vB Easy Archive - STILL waiting on 3G north of Sacramento, when AT&T, WHEN?

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STILL waiting on 3G north of Sacramento, when AT&T, WHEN?
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Posted by: ilvla2

Verizon has almost all of NorCal bathed in EVDO, but it's still EDGE only north of Sacramento, including Williams, Willows, Corning, Colusa, Red Bluff, Anderson, Redding, Oroville, Chico, Marysville and Yuba City, any idea if they'll have it up soon? Also, no 3G north of Santa Rosa (until you reach Edge's network), including Windsor, Healdsburg, Geyserville and Cloverdale, any update on those? (ALL of those areas have EVDO with Verizon).

I'm going over to Chico, Redding and Oroville on business Monday, and I'll have HSDPA on Edge's network in all the way from here in Redwood Valley to Clearlake Oaks, but once I come out of the coverage hole between Clearlake Oaks and Williams on Hwy.20 at Williams (a 35 mile hole, though it's for all carriers), it's EDGE only the rest of the way, yeesh AT&T, you let your own affiliate beat you to getting the rural areas covered

I have to admit, I am getting disappointed in AT&T's 3G expansion, though I guess it could be worse, I could be waiting on T-Mobile lol For now, broadband in those areas means finding a WiFi hotspot or using my Verizon EVDO.

Edit-Maybe I'll be surprised and find HSDPA over there on Monday, but probably not

Posted by: formercanuck

As usual, you seem to miss that many other places in Norcal (and even SoCal) do not have 3G either.

Grass Valley, Nevada City, Colfax, Placerville, Merced, Gorman in NorCal
anything between Morgan Hill in NorCal and San Luis Obispo in SLOCal.

The high desert in SoCal (outside of Palmdale/Lancaster) and the trek between Barstow and Las Vegas (HIGH traffic route)... you could add in El Centro and Twenty Nine Palms in there as well.

Personally, it doesn't bother me as long as I have decent quality coverage.

Posted by: ilvla2

I didn't miss them, if I was curious about them I would have listed them, I am just wondering about the areas I listed

I am interested in the area North of Sacramento (the Sacramento and Northern Sacramento Valley's), those areas you listed are east, south, southwest or northeast of Sacramento, which is why I didn't ask about their 3G status

I travel allover this part of the state on a regular basis, so I kinda know where everything is

I agree, good coverage is the main thing, but I would like to have some 3G from AT&T, working on the road it's nice to have

Posted by: ilvla2

Any ideas?

Posted by: yovinman

I have a place 25 miles north of Redding on Lake Shasta near I-5 and the best I have gotten was from enigma99 on this forum that Redding will be 3G (AT&T) later this year. Not much more specific than that. Hopefully that will include my place at Lakehead.

Posted by: ilvla2

I hope so too, it'd be nice having 3G when we work over in the valley, especially in Redding, Red Bluff, Colusa, Yuba City, Marysville, Chico and Oroville. I have it here in Mendocino County (Ukiah, Calpella, parts of Redwood Valley, Talmage) from Edge Wireless, as well as in Lake (Lakeport, Clearlake, Upper Lake, Lucerne, Clearlake Oaks) and Humboldt Counties (Fortuna, Eureka, Arcata, McKinleyville, Blue Lake), the merger of Edge into AT&T is moving right along as well, I hope AT&T keeps up the aggressive 3G rollout here that Edge Wireless has been doing.

Edit-I'm in Redwood Valley, about 8 miles north of Ukiah, it's still EDGE out where I live. Edge Wireless is still fine tuning their 3G, but it varies from UMTS/HSDPA to full HSPA.

Posted by: awj223

Quote:

Originally Posted by formercanuck

Grass Valley, Nevada City, Colfax, Placerville, Merced, Gorman in NorCal

Since when was Gorman in NorCal?

It might be in NorCal a few million years from now, as the North American plate moves northward and the rest of California shifts south. It will no doubt have some interesting views of the San Andreas Fault just up the hill as that happens.

Posted by: ilvla2

Quote:

Originally Posted by awj223

Lol I missed that one

Okay Canuck, we are going to have to get you some geography lessons

Actually, Merced really isn't NorCal either, it's Central California.

Posted by: ilvla2

So, any updates on the areas I mentioned getting 3G soon? I'm heading over to Redding for a night tomorrow, I suppose it'll be an EDGE only one with AT&T, thankfully I have free WiFi at the Best Western

I will have HSDPA from my home in Redwood Valley, through Mendocino and Lake Counties (with many EDGE only spots of course, it's not blanket HSDPA, yet), then when I come out of the 30 mile dead spot between Clearlake Oaks and Williams and hit the Sacramento Valley, EDGE only. Again, Verizon has solid EVDO from here to Redding now, I would like to see AT&T get on the ball in those areas too, I know they have the resources and money to do so.

Edit-I guess we lucked out being in a former Edge Wireless market, somehow I doubt we'd have 3G now if AT&T had built the network out.

Posted by: formercanuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilvla2

Lol I missed that one

Okay Canuck, we are going to have to get you some geography lessons

Actually, Merced really isn't NorCal either, it's Central California.

California's just such a small area that its easier to consider anything 'north' of Castaic on I-5 'Northern' California. Easier to consider it different, as the topology changes from baked Desert (ie. SoCal) to anything else.

Posted by: ilvla2

California small, now that's the first time I've heard that. It's a HUGE state, 770 miles long and 250 miles wide, take the train or drive the entire length, inland, on the coast and up the eastern edge of the Sierra, you'll begin to realize just how massive it is.

Well, I'm here at the Best Western in Redding and still no HSDPA/UMTS in Redding, or anywhere between here and Woodland in the valley, there is solid EVDO though.

Posted by: yovinman

I had a faint hope that AT&T would light up Redding with 3G with the new iPhone launch but now I doubt we'll see 3G from AT&T north of Sac. any time this year. EDGE really has embarassed AT&T with their fast and efficient 3G implementation. Not sure how AT&T is prioritizing their 3G rollout, but I would have thought Redding would have been live by now. I would have gone to Verizon right now if their EVDO went North of Redding, but sadly it doesn't. So here I sit with EDGE speeds for my Internet connection in Lakehead.

Posted by: formercanuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilvla2

California small, now that's the first time I've heard that. It's a HUGE state, 770 miles long and 250 miles wide, take the train or drive the entire length, inland, on the coast and up the eastern edge of the Sierra, you'll begin to realize just how massive it is.

Well, I'm here at the Best Western in Redding and still no HSDPA/UMTS in Redding, or anywhere between here and Woodland in the valley, there is solid EVDO though.

Just comparing it to Ontario/Quebec. I guess as far as states go, its one of the largest.
When I can cross SoCal in < 5 hours, it 'feels' small... possibly because SoCal is one large concrete jungle.
A trip from Windsor/Detroit to Toronto is ~5 hours... and that's only cutting across 1/2 of southern Ontario. It takes me 12 hours driving from Ottawa to White River... and there's still ~8 hours more driving before I'm in Manitoba - and that's the short way.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontario
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec

Posted by: awj223

Quote:

Originally Posted by formercanuck

You missed your opportunity to catch my typo. Gorman is south/west of the fault (barely), and is indeed moving north, because the Pacific plate is moving north and the rest of the state is moving south (along with the North American plate).

Posted by: formercanuck

Someday it'll be up there by the bay.

Posted by: ilvla2

That's true, Canada's Provinces are much bigger than our states, with the exception of Alaska which by itself is almost half the size of the entire lower 48.

Speaking of the San Andreas, it goes offshore southwest of me in Point Arena here in Mendocino County, and then disappears into the crust. Where it ends, you get-

"Mendocino Fracture Zone
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
The Mendocino Fracture Zone is a fracture zone and transform boundary off the coast of Cape Mendocino in far northern California. It runs westward from a triple junction with the San Andreas Fault and the Cascadia subduction zone to the southern end of the Gorda Ridge. It continues on west of its junction with the Gorda Ridge, as an inactive remnant section which extends for several hundred miles.

Technically, a fracture zone is not a transform fault, but in the case of the Mendocino, the term has been loosely applied to the active fault segment east of the Gorda Ridge as well as to the true fracture zone segment west of it. Many seismologists refer to the active segment as the Mendocino Fault or Mendocino fault zone. The fault section demarcates the boundary between the northwestward-moving Pacific Plate and the eastward-moving Gorda Plate. The Gorda Plate is subducting beneath the North American Plate just offshore of Cape Mendocino. Where the Mendocino Fault intersects the undersea trench of the subduction zone, it also meets the San Andreas Fault. This seismically active intersection is called a triple junction."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mendocino_Fracture_Zone

"The northern segment of the fault runs from Hollister, through the Santa Cruz Mountains, epicenter of the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake, then on up the San Francisco Peninsula, where it was first identified by Professor Lawson in 1895, then offshore at Pacifica at Mussel Rock. This is the approximate location of the epicenter of the 1906 San Francisco earthquake. The fault returns onshore at Bolinas Lagoon just north of Stinson Beach in Marin County. It returns underwater through the linear trough of Tomales Bay which separates the Point Reyes Peninsula from the mainland, returning onshore at Fort Ross. (In this region around the San Francisco Bay Area several significant "sister faults" run more-or-less parallel, and each of these can create significantly destructive earthquakes.) From Fort Ross the northern segment continues overland, forming in part a linear valley through which the Gualala River flows. It goes back offshore at Point Arena. After that, it runs underwater along the coast until it nears Cape Mendocino, where it begins to bend to the west, terminating at the Mendocino Triple Junction."

See what you two started?

Oh, and I still don't have my HSDPA in Redding, yeesh, all this work for naught

Posted by: awj223

Quote:

Originally Posted by formercanuck

Someday it'll be up there by the bay.

We're going to have some major problems because the license boundaries won't even align. Eventually, all the coastal CMAs will be split in two, which won't really be a problem, because AT&T will have all the A blocks and VZW all the B blocks...unless Cell One SLO refuses to sell out. Then it may find its territory literally split in two by plate tectonics

(I'm not sure if the fault runs along, or to the west, or east, of the CMA boundary though). One territory that will be split is Alltel's Imperial County, but that may be divested to AT&T anyway because of the VZW buyout.

Posted by: yovinman

Well, I have been waiting on AT&T for well over a year to implement 3G in Redding, CA and beyond and I have finally given up. This past 4th of July weekend was the straw that broke the camel's back. I've been plodding along here in the hills near Lakehead (25 miles North of Redding) with AT&T's Edge speed for my Internet access. My brother comes up and he brings along a Merlin card on Verizon and we plug it into my Top-Global Router and BAM! I'm getting like 500 Kbs download speeds. I speed test the AT&T AirLink 875 card I have and I'm at 58 Kbs download! Looks like Verizon now has EVDO going North of Redding. This wasn't the case over a year ago when I tested cards from AT&T, Verizon and Sprint. My brother let me borrow the card for a week and so far the speed has consistently been in the 400 - 500+ Kbs download range. Looks like I'll have to bite the bullet and pay to get out of the AT&T contract so I can now have somewhat decent Internet access. Not sure when AT&T will go 3G in these parts (if ever) but I am sick of waiting especially knowing I have a much better option available now at the same price. Not that they care, but AT&T just lost another customer for their mobile "broadband" service.

Posted by: ilvla2

I can't believe Redding is still without 3G from AT&T, when Verizon and Sprint both have it there. I bet we'd still be without it over here in the Ukiah area had it not been for Edge Wireless coming in here, we'll see how their expansion speed fares now that they have been absorbed into AT&T, but so far the Edge legacy seems to be living on here.

Edit-Other places in the Sacramento Valley that have 3G from CDMA providers but not AT&T (or T-Mobile)-Chico, Red Bluff, Anderson, Marysville, Yuba City, Oroville, Williams, Willows, Corning, Gridley and Colusa.

Posted by: KobesKD

Some People Don't Realize At&t Is Going To Put Up The 3g Towers Where It Is Most Economical For Them. For Instance Look At Most The Places Where It Is Now Is A) A Large City Where It Obviously Has Alot Of Customers And B) Where They Have Contracts With Big Businesses. They Havent Even Covered All The Cities With 100,000 Or More And Unless Any Of Those Towns Have A BIG BUSINESS THAT HAS A CONTRACT With At&t I Wouldnt Expect It Until They Get Caught Up. At the moment I dont think they are too worried about catching up to Verizon's 3G market, but trying to get their BIG customers a better network.

Posted by: zephxiii

Right, though now that most of the bigger cities are covered (with more dense cell site population), 3G expansion should accelerate, as it takes less sites to cover the smaller cities, and sites tend to cover more area.

Posted by: yovinman

Quote:

Originally Posted by KobesKD

Some People Don't Realize At&t Is Going To Put Up The 3g Towers Where It Is Most Economical For Them. For Instance Look At Most The Places Where It Is Now Is A) A Large City Where It Obviously Has Alot Of Customers And B) Where They Have Contracts With Big Businesses. They Havent Even Covered All The Cities With 100,000 Or More And Unless Any Of Those Towns Have A BIG BUSINESS THAT HAS A CONTRACT With At&t I Wouldnt Expect It Until They Get Caught Up. At the moment I dont think they are too worried about catching up to Verizon's 3G market, but trying to get their BIG customers a better network.

I would agree with this if it were even remotely true. Seriously, how can the the Big Island of Hawaii or Ukiah, CA have AT&T 3G but not a city like Redding, CA with a population of 100,000? I went into the AT&T store in Redding and they said 3G should be in Redding "sometime in the 1st half of 2009" (which almost always means June 30th, 2009). I then said you realize that Verizon and Sprint already have EVDO Rev. A in Redding and up I-5 to practically Oregon? And their response would be sad if it wasn't so laughable: "Well, we have the iPhone and they don't!" Which I then responded by saying who in Redding would be foolish enough to buy a 3G iPhone with a more expensive 3G data plan when they can't even use the 3G capabilities of the phone in this area for perhaps another year? Dumb looks then ensued with embarassing silence.

We will see how smug AT&T is with their "big" customers when the new iPhone sales suck due to AT&T's incompetence in deploying 3G. What can possibly be a higher priority for this company?

Posted by: ilvla2

Quote:

Originally Posted by yovinman

I would agree with this if it were even remotely true. Seriously, how can Ukiah, CA have AT&T 3G but not a city like Redding, CA with a population of 100,000? ?

One big reason, we lucked out-AT&T Affiliate Edge Wireless was the provider here until being bought out and absorbed into AT&T this Spring. Edge served only rural areas like mine, and smaller towns/cities in their market area (NorCal, Sou Ore, SE ID, W WY), and they were committed to giving us the best. AT&T is a mega huge corporation, and smaller, rural areas probably are way down on their list of important places

Thankfully, AT&T has kept the Edge committment alive here, and I think a lot of that is due to the fact that AT&T kept all the employees, stores, etc. that Edge had, basically changing only the name, plans, phone lineup, etc. We have EVDO up here from Verizon as well, in fact, it's pretty much solid EVDO now from the Bay to Eureka, AT&T's 3G ends at Santa Rosa, then doesn't come back until you get to Ukiah.

That said, from what I understand the upgrade from GSM to HSDPA is much more involved and much more costly, involving both hardware and software upgrades, whereas EVDO is just a software upgrade. Once HSDPA is up though, future upgrades will be done with software.

Edit-I'm very surprised AT&T hasn't deployed HSDPA in Chico either, I mean with Chico state and all those college kids, you'd think they'd have a goldmine. That's crazy if they don't deploy HSDPA in Redding until June of next year, I'd be curious to see what their deployement (or lack thereof)schedule is for Red Bluff, Oroville, Yuba City, Marysville, Chico and the rest of the Northern Sacramento Valley as well.

Posted by: formercanuck

There are some rural areas of California that AT&T deployed 3G.. Ridgecrest is one, having only 27,000 people.

Posted by: ilvla2

Ukiah's even smaller than that, 15,000, though when you add in the nearby areas of Redwood Valley, Calpella and Talmage it comes to around 30,000.

Posted by: yovinman

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilvla2

Ukiah's even smaller than that, 15,000, though when you add in the nearby areas of Redwood Valley, Calpella and Talmage it comes to around 30,000.

What really frosts me is how can EDGE Wireless with far less resources than AT&T drench their rural communities with 3G but AT&T can only light up New York and L.A. and then uses a dartboard to implement 3G in places like Charleston, WV and the Big Island leaving some major swatches of the United States with sizeable populations (i.e. the Central California Valley up to and including Redding) with a big 3G goose egg for another year? You better hope that now EDGE is a part of AT&T that they are not forced to turn off some of their 3G in Ukiah, etc. since it makes AT&T look really dumb for not having it in the Central Valley. Don't laugh, that's how companies this big and stupid think!

Posted by: ilvla2

Quote:

Originally Posted by yovinman

You better hope that now Edge is a part of AT&T that they are not forced to turn off some of their 3G in Ukiah, etc. since it makes AT&T look really dumb for not having it in the Central Valley. Don't laugh, that's how companies this big and stupid think!

That's not going to happen, trust me on that one

Edge has always been part of AT&T though, AT&T had a 40% interest in them, with the remaining 60% being privately held, Wayne Perry and Donnie Castleman just sold out the 60% to AT&T. Wayne and Donnie are both ex-AT&T Wireless Execs, and formed Edge in partnership with AT&T Wireless in 1999, so they have a good amount influence with Big Blue.

Edit-About Wayne Perry- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayne_M._Perry

Posted by: formercanuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by yovinman

The central valley had 3G before L.A. did. Most of California (except Tahoe) on AT&T Mobility had 3G before L.A. did... Eg. Bakersfield, Fresno, Modesto, Stockton, Sacramento, Davis, Vacaville, Fairfield.
AT&T (Wireless) originally deployed 3G in San Francisco and San Diego... is wasn't until a year ago that parts of SoCal outside of San Diego had anything, and its still sketchy.
Don't forget, AT&T has +3000 sites in SoCal.