the phone (basic use) - once you get beyond that - the similarities to computer/Internet use are very much there...

example - take a look at the statistics for all of Howard's forums here - about 20,000 participants - out of how many cellular users in the US and Canada? maybe 144MM + 30MM = 174,000,000?
...and this in one of the few places you can find out what's going on and coming down the road, cellular-wise...

I'll add another technology penetration statistic for you to consider - back in the mid-80's - once VCRs hit 60% penetration, a number of stores who built their business model on the continued growth of the VCR market (driving other electronics sales) then failed..VCR sales really slowed and began levelling off...even though almost 100% of the population has a television...

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Agree on feature percentage used. And that's why, in order to just get them to work as most people use cellphones - to make calls - all you have to do is dial and go. In that respect it's easier IMO. The only difference between what people already know (landline) is the lack of a dialtone.

SMS hasn't taken off b/c of the proliferation of mega buckets of minutes. Why spend time tapping out SMS when you can call for free!

According to this link, VCR penetration is at 98% (end of 2001). It didn't level off at or near 60%.

http://www.powerpackenterprises.com/marketing.html

. According to 2001 CEA data U.S. Household penetration of TVs is 98%, VCRs 94%, DVDs 15% and DTVs less than 3%.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by cheerioboy26
According to this link, VCR penetration is at 98% (end of 2001). It didn't level off at or near 60%.. According to 2001 CEA data U.S. Household penetration of TVs is 98%, VCRs 94%, DVDs 15% and DTVs less than 3%.

read the prior post carefully - the initial leveling off (meaning less than double-digit year-over-year growth) for VCRs was in the mid-80's - it took from then (or 1990 - see below) to 2001 to reach 94% - you have to go back and look at the historical absorption rate- not just the current level of market penetration.

"Actually, when household VCR ownership surpassed the 50% mark in 1990, the use of videocassettes became cost effective in comparison to traditional print direct mail since the opportunity to view the videocassette had greatly improved."
http://www.recordingmedia.org/news/...sConf11-30.html

So...sure, in 20 years, maybe everyone will have a cellular phone, too -unless another technology comes along to replace it - just as DVD is now replacing VCRs (I suspect much more than 15% - movie rental stores are dropping their cassette inventories for DVDs - big time) ...at a much more rapid absorption rate, which is typical for follow-on technology...the pattern of usage is established, just the enabling technology is changed...

Posted by: Jax

We are a recovering company. These numbers are light but are the beginning of a major turnaround.
If I told you we would add over 3 million customers this year you would think I was nuts.
How about if I told you we would add 7 million customers this year?\
What would you say then?

I know you would tell me to go borrow prozac from emag.

No more employee layoffs.

Were gonna do more advertising and a hell of a lot more more subscriber ads. Just wait. We will need every employee we have and thensome.
Stan is turning on the faucets.
Check out our new unlimited plans in Seattle. How many new customers would we get with $99 unlimited nationwide?
How about we launch some of these plans with 90% GSM completeion by Q4. You think a lot of users will port their number over to Cingular?

Were gonna own this marketplace.

Stan wants to be number 1. and I am going with him

Emag- get off the tower already.........I can't believe you have not changed the light bulb at the top. Hurry or the FCC is gonna fine our company. And quit yelling from the top of the tower " Can you hear me now"!

Posted by: Zackomatic

In a recent post, rocket scientist, bobolito said "As I said, 50% is near saturation because growth dramatically slows down....just read some experts articles. 70% is well into saturation."

Hopefully, bobolito will expound on his theories of "de-marketing" which he likes to talk about on other forums he plays on. This "theory" of his basically states that the last 2 quarters of 2002, when Crapular lost well over 100,000 subs PER quarter, this was due to a shrewd, planned and methodical effort by Crapular to SHRINK it's customer base. I guess the "plan" worked?? Now apparently, they have decided to "have" some growth in Q1 2003 and add 189,000 subs.

Here's the problem, lets assume they did in fact add this many new NET subs, it still doesn't make up for the NET loss of 200,000 subs in the last two quarters! By the figures posted in various industry newsletters, they are still DOWN something on the order of 40,000 subs!!

All this talk of saturation, explain then how ALL the other carriers added MORE net sub additions than Crapular! Hell even Nextel added more Subs!

Number portability is coming, and Crapular stands to lose the most! they will have churn numbers that will boggle the mind! All carriers will have slightly higher churn, but you can be sure that Crapular will beat em all in that dubious distinction.

Crapulars fountain of business accumen:

Posted by: Jax

ZAck there will be major churn.
What I can tell yyou about churn and some recent surveys is very interesting.
I cannot tell you who conducted the surveys or the actual results but I will say this:
The original two providers in every market who own the 800 certificates will be the benfactors of adding the most subs.
many who left for the new 1900 players when the CDEF players came to market will be leaving them and darting back to the 800 players.
Generally, they are looking for better coverage in their home areas.
Original BLS and SBC markets will do very well. West Coast Pac Bell markets may not fare as well. AT&T 800 markets will be benefactors.
Verizon 800 markets including the original Air Touch and GTE properties will do excellent.
The PCS Primco Cerizon properties will be hit hard.
SPRINT and TMO will take a hit.
Nextel had very interesting results. Their customers tend to be very loyal.
Crapular as you say actually will do very well. Number Portability will help them big time.
You see the New guys bought market share in the 90's with great rate plans. This ooccured at a time in the high flying 90's when consumers got very attached to their wireless numbers and by the time they realized their service sucked they were locked to their numbers and were willing to sacrafice call quality for number retention.
The studies show 800 players win and 1900 players use.

Hint Herschal Shoestack

Posted by: bobolito

Zacko, isn't it past your bedtime? I am gonna tell your mom how annoying you are.

Do you only come here to attack me? or to attack Cingular? Let me tell you, I am much more adult than you are about this. I don't care how much you bash Cingular (or Crapular as you like to call it) Just leave me, my comments and my name alone if you want some respect returned!

It's funny how you have to constantly use my name and my comments to your advantage. Thank you! It is normal for novice students to reference to comments from the experts in their learning path.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax
We are a recovering company.

Cingulars Anonymous? Do you have a 12-step program?

Stan wants to be number 1. and I am going with him

I think you and Stan are one in the same. Hi, Stan - get me a 6340i - will you? I've only been waiting 15 months!

Posted by: Jax

Quote:

Originally posted by Consultant
Cingulars Anonymous? Do you have a 12-step program?

Stan wants to be number 1. and I am going with him

I think you and Stan are one in the same. Hi, Stan - get me a 6340i - will you? I've only been waiting 15 months!

15 months for a 6340i.......................................lol

6340i is readily available

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax
15 months for a 6340i.......................................lol
6340i is readily available

wow - that was fast - you must cruise Howard's forums 7x24.

It (6340i) was announced in January 2002 - only available (in that it works) in the last few weeks - April, 2003. And I want one for $0 - like all those other wonderful phones - like the 1261.

So get going, Stan/Jax - get those free 6340is out there.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax
You see the New guys bought market share in the 90's with great rate plans. This ooccured at a time in the high flying 90's when consumers got very attached to their wireless numbers and by the time they realized their service sucked they were locked to their numbers and were willing to sacrafice call quality for number retention.

Interesting viewpoint - after November (when the FCC allows portability) we'll see if you're Nostradamus after all - at least on this topic.

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Consultant, my only point was that 50% is not saturated, nor in my opinion is it "near saturated". I wasn't saying that by the end of this year or next 70% of people will have a phone, or that 98% ever will. There is still significant net growth left for the industry. The industry will get to 70% in a few years. That's 40 million more subscribers. Right now, companies other than Cingular have been winning these subscribers.

Posted by: Jax

Pricing of 6340i is based on market needs. Some markets have offered the 6340i free after $50 rebate. Certain markets have an aggressive GAIT conversion program. Certain markets we have been giving the 6340i away because we have to have a certain amount of customers on GAIT before we can turn on GSM.
However, the recent shortage of 6340i's caused us to use the T62u. Those market s where we would have given them a free 6340i we are now substituting the T62u.
Check Miami. Had there been enough 6340is Miami would have continued with 6340i.
iF YOU DON'T LIKE THE OFFERING WHERE YOU LIVE MAYBE YOU MIGHT CONSIDER MOVING.
jUST KIDDING

Posted by: JohnnyK

I don't get the 1900mhz/800mhz thing.

Why would consumers demand 800mhz carriers?

Is the difference between 1900mhz and 800mhz building penetration really that much? And wouldn't the 1900ers do something to compensate for it?

Posted by: Jax

CHEERIBOY is 100 % accurate. Cingular has attraced the least number of available subscribers in the last few years. TMO certainly has bought marketshare with the 3000 minute regional plan.
AT&T took a lionshare of subscribers up until February with the 99.99 unlimited GSM program.
Nextel has signed up a nice share of customers with their 125 unlimited plan and free incoming at $50 price points.

Sprint certainly did a nice job with their handset mix and generous minutes.

Verizon- nice and steady and great marketing

But I think your going to see this change...................of course the
twin girls and their sister to sister calling have got to go........,.
I would prefer to see Charlies Angels or the Wrigly Chewing Gum Chicks on a shared plan commercial............
Just not the Dixie Chicks.........although rumor has it Road Whore is related to them

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax
Pricing of 6340i is based on market needs. Some markets have offered the 6340i free after $50 rebate. Certain markets have an aggressive GAIT conversion program. Certain markets we have been giving the 6340i away because we have to have a certain amount of customers on GAIT before we can turn on GSM.
However, the recent shortage of 6340i's caused us to use the T62u. Those market s where we would have given them a free 6340i we are now substituting the T62u.
Check Miami. Had there been enough 6340is Miami would have continued with 6340i.
iF YOU DON'T LIKE THE OFFERING WHERE YOU LIVE MAYBE YOU MIGHT CONSIDER MOVING.
jUST KIDDING

Yeah, I know you're kidding. Be nice to E*mag - only kidding...

OK, Nostradamus - look into your crystal ball for Boston - tell me, great Carnak - what do you see for the 6340i - rebate/promotion-wise? And throw in any known future offerings of Superhome plans while you're at it...

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by cheerioboy26
Consultant, my only point was that 50% is not saturated, nor in my opinion is it "near saturated". I wasn't saying that by the end of this year or next 70% of people will have a phone, or that 98% ever will. There is still significant net growth left for the industry. The industry will get to 70% in a few years. That's 40 million more subscribers. Right now, companies other than Cingular have been winning these subscribers.

perhaps so - on an incremental basis - but I think the next big industry event will be a merger (hint - GSM + GSM) - because once the infrastructure is built out - it's cheaper to buy an installed base rather that to engage in acquiring costly, marginal, "late adopters", as they are called...that's part of the reason, I suspect, that Cingular and AT&T agreed to build shared towers on 4,000 miles of rural interstate, etc - why re-inevnt the (cellular) wheel?

Posted by: Jax

So you want to know if Cingular will soak the market with Gait Phones in Boston............................................ ..........................
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Lets see..............In Philly they bought additional bandwidth and there was no need to soak the market with gait..............
florida................no extra bandwidth so a market soaking is needed............................................ .

Boston- Did they buy more bandwidth in Boston?

Now you have your answer

Boston will be similar to CT market........................

I can't comment much more on Boston..................theres issues
Good issues but thats all I'll say...........In a few weeks I will be enjoying some Legal Seafood and doing some Canolis at a special place in the city.
Maybe I will finally meet emag and I have a phone..........

Posted by: Jax

Quote:

Originally posted by Consultant
perhaps so - on an incremental basis - but I think the next big industry event will be a merger (hint - GSM + GSM) - because once the infrastructure is built out - it's cheaper to buy an installed base rather that to engage in acquiring costly, marginal, "late adopters", as they are called...that's part of the reason, I suspect, that Cingular and AT&T agreed to build shared towers on 4,000 miles of rural interstate, etc - why re-inevnt the (cellular) wheel?

AT&T and Cingular??????????????????????? Interesting
What will happen to TMOBILE? How would they compete?

What about AWE and Cingular Regulatory issues? I guess T Mobile would buy all the 1900 properties sold off by an ATT Cingular Merger.
What about South Florida where Cingular and AT&T are the 800
certificate owners...........Wow..............maybe Verizon would by
the 800 liscense and dump their 1900

Wow AT&T and Cingular............ChATChingular

Posted by: tylerdurden

Quote:

Originally posted by JohnnyK
I don't get the 1900mhz/800mhz thing.

Why would consumers demand 800mhz carriers?

More coverage. 800MHz licenses come with more requirements about percentage of land area in a given market that must have coverage. That's why you see so many 1900MHz carriers who only have coverage on major highways outside of urban areas.

Posted by: Zackomatic

in a recent fit of overeacting hysterics bobolito said:

"It's funny how you have to constantly use my name and my comments to your advantage"

In your most recent post you appoint yourself an "expert" using your own words, and then you make a statement like the above? The above quote of your's really says more than I could ever hope to, you may want to read before you hit that submit button.

See bobolito when someone engages in a debate, whether that is live or in a delayed, written forum like this, one does tend to use other's comment's against them, it's called a debating tactic. Perhaps you can look into these concepts and utilize them yourself. But i guess you'd rather engage in inane attempts at fourth grade banter.

In your post, you failed to respond to a single point I made in my post, where is all the rhetoric about "de-marketing" now? On the other forum you go on ad naseum about this pet concept. But on this forum not a word? Why is that? Could it be your notions are full of malarkey?

Maybe if you stomp your feet and stick out your bottom lip, I'll quit using your own arguments against you. Until then either respond to the posts and the arguments made therein or take your bat and ball and go home!

If you notice I engage you in your ARGUMENTS and terms of affection like Rocket Scientist is a characterization of your arguments, the fact you wish to take them personal and talk nonsense about people staying up past their bedtime and telling people's mommies, well you only show your low maturity level.

Now, if you can, address any of the comments I made in my post, try not to resort to "I know you are, what am I" if you can. I'm trying to maintain the small shred of respect I have for you, but it's waning fast under all this I'm rubber your glue, type stuff you are spouting

Posted by: KingOfBling

Quote:

They have the smallest and most uninspiring lineup of tepid feature-poor phones of any carrier out there.

Note that every person that gets wireless serivce doesnt want a $400 phone or a high tech phone,they just want something to make calls with and thats it.

Posted by: bobolito

Zacko, I do not respond to meaningless comments and immature opinions..... Like I said, it is well past your bedtime. Go and suck your thumb and quit bothering adults here. Kids should be sleeping by now.

By the way, you probably read this, but this is what people is saying at WirelessAdvisor about you:

"Thank you for banning him Bobolito...and hooray for email filters...I won't be hearing from him again."

"He was being a jacka$$."

"Can't blame you Bobolito for banning him, he was fricking rude to you."

Need I say more? I hope the moderators here realize who we're dealing with.

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Quote:

Originally posted by tylerdurden
More coverage. 800MHz licenses come with more requirements about percentage of land area in a given market that must have coverage. That's why you see so many 1900MHz carriers who only have coverage on major highways outside of urban areas.

Link, please.

1900-only carriers (TM and its predecessors, and Sprint) have only been providing service for about 7 years. 800 carriers are in many cases legacy analog carriers that have been around in some places since the mid 80s. Their networks have 15+ years of tower infrastructure etc already in place.

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Quote:

Originally posted by JohnnyK
Is the difference between 1900mhz and 800mhz building penetration really that much? And wouldn't the 1900ers do something to compensate for it?

It all depends on the quality of the network. In many cases, a well built 1900 network can be as effective as an 800 network. However, it takes more towers to achiece the same coverage density.

Posted by: emag*rad

Quote:

Originally posted by Consultant
Yeah, I know you're kidding. Be nice to E*mag - only kidding...

OK, Nostradamus - look into your crystal ball for Boston - tell me, great Carnak - what do you see for the 6340i - rebate/promotion-wise? And throw in any known future offerings of Superhome plans while you're at it...

Unless you really like the 6340i (it is a decent phone) - I'd wait another few months, by then all of MA and Southern NH (where Cingular has existing TDMA coverage) will have GSM coverage. At that point, you could use any GSM phone you'd like.

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by emag*rad
Unless you really like the 6340i (it is a decent phone) - I'd wait another few months, by then all of MA and Southern NH (where Cingular has existing TDMA coverage) will have GSM coverage. At that point, you could use any GSM phone you'd like.

well, I do like the features of the 6340i - it's a nice upgrade from my legagcy 6120 - especially the flexibility of both TDMA and GSM - and since I keep my phones longer than most - I'll wait a few more years before going "pure" GSM - I don't think the system build out is that mature nationally - yet. But I expect you to keep me posted on all the cellular Maseratis and Lamborghinis you get to play with...

Posted by: tylerdurden

Quote:

Originally posted by cheerioboy26
Link, please.

1900-only carriers (TM and its predecessors, and Sprint) have only been providing service for about 7 years. 800 carriers are in many cases legacy analog carriers that have been around in some places since the mid 80s. Their networks have 15+ years of tower infrastructure etc already in place.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/licensing/c...eq/summary.html

Do you seriously think 8 years from now (which would put them at the 15 year mark by your calculation) will actually deploy rural coverage on a widescale basis if they have no requirement to do so? There certainly isn't an economic inducement - deploy three, four or more times as many towers as you have now to cover an additional 10% of the population?

Compare:

Cingular Arkansas coverage (800MHz):
http://onlinestore.cingular.com/ima...as_03_06_03.gif

Sprint Arkansas coverage (1900MHz):
http://activate.sprintpcs.com/maps/...ttleRock_AR.gif

Nextel Arkansas coverage:
http://www.nextel.com/services/cove...mages/mkt68.gif

I would have included Alltel (800) and AT&T (1900) but they just show a map with the whole state "covered" and have a disclaimer that "actual coverage may vary."

Posted by: emag*rad

Quote:

Originally posted by Consultant
well, I do like the features of the 6340i - it's a nice upgrade from my legagcy 6120 - especially the flexibility of both TDMA and GSM - and since I keep my phones longer than most - I'll wait a few more years before going "pure" GSM - I don't think the system build out is that mature nationally - yet. But I expect you to keep me posted on all the cellular Maseratis and Lamborghinis you get to play with...

Like the new 3600 (850/1900 version of the 3650) I just received a 1/2 hour ago.

Posted by: 100thMonkey

Arggghhhh!!!!! If I only could have a lightening bolt in my avatar....would that help me to get cool phones??????????

Posted by: cheerioboy26

Quote:

Originally posted by tylerdurden
http://wireless.fcc.gov/licensing/c...eq/summary.html

Do you seriously think 8 years from now (which would put them at the 15 year mark by your calculation) will actually deploy rural coverage on a widescale basis if they have no requirement to do so? There certainly isn't an economic inducement - deploy three, four or more times as many towers as you have now to cover an additional 10% of the population?

I looked at the link you provided, the Cellular section in specific, and followed through and read the two sections referred - 22.946 and 22.947. I could not find a requirement to a specific amount of coverage. Perhaps I wasn't looking in the correct place. If so, I apologize. I know the PCS operators requirements are based on covered population, and I agree that they will only build out where it is financially in their interest to do so over and above their buildout requirements.

Posted by: RoadWhore

I am the new Cingular "Jax." You'll see me on the newest commercials. Introducing Road Whore for Divine Cingular Wireless.

Posted by: Zackomatic

Moderator Note: Edited fo trolling

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax
So you want to know if Cingular will soak the market with Gait Phones in Boston............................................ ..........................
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Lets see..............In Philly they bought additional bandwidth and there was no need to soak the market with gait..............
florida................no extra bandwidth so a market soaking is needed............................................ .
Boston- Did they buy more bandwidth in Boston?
Now you have your answer
Boston will be similar to CT market........................
I can't comment much more on Boston..................theres issues
Good issues but thats all I'll say...........In a few weeks I will be enjoying some Legal Seafood and doing some Canolis at a special place in the city.
Maybe I will finally meet emag and I have a phone..........

Hmmmm...

the 6340i is now (4/25) priced at (Cingular web site):

$19.99 = Boston (all Massachuestts) and all Connecticut
$29.99 = Orlando
$69.99 = Philly

seems to validate Nostradomus Jax -

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

"another few months" - does that mean when GSM is "switched on", then MA will have a Superhome Plan as does CT?

enquiring minds want to know...

Posted by: cellone1234

consultant............Jax as much as an asswhole we precieve, is providing accurate inside info.
Rate palns and promos are acurrately provided by Jax.
What else can we say?

Posted by: Zackomatic

Now that I have cleanly, clearly and with finality smacked down BOBO, time to get back to bidness, as it were. Regarding Crapular's Q1 "rebirth" here is a cut-n-paste from the CTIA industry newsletter....

"U.S. Wireless Firms Add Subscribers, But ARPU Declines
Competition among U.S. wireless carriers has resulted in falling prices for consumers, but that may not be good for the companies, analysts say. As the carriers battle for a share of a shrinking supply of available new customers, they are lowering rates, and turning to prepaid calling plans designed to attract teenagers and those with much less than the best credit. Cingular Wireless, for example, was able to turn around its sliding subscriber numbers, with prepaid customers an important component of the reversal. But such programs are leading to declines in carriers' Average Revenue Per User (ARPU), a key performance measure for wireless companies. Sprint PCS, Cingular, Nextel and Verizon Wireless all reported lower first quarter 2003 ARPU, compared with the fourth quarter of 2002. If the trend continues, it will affect revenue growth, an analyst said." (Source: CNN/Money)

I don't buy the concept of "shrinking" supply of new customer's not with the number of new add's that were posted by Verizon and Tmobile as an example, but the rest of the story seems pretty credible.

So the "key" to the Crapular sliding sub #'s is to grow the pre-paid business? I thought that this was just the type of consumer Crapular was trying to avoid? According to the eminent Bobo, this was the type of consumer(poor credit risk low ARPU) that Crapular PURPOSELY avoided as part of its "de-marketing" strategy. But contrary to that, this story indicates the exact OPPOSITE to be true. Crapular got many, if not the majority, of it's new add's via pre-paid?

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by Jax

However, the recent shortage of 6340i's caused us to use the T62u.

you are such a dunce! As I've said before the Nok was pulled back for issues and the t62 was subsituted. Guess you missed that martketing memo eh?

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

I can't comment much more on Boston..................theres issues
Good issues but thats all I'll say...........In a few weeks I will be enjoying some Legal Seafood and doing some Canolis at a special place in the city.
Maybe I will finally meet emag and I have a phone..........

c'mon down to Lowder, we'll treat you juuuuuuuuuuuust right. But as we know, you're full of h h h h HOT air. ppssssssss

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by emag*rad
Like the new 3600 (850/1900 version of the 3650) I just received a 1/2 hour ago.

you ******!

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by Zackomatic
Now that I have cleanly, clearly and with finality smacked down BOBO, time to get back to bidness, as it were. Regarding Crapular's Q1 "rebirth" here is a cut-n-paste from the CTIA industry newsletter....

"U.S. Wireless Firms Add Subscribers, But ARPU Declines
Competition among U.S. wireless carriers has resulted in falling prices for consumers, but that may not be good for the companies, analysts say. As the carriers battle for a share of a shrinking supply of available new customers, they are lowering rates, and turning to prepaid calling plans designed to attract teenagers and those
<snip>

not sure of the agenda you have chief, but take it elsewhere.

Posted by: Zackomatic

Uh, Mr. I have a phone(that's a really "cool" screen name btw)

My agenda is posting on the topic stated in the thread, using an industry newsletter to make a point.

apparently your agenda is your holy grail quest for some cheesy phone, which of course has nothing to do with the thread, which is: Cingular Q1 Numbers are horrible. What a poor reflection on Stan Sigman

If your having trouble following along, maybe someone could tutor you or something.

I didn't pull your chain, and if you wan't to tangle. bring it on, others have tried and ended up looking like fools.

Hope you find your little phone.

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by Zackomatic
Uh, Mr. I have a phone(that's a really "cool" screen name btw)

My agenda is posting on the topic stated in the thread, using an industry newsletter to make a point.

apparently your agenda is your holy grail quest for some cheesy phone, which of course has nothing to do with the thread, which is: Cingular Q1 Numbers are horrible. What a poor reflection on Stan Sigman

If your having trouble following along, maybe someone could tutor you or something.

I didn't pull your chain, and if you wan't to tangle. bring it on, others have tried and ended up looking like fools.

Hope you find your little phone.

oy vey! and after 15 more posts I wouldn't consider you a newbie, or a troll just trying to smear another user around..?? nah, I would. And I'd say the same thing. Take it elsewhere. Less I call the Man?

Posted by: Codepyro

The numbers weren't that bad...they beat expecations nad atleast not they are heading in the right direction...i actually thought cingular was going to loose cusomters again...but i guess i was wrong because cingular ended up with pretty good numbers..i think that they will be stronger next quater but i think they will loose thier position as #2 to att...

Posted by: tylerdurden

Quote:

Originally posted by I have a phone
you are such a dunce! As I've said before the Nok was pulled back for issues and the t62 was subsituted. Guess you missed that martketing memo eh?

What kind of issues? Aren't they still using the same firmware as before they were pulled? I really want this phone, but it was a little too buggy for me last time I tried it.

PS what's with all the attitude from the new guys around here lately? First the "RoadWhore" jerk and now this "Zackomatic" guy.

Posted by: Zackomatic

Quote:

Originally posted by tylerdurden
What kind of issues? Aren't they still using the same firmware as before they were pulled? I really want this phone, but it was a little too buggy for me last time I tried it.

PS what's with all the attitude from the new guys around here lately? First the "RoadWhore" jerk and now this "Zackomatic" guy.

Although I don't recall asking for your .02 cents, you certainly have the right to post whatever you want. But speaking of "attitude" apparently your under the misguided notion that only people who aren't "new" can have an opinion?

Are you another self-appointed arbiter? It is hilarious that some of you think there is some type of "pecking" order on these forums, I have 75 more posts than that dude, so when he disagrees with me or calls to question my assertions or whack statements I make, then that guy has "attitude"

Please, get a grip and try posting about the thread!

Posted by: bobolito

Everyone will see who's getting smacked down from this forum pretty soon. Your messages are the ones being deleted by the moderators.

Posted by: Airb330

Quote:

Originally posted by bobolito
Everyone will see who's getting smacked down from this forum pretty soon. Your messages are the ones being deleted by the moderators.

Yup, someone ban Zacko!

Posted by: tylerdurden

Quote:

Originally posted by Zackomatic
But speaking of "attitude" apparently your under the misguided notion that only people who aren't "new" can have an opinion?

There is a big difference between stating an opinion and being an *******. It has nothing to do with seniority. The way to get respect around here is to be respectful, answer questions when you can, and ask good questions when you don't know something.

Making as much noise as you have attracts plenty of attention, but not the "hey that guy is cool" type of attention that you are obviously desparate for but instead "gee that guy is pathetic" type of attention.

PLONK.

Posted by: bobolito

I don't think he'll be able to respond, tylerdurden

Posted by: I have a phone

Posted by: curtis_tom

PLEASE stop the trolling/flaming, or I will have to close this thread.

thanks

Posted by: Consultant

Quote:

Originally posted by curtis_tom
PLEASE stop the trolling/flaming, or I will have to close this thread.
thanks

last I checked (4/27) - 989 forum members checked this thread - which makes it one of the highest-ranking recent threads - why would you delete it just because of the actions of a few? Why not simply delete their non-conforming posts and also put them individually on notice?

Posted by: cellone9876

I don't get it. This is a great thread.

I think there is a lot of antagonism on this thread. Many things have gone further then just debates. Everyone should be cordial. No need to bash someone. Or belittle someone who post their opinion.

Posted by: LostTexan

Quote:

Originally posted by cellone9876
I don't get it. This is a great thread.

I think there is a lot of antagonism on this thread. Many things have gone further then just debates. Everyone should be cordial. No need to bash someone. Or belittle someone who post their opinion.

Interesting choice of names.

You wouldnt happen to be related to cellphonegal/Jax/cellone123/cellcingular now would you?

Posted by: bobolito

The good news is that the aggressor cannot respond anymore

There no more reason to be flaming....

Posted by: cellone9876

Interesting..................
I think not.................
but I do know two of those people...................
I know two of those people are not who you think

Posted by: bobolito

oh trust me, I know the whole story of this war. It didn't even start in this website. This is older than you think. I am sure everyone is glad he's gone from both websites.

Posted by: cellone9876

Whats the other website?

And yes I would like to hear the story.....

You have a PM

Posted by: I have a phone

Quote:

Originally posted by cellone9876
Whats the other website?

And yes I would like to hear the story.....

You have a PM

what's with the new username?

Posted by: emag*rad

Quote:

Originally posted by bobolito
oh trust me, I know the whole story of this war. It didn't even start in this website. This is older than you think. I am sure everyone is glad he's gone from both websites.

WA? According to Zackomatic, he was "surplussed". Not to condone his postings, but I think I know from where his attitude about Cingular derives...

Posted by: bobolito

I know where his attitude toward Cingular comes from a long time ago and I could care less what he thinks about the company. After all, everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion. However, his attitude towards some of us at the personal level in this forum and on WirelessAdvisor is the reason he got banned from both.

Posted by: emag*rad

Quote:

Originally posted by bobolito
I know where his attitude toward Cingular comes from a long time ago and I could care less what he thinks about the company. After all, everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion. However, his attitude towards some of us at the personal level in this forum and on WirelessAdvisor is the reason he got banned from both.

Roger that (no need for the personal attacks).

Posted by: cellone9876

How did Cellone1234 get lumped intot eh sensormatic or zacomatic deal. cause somehow you guys got cellone1234 banned from posting.

Posted by: cellone9876

Cellone1234 will be back somethime tonight.

Posted by: ASKJAX

Hey its nice to be back

I thing this name is appropriately stupid. Kind of a legacy of the past.

Posted by: I have a phone