vB Easy Archive - iPhone 3G vs N95 8GB?

Pages: 1 2 3

iPhone 3G vs N95 8GB?
(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

Posted by: mobileobsession

The N96 is more of an evolutionary update over the N95, more curves, and better memory capacity (16GB) + the flexibility of a microSDHC slot.

It still has the same 5MP camera quality, non-xenon flash, the same QVGA screen resolution and it's still doesn't naitively include all the available 3G bands.

Still, I'd hold out for a NAM version of the N96 over buying a NAM N95-3 or 4, just for the combined capacity and the flexibility of the microSDHC slot. It's basically what the N95 8GB should have been, but Nokia still needs to make a flagship that will blow everything else out of the water.

I'm talking about VGA or better screen resolution, HD quality (720p or better) video, Xenon Flash, finally including compatibility for all the major 3G bands and having S60 touch screen functionality

Posted by: jose1983

Quote:

Originally Posted by mobileobsession

The N96 is more of an evolutionary update over the N95, more curves, and better memory capacity (16GB) + the flexibility of a microSDHC slot.

It still has the same 5MP camera quality, non-xenon flash, the same QVGA screen resolution and it's still doesn't naitively include all the available 3G bands.

Still, I'd hold out for a NAM version of the N96 over buying a NAM N95-3 or 4, just for the combined capacity and the flexibility of the microSDHC slot. It's basically what the N95 8GB should have been, but Nokia still needs to make a flagship that will blow everything else out of the water.

I'm talking about VGA or better screen resolution, HD quality (720p or better) video, Xenon Flash, finally including compatibility for all the major 3G bands and having S60 touch screen functionality

i agree but i dont think its worth spending 1,000 bucks if u have a n95. maybe if u dont have an N series i wouldnt mind. but me as a n82 user all i see its a more memory and t.v thats all. I will be waiting for something exciting coming up. maybe next year.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

You'd be taken more seriously if all your additions weren't completely wrong. OS X is antiquated being based of BSD which is older than Symbian. S60 can run desktop quality apps, Since 3rd edition it supports multiple resolutions and you've apparently been living under a rock to have missed S60's upcoming touch support. Not that it's really a big deal given that a touch screen is only valid as a supplementary interface, not a primary one.

Now OSX is older than Symbian.

Since BSD is older than Symbian. I got news for you, BSD is not OSX. Not even close.

"You haven't seen 3rd party apps for S60. Since S60 has multitasking support they're completely valid to bring in for stuff like this. Since the iPhone doesn't, 3rd party software doesn't help it."

First, you make the mistake since Apple limited what multi-tasking that can be done on OSX on the iphone does not multi-task or is limited by the OS overall in some way shape or form. That is not the case, limited multi-tasking by 'Choice' by Apple has nothing to do with OSX being able to multi-task. OSX on the desktop multi-tasks just fine. If Apple lifted those limitations, this would not even been a issue.

You assume alot. I have been using Symbian since it's inception, before it was even called "Symbian". Please tell me how I am "wrong' with "facts' not your "opinion'. Everything I am saying on this forum I have backed up with facts, not my opinion. Everything can be verified. Go look it up if I am so wrong and come back here and prove I am wrong, go ahead I will wait.

And no Symbian "does not run desktop quality apps'. Sorry. In order to run desktop quality apps you need to run a OS similar to a "desktop". Symbian shares nothing with a desktop OS. Nothing at all. You fail to counter any of my points with facts. Please come up with something better. How about some facts to support your claims. I am not the one comparing OSX to Symbian, you Nokia "fanboys' are doing that.

There is really no comparison to be made. None at all. I have made my point, to a "T". Until you come up with something better, I am not even going to waste my time on your "opinions'.

Posted by: RogerPodacter

you cant say OSX is artificially limited to multitasking is the same as an OS that can multitask, because for all we know, OSX is not capable of it, and maybe thats why they limited it in the first place. or maybe the resources arent there and it would just constantly crash.

Posted by: Silent Witness

Japanese company Tonchidot makers of iPhone Applications have come out with a Social Tagging Device that tags a point in the real world using any or all of the media resources.

The good folks at Tonchidot can put it in to better words than me so i’ve relied on them for the overview “What is “Sekai camera”? This means a world camera. You can download information straight from the internet on your iPhone. We use iPhone applications for this service. When you reach the area you only see through the area of the view on your iPhone. Then you will meet much information by your iPhone. You do not need search yourself the information will come to you very natural way. ” - Tonchidot

http://neilduckett.com/sekai-camera...ion-for-iphone/

Posted by: JoeyDee

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

Now OSX is older than Symbian.

WOW, can you stop? I like the iPhone, but I didn't buy one after playing with one for sevral days before it feels way too crippled... not to mention i got bored. ANYWAYS, can you stop talking about how great mobile osx is, and how it CAN multitask but apple prevents it by choice?

When it comes to features of a phone, the only features you can compare are out of the box features allowed by the manufacturer. You can't go into the 'what if' user modifications, or the jailbreaking, or the 'it CAN, but xxx doesn't let it.'

For example, if you buy a car, that CAN go 150mph, but the car company electronicly limits its max speed to 100mph, your cars top speed is 100mph... not 150mph. YES, you can find ways to bypass that, but it voids your warrenty and its not as the manufacuer intended (jailbreaking).

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by jose1983

i agree but i don't think its worth spending 1,000 bucks if u have a n95. maybe if u don't have an N series i wouldn't mind. but me as a n82 user all i see its a more memory and t.v that's all. I will be waiting for something exciting coming up. maybe next year.

You have to admit though the memory is substantial, 16GB onboard + 8GB (or more once larger microSDHC cards come out). For those who keep, say a library of mobile videos, there is now plenty to room to do so and you don't have to worry about slow USB transfers, just upload straight to the microSDHC card.

I know what you mean though, the N96 is going to be pricey at launch, I would probably wait a bit until the first price drop. If a NAM version of the N82 ever came out, however I'd be instantly sold.

Posted by: jose1983

Quote:

Originally Posted by mobileobsession

ohh hell yeah i agree if the price drop on the n96 and has t-mobile 3g i wouldnt mind spending the money. but maybe n96 will be like the n95 it will pick up sales slowly then become the best phone out there. but im not sure since companies are really picking up fast. like samsung and the innov8, HTC with the android. blackberry bold,motorola and the kodak phone,lg and the viewty 2. like companies are now really steping it up and makes a n96 less attractive. but im pretty sure nokia got something under the sleves that dont wanna tell us

Posted by: aznboix

i would pick nokia N series. Especially n95 8gb. Touch screen is cool, but how about when you drive? u can't dial cox the screen is flat, where n95, there is keypad. n95, there is plenty of FREAKING GOOD softwares! n95, there is a built-in gps receiver where iphone doesn't.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeyDee

No one cares about if you got bored with your imaginary iphone Joey. Or if it felt crippled or not. The iphone multi-tasks just fine. Out of the box over eight million iphone users are quite happy "out of the box'. No need to jail break because the apps I am talking about can be had at the app store. I am not talking about "what if's. If your comparing OS's and saying that one OS doesn't do this or that, when in actuality it does.

If I am not mistaken, this thread was about the N95 or the iphone. I am not comparing OS"s just stating facts. The OS"s are not even comparable. Really.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

you cant say OSX is artificially limited to multitasking is the same as an OS that can multitask, because for all we know, OSX is not capable of it, and maybe thats why they limited it in the first place. or maybe the resources arent there and it would just constantly crash.

I have OSX running on a mac right now and I can multi-task just fine. Are you kidding roger? Check the last keynote, they explain why they limited multi-tasking, if you believe them. I feel that is the price you pay by trying to put OSX on a mobile, they say otherwise. They have to in my opinion limit multi=tasking just so the OS can run. As faster processors and memory are no longer a issue, that will most likely go away, until then, Apple is full of it.

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

The OSX on the mac and the iphone/itouch are still two separate versions. They may share some common code, but the implementation is totally different. For instance, you can't load say the full version of the iLife suite or Office for Mac on the iPhone, even if you jailbreak it, its still not possible.

On the same token you can't do multi touch on any mac screen, at least not yet. An iPhone emulator may come up for the mac and even for windows, but an iphone application conversely will NOT run natively on a full version of OSX.

In the future maybe, but for now you simply can't really assert that the OSX found in the macs and the OSX found in the iPhone/iTouch are the same OSX, because in the practical sense they are not. There are too many limitations put in place by Apple to make the mobile and the full OSX truly cross-functional.

Posted by: RogerPodacter

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

seriously, what are we in 1st grade arguing here? OSX on the iphone is a stripped down version and its not the same, and the resources are not the same. i didnt watch the keynote or dont remember the reason that they gave. but i'm just saying they limited multi tasking probably for a reason of stability, which means the OS cant multitask.

Posted by: huntm856

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

seriously, what are we in 1st grade arguing here?

I must say I admire you guys' perseverance.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mobileobsession

Actually that is not true. OSX on the iphone and OSX on the mac is the same except for the GUI. That's it. That is the only difference. Watch the keynote and talk to any OSX developer. OSX on the iphone uses the same API"s and Frameworks as OSX on the Mac(XCode). That would not be possible if they were not the same. When hiring for a OSX developer, a company hires a OSX/Iphone developer. Since they use the same development tools to create applications.

There is no speculation as to what is running on the iphone. Apple has explained in "detail' what is running on the iphone.

Iphone OSX:

4.Cocoa Touch
3.Media
2.Core Services
1.OS X Kernel

Mac OSX:
4.Cocoa
3.Media
2.Core Services
1.OS X Kernel

Those are the differences. Thats it. The GUI is different because your using a touch screen instead of a keyboard and mouse and monitor. No printer drivers, etc. The GUI is the largest part of any OS. Takes up the bulk of the OS. The Iphone OS doesn't need all that extra bulk because it doesn't have the hardware for it.

Applications running OSX on the Mac that are transferred to the iphone will have all the functionality of the Mac save for the way you interact with that said application. Mouse and keyboard as opposed to touch.

Omnifocus running on the Mac was ported to the Iphone. The iphone version does everything the Mac version does, the only difference is the way you "interact' with the application, touch as opposed to mouse and keyboard. Actually Omnifocus in my opinion is better on the Iphone because it allows you to use GPS, something missing on the Mac version. So actually the Iphone is better.

http://www.omnigroup.com/applications/omnifocus/
http://www.omnigroup.com/applications/omnifocus/iphone/

Now I admit that this application is not complex. But as time goes on more and more complex applications that run on the Mac and even PC's will run on the iphone. Here is one such app. Earthscape is similar to Google earth, a complex application. It runs on the iphone. No other mobile device runs this application, because they can't do it. No smartphone OS will run this app. This is also coming out for Android. Why do you think that is? Android is similar to OSX on the iphone in that it runs a mobilized version of a full OS. Symbian,WM,Blackberry with a touchscreen will not and cannot run this application.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Q1N...feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gyhy...feature=related

Earthscape is running on the PC and Mac. This is a powerful and Complex application.

Applications have already been taken from the iphone to the Mac. "Core Animation" was developed for the iphone using the Iphones development tools (Xcode) and transferred to the Mac. I have said this previously. It is more impressively a "API' (application programming interface)not just any Application.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_Animation

You also have to remember that any limitations the OSX on the iphone has, it is 'self imposed' limitations. It can Copy and Paste, MMS, etc. It is capable of those functions. Apple chose to omit them. They can be added at any time, whenever they feel it fits their business model. Symbian,WM,Blackberry cannot just "run desktop quality' applications from a PC. Because it shares no "development tools' to create applications like a PC. You cannot turn a Golf cart into a Car. Not possible.

You have to remember that OSX on the Iphone is a "new' OS for a mobile. Still in it's infancy. Apple is looking out for their 'bottom line'. MMS, File sharing, Stereo Bluetooth etc. will have a effect on their bottom line finances. Think about that for a moment. Apple likes to "control' you. Control what you spend and how you spend it, and how and what you can and cannot do with your device. Copy and Paste is a mystery to me why they omit it. Your guess is as good as mine. As the competition "heats up' over time, Android, WM7, and either Symbian retooled or OS 2008 will bring a "proper touch OS to the forefront. Nokia will not sit on thier hands lying down and do nothing. The UI on Android is every bit as impressive as the UI on the iphone.

There is a reason they bought all the shares of Symbian, it is totally going to be revamped and redone. Totally new OS coming in the next two years.

Nokia has to rethink the US market. Symbian is falling, "now".
http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/09/0...eat-symbian-os/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/0...iphone_mystery/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/0...rew_on_symbian/
http://www.forbes.com/2008/06/24/no...4markets15.html

OSX on the iphone and Symbian,WM,Blackberry, are nothing alike, in any way shape or form. Totally different.

By the way, the Mac Air uses multi-touch. It is a Mac.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

Not arguing, this is a discussion thread. See my post above. And your right, they did limit multi-tasking for stability, that does not mean it cannot multi-task. Limiting something and not being able to do something are two different things. In time, as memory and processors are no longer a issue, multi-tasking will no longer be a issue.

Posted by: huntm856

When an iPhone is released that does all the things you keep going on about, you'll have an argument.

The iPhone could be technically capable of placing phone calls into the future, or the transmutation of lead into gold, but unless those capabilities were realized in an actual released device, we'd all still have to guess at tomorrow's lotto numbers, and the price of gold wouldn't fall through the floor.

So unless and until there is an iPhone model, real, in production, and in people's hands, that can actually *do* the things you insist it is technically capable of, the iPhone will remain, in comparison to a real smartphone, a crippled, functionally deficient device with a pretty screen.

And no amount of talking about the OS's inherent capabilities is going to change this fact.

It may be in a year, or two, or five, that Apple's devices are far and away the most amazing, capable devices on the market. It may be that Apple never frees the device and it remains crippled in comparison to other devices for the foreseeable future. I don't know what will happen, and neither do you. This being the case, all this talk about the OS's capability is interesting, I suppose, but in my opinion rather irrelevant.

People don't use potential, they use devices.

Posted by: migo

Even then it won't matter, because a lot of people will refuse to use an Apple product because it means being part of a user community of idiots.

Posted by: GVRD777

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

Even then it won't matter, because a lot of people will refuse to use an Apple product because it means being part of a user community of idiots.

Posted by: RogerPodacter

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

but doesnt that mean that if they had to limit it for stability, then that OS is not able capable of multi tasking?

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by huntm856

When an iPhone is released that does all the things you keep going on about, you'll have an argument.

The iPhone could be technically capable of placing phone calls into the future, or the transmutation of lead into gold, but unless those capabilities were realized in an actual released device, we'd all still have to guess at tomorrow's lotto numbers, and the price of gold wouldn't fall through the floor.

So unless and until there is an iPhone model, real, in production, and in people's hands, that can actually *do* the things you insist it is technically capable of, the iPhone will remain, in comparison to a real smartphone, a crippled, functionally deficient device with a pretty screen.

And no amount of talking about the OS's inherent capabilities is going to change this fact.

It may be in a year, or two, or five, that Apple's devices are far and away the most amazing, capable devices on the market. It may be that Apple never frees the device and it remains crippled in comparison to other devices for the foreseeable future. I don't know what will happen, and neither do you. This being the case, all this talk about the OS's capability is interesting, I suppose, but in my opinion rather irrelevant.

People don't use potential, they use devices.

I agree. Everything I am talking about the iphone can do "now'. Not potentially do it. Other than multi-tasking, copy and paste, everything I am talking about the iphone can do now. My point is that the OS can do everything that Apple "omitted". They omitted them for business purposes(to control how you use your device for profit), Multi-tasking to make the phone more stable. OSX was never meant to run on a mobile device, they made it fit.

Your right in that Apple is greedy corporation, want to control you and they are crippling their own device. But Copy and paste, MMS, etc. is not a big deal to the mass public, HoFo yes, but we are not the general public who wouldn't know Copy and Paste from a MMS message.

Just because they omitted something, does not mean the OS is incapable of it. They can add those functions tomorrow save for full multi-tasking. WM, Symbian, Blackberry can just "add' what the iphone can do, they would have to rewrite their whole OS. That is the difference. Microsoft,Symbian, Palm are doing just that.

Android, revamped Symbian or OS 2008, LinMo, Palms "Nova' OS, WM7, will force Apple to compete. Right now they have no competition for people looking for a comparable UI and OS. HTC touch diamond is impressive, Xperia is impressive, but even they cannot touch the UI on the iphone. Android is the only UI pared with a OS that can compete that I have seen to date, I think that the Nokia N810 is also close but that is not really a "smartphone' yet. That may change in the near future.

Don't even mention Blackberry, did you see the latest video?

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

but doesnt that mean that if they had to limit it for stability, then that OS is not able capable of multi tasking?

No it's stable. It does multi-task. But it is limited. Since you can switch from application to application in seconds, I don't think this is even a issue. Listening to music while download a app is multi-tasking. I can download a app, talk on the phone on speaker and surf on Safari at the same time, so it can multi-task.

Symbian is better than the iphone at multi-tasking since it was designed with multi-tasking in mind because when EPOC 32(Symbian) was released hardware requirements were very small, hence the need to have a OS that multi-tasked very, very well to preserve memory and processor speed.

Symbian has what is called "pre-emptive multitasking". Symbian temporarily pauses a task being carried out by requiring its cooperation, and with the ability of resuming the task at a later time. It switchs apps on and off so to speak. This is carried out by a privileged task or part of a system known as a preemptive scheduler, which has the power to pause, or interrupt, and later resume, other tasks in the system.

I would say right now Symbian multi-tasks better than any other smartphone OS out there right now. And that includes OSX on the iphone, WM, Blackberry, etc. This is why Nokia phones don't really need 600mhz plus processors because Symbian is so effective at multi-tasking. Does that 350mhz processor slow you down, no it does not, if you ever wondered the reason why, Symbian is the reason why.

Posted by: huntm856

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

Just because they omitted something, does not mean the OS is incapable of it. They can add those functions tomorrow save for full multi-tasking. WM, Symbian, Blackberry can just "add' what the iphone can do, they would have to rewrite their whole OS. That is the difference. Microsoft,Symbian, Palm are doing just that.

I don't know very much about software engineering, but from what I do know your point that mobile OSX is technically ahead of the other mobile OS platforms at this time is a valid one.

That doesn't really matter to me as a user though; I just want a device that will do stuff I want to do; and particularly, as a smartphone user, I want a device that puts ultimate control of its configuration and software set in my hands, not in the hands of some big brother.

Whether, given Apple's business philosophy, the technical superiority of mobile OSX *ever* leads to Apple's creating a device that really puts the power of the OS in the hands of users is the part I have my doubts about. But only time will tell.

Quote:

Android, revamped Symbian or OS 2008, LinMo, Palms "Nova' OS, WM7, will force Apple to compete.

I hope you are right. It makes sense to hope that Apple's success with a great interface will force the other designers to put more work than they have up to now into developing interfaces that appeal to people, and that the greater functionality and customizability of devices built on other platforms will force Apple to expand their feature set, release some of their control, and make the iPhone more of the powerhouse smartphone that it is capable of being. Such competition, needless to say, would lead to some awesome devices being brought to market.

But the wireless industry has a history of shortsightedness and fear of loss of control, and there are other lessons that could be taken away from the iPhone's success that align better with their worldviews.

All carrier networks are walled gardens to a greater or lesser degree, and the success of the iPhone/ATTM combination -- what is iTunes, after all, except the largest, most lucrative walled garden in existence? -- could lead the network owners to conclude that what is needed isn't designs that lead to more power in the hands of the user, but less.

It's good that smartphone developers have been shaken to new efforts by Apple's success; but meanwhile, the network owners may be thinking that the way to compete with Apple is not with smartphones, but with better, more capable, but still dumb and closed 'feature' phones, which they can still control and can still monetize according to their old walled garden models.

It remains to be seen whether there are enough people like those here, who demand control of their hardware, to force the network managers to accommodate our wants, to work with WinMo, S60, Android, etc., or how successful companies who want to market open/user-enabling devices can be in the North American business environment (see, oh, the ENTIRE HISTORY of Nokia's S60 platform in the NA for clues on how and why this will be an uphill battle all the way).

I know that several carriers have either joined or made nice noises about working with the open handset group, but, then again, back last fall in advance of the 700 MHz auction VZW (of all people!) was making noises about opening its network, and we see how that's going (one obscure and moribund device approved so far).

The question, I think, will be how successful the smartphone and open handset people can be in the face of the networks' resistance.

Will Android devices will take off? Will the carriers support/promote them?

Will an open, TCP/IP mobile WiMax network actually come into being, providing real competitive pressure to the closed mobile networks?

I guess only time will tell.

Quote:

Don't even mention Blackberry, did you see the latest video?

No, I've been hearing a lot about BB lately, but I've never had much interest in their designs. Maybe it's time to take a look.

Posted by: huntm856

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

I would say right now Symbian multi-tasks better than any other smartphone OS out there right now. And that includes OSX on the iphone, WM, Blackberry, etc. This is why Nokia phones don't really need 600mhz plus processors because Symbian is so effective at multi-tasking. Does that 350mhz processor slow you down, no it does not, if you ever wondered the reason why, Symbian is the reason why.

There's a free suite of S60 apps developed by Dr. Jukka called Y-Tasks, and one of the apps is a crash monitor. It gives some interesting insight into how S60 works. It's interesting to see how often a Nokia phone kills threads/processes and restarts them without your even realizing it.

It seems to me that it's not that S60 crashes that much less frequently than WinMo does; it's rather that S60 is so much better at keeping track of its state and recovering from crashes than WinMo is.

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

I won't argue with your points above since they are technically true. Apple probably avoided reinventing the wheel by using the base OSX Kernel etc. The thing I'm trying to say is that the mobile version is locked down enough that both legitimate developers and jail breaking hackers alike are not able to port anything available on the desktop over to the iPhone/iTouch. The iPhone not a UMPC like an Asus EEEPC or a Nokia 810 Tablet. You can use those to replace your desktop while the iPhone still requires a connection to a desktop/laptop for full functionality (iTunes media management, sync, etc.)

Still, the iPhone's OS, in the most practical sense a mobile phone/multimedia player OS. Yes it has a rich SDK and yes it has one of the best touch screen UI's ever made on a device, and I will concede that it has the potential to run desktop quality appplications, but it is not there yet, and the reason it is not there yet is because the decision makers at Apple don't feel the need to unlock it yet, and really they don't need to because the base iPhone 3G market isn't looking for things like that.

And yes, I forgot about the Macbook Air multi-touch pad, though it does use multi touch gestures like pinch and reverse pinch, it's not quite a touchscreen device. Maybe a touchscreen laptop will be Apple's next big thing.

Posted by: J.Bruha

It's actually slower to switch between tasks on the iPhone than it is on an S60 device, which is funny only because S60 doesn't have any of the multitasking limitations and keeps the full application running in the background, unlike the iPhone.

I didn't read anything else that was posted in any of those long posts, but that point caught my eye.

Posted by: mib1800

@iamthedudeman

Quote:

Earthscape is similar to Google earth, a complex application. It runs on the iphone. No other mobile device runs this application, because they can't do it.

You mean Google map can't do this (i.e. show satelite images) on the super powerful "desktop" capable Iphone OS??

Very strange since the native Google map app available on S60 since long ago can show satelite images. It even overlays the road details from map to the satelite view and you can route/search from the satelite view.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

@iamthedudeman

You mean Google map can't do this (i.e. show satelite images) on the super powerful "desktop" capable Iphone OS??

The iphone did this on day one. That is not what I am talking about.

I am not talking about satellite images. I am talking about having google earth like applicaton on your phone. Google earth is a graphic intensive application. All kidding aside, it is a impressive application.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

It's actually slower to switch between tasks on the iPhone than it is on an S60 device, which is funny only because S60 doesn't have any of the multitasking limitations and keeps the full application running in the background, unlike the iPhone.

I didn't read anything else that was posted in any of those long posts, but that point caught my eye.

Hit the home button, and tap another one, it's that easy. Takes two seconds and your in another application. S60 is easier when you have applications already running in the background. If not it is not easier.

Posted by: mib1800

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

That's the problem. The Iphone app you link to just dont look and perform like the "desktop" version. In fact it looks like a cut down version for mobile. So I wonder how if Iphone OSX is the same as MacOSX as you claimed, then we should be seeing exactly the same (on iphone & desktop) since the developer need not do any "porting" to make the desktop version runs on the Iphone. Apparently it is not so.

Posted by: Silent Witness

Sources close to Nokia say that Symbian is secretly regarded inside the company--even among high level senior executives--as a "piece-of-****-OS," explaining that “Finnish people usually have a very coarse language.”

A Symbian developer explains, “Nokia is more or less stuck with Symbian since it doesn't have the competence nor the time to make a new OS from the ground up. Its only alternative, in practice, is to go Linux, which it is of course experimenting with, but it's still not an easy path to go.

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RD...8AF3BD8B30.html

Posted by: iamthedudeman

[
I agree. OSX on the Iphone and OS 2008 are very similar in design and function as OS 2008 runs a mobilized form of Linux and the iphone runs a mobilized form of OSX. The main difference being the iphone's restrictions inhibit it from realizing it's full potential. It will be interesting to see Apple's reaction to Android as it is set to be released in the next few weeks. OS 2008 has no such restrictions. Neither does Android. Apple is releasing a internet tablet UPMC with the version of OSX running on the iphone. We shall see how much they cripple that too.

The iphone is like a Ferrari with wooden wheels. A powerfull OS that can't be used like it is meant to be used.

Love it or hate it. Apple has changed the way the game is played in the smartphone market. They advanced the smartphone market by at least five years if not more. Nokia, HTC, Samsung, Microsoft, Symbian, Blackberry, LG, Palm etc are all coming up with devices and OS's to match and hopefully beat the iphone at it's own game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOSk...feature=related

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

You cannot port a Mac application directly. The GUI would have to be changed since the Mac uses Cocoa and the iphone uses Cocoa Touch. The way you interact with the application would have to be changed, that's it.

I am not claiming anything. I am telling you facts. Everything i am telling you can verify for yourself. The iphone dev team "ported' core animation to the "mac'. A direct port since it is a API. OSX on the Mac and OSX on the iphone use the same development tools to produce applications (Xcode). So what does that tell you?

I think I have provided you with enough info(proof) to make a decision for yourself. Don't take my word for it. Go to the links I presented and read for yourself. Watch the Apple keynote. Everything I am telling you can be verified, just click on the links I provided or look them up for yourself.

It is not a cut down version for mobile. I have earthscape on my mac and on my iphone. It looks just like the desktop version, to a "T'. I am using them both.

The iphone version does not allow for time change and you cannot add "points of interest. The map is the same as is the integrated Wiki support. It Is new to the iphone so of coarse it will not have everything that the desktop version does, yet. Just today they added landscape mode to earthscape. Omnifocus is running on my iphone and it does everything the desktop version does. There are more apps as well that are cousins to it's desktop counterpart. And standalone apps that are 'desktop quality'.

You will never see "exactly the same' applications because they have different GUI's. Omnifocus on the iphone has all the functionality as the mac even more because it has GPS. But the GUI is different, how you interact with the application is different. That's it.

Posted by: huntm856

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silent Witness

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RD...8AF3BD8B30.html

As has been pointed out before, roughlydrafted isn't exactly an unbiased source with regard to Apple. I could excerpt entries from that blog that anyone not deeply biased in favor of Apple would have to laugh at.

Doesn't mean the quote is wrong, but it does mean that it shouldn't necessarily be taken at face value.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

No really, even with apps closed, it's a little bit faster. The added time to display the unnecessary visual effects make the phone take longer to load the application than on an S60 device.

The whole lack of task manager or just a task switcher application is a silly implementation, IMO. It's like pressing the Show Desktop button in Quick Launch bar in Windows every time you want to switch between open applications or open a new one.

Posted by: mib1800

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

So there is no compatibility of the UI layers. Then you would not save much effort in porting "so-called" desktop app to Iphone as compared to other phones. Anyway I still very much doubt whether all the desktop osx APIs are available for Iphone. Simple logic tells you they are not equal as the Iphone osx is something like 250Mb in size whereas the desktop version more than 7000Mb.

Quote:

I am not claiming anything. I am telling you facts. Everything i am telling you can verify for yourself. The iphone dev team "ported' core animation to the "mac'. A direct port since it is a API. OSX on the Mac and OSX on the iphone use the same development tools to produce applications (Xcode). So what does that tell you?

People use Visual Studio.NET to develop for Windows XP/Vista/Tablet/WM6. It does not tell you anything about the capability OS. In the past S60 apps can also developed with VS.NET.

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

[
I agree. OSX on the Iphone and OS 2008 are very similar in design and function as OS 2008 runs a mobilized form of Linux and the iphone runs a mobilized form of OSX. The main difference being the iphone's restrictions inhibit it from realizing it's full potential. It will be interesting to see Apple's reaction to Android as it is set to be released in the next few weeks. OS 2008 has no such restrictions. Neither does Android. Apple is releasing a internet tablet UPMC with the version of OSX running on the iphone. We shall see how much they cripple that too.

The iphone is like a Ferrari with wooden wheels. A powerfull OS that can't be used like it is meant to be used.

The iPhone isn't even a proper smartphone, it certainly hasn't advanced the market.

Posted by: Blakthorn

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

The iPhone isn't even a proper smartphone, it certainly hasn't advanced the market.

What do you mean it hasnt advanced the market?

Everything that is released nowadays is instantly compared to the iPhone's benchmark, size, weight, screen size etc... In my opinion they set the bar high and alot of other companies are implementing many of the things the iPhone first brought to the table publicly..

Posted by: ipodlover77

hey blakthorn, have you ever considered giving up your n95 for the iphone? =P

Posted by: Blakthorn

not quite, i have the n95 8gb and my gf has the iphone 3g so i get the best of both worlds

come nov. its time for a new phone, 99% im going for android / g1 but well see..

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

The iPhone isn't even a proper smartphone, it certainly hasn't advanced the market.

That's ignorant at best. Samsung touch phones to numerous to list, LG Touch Phones, Blackberry storm, HTC touch devices, etc. Everyone and their mother is coming up with a touch screen device and UI similar to the Iphone, but that did not influence the "smartphone' market at all.

Are you serious?

Can you be anymore of a "Hater'.

Facts are facts, I bet you don't buy Japanese Cars, only American.

Posted by: Matchoo

I had been considering either the N95 or iPhone for a long time, and the more I thought about it, the more I realised I'd rather have the iPhone.

I love the iPhone so far, and don't regret not getting the N95 in any way. I do agree that the N95 is an awesome phone, but the keypad is a big negative imo.

Posted by: beyond

I currently use a N95 8GB and since my contract expired, I "upgraded" and got the iPhone. It arrived last Friday and I used it over the weekend. Sad to say, but after 2 days of usage, I immediately switched back to my N95.

While the iPhone looked really nice and had a really good UI, I really must agree with many of the other N95 users on this thread about its superior functionality. Some of the main features I use are the following:

1) Voice calling. I drive stick and I rely on voice calling a lot. I found that I wasn't able to do this on the iPhone (although I think someone told me that you can download an app for the iPhone similar to voice calling?). I had to look down on the iPhone, search for my contact, select the right # to call and shift all at the same time which was a hazard (IMO) while driving.

2) GPS. Turn-by-turn navigation really sealed the deal. I was trying to figure out how to get to a friend's house and I found it frustrating looking down on the iPhone's screen every 2 minutes to find out when/where I had to make a turn.

3) Camera. Although I do have a "real" camera, the quality on the N95 camera is really amazing for what it's worth. I was at a party but the iPhone didn't have flash, etc and took pretty crappy pictures in the dark.

4) Ring Volume. While i found the iPhone volume to be an improvement over the 1st Gen iPhones, the 'upgraded' ringing volume on the iPhone doesn't really cut it. I was walking in a mall over the weekend and I missed 5 calls. The vibe on the iPhone isn't exceptionally strong either. The N95's ringer is a lot louder and I'm usually able to pickup most of my calls.

Some features that I found the iPhone better were:

1) Browser. Having a big screen really helps. Although the N95's browser is really good, the Safari browser did some of the basic things better. For examle, I was looking up movie times and I found it was easier just tapping the link instead of using the D-Pad to position the pointer to "click" the link.

2) Screen. It's beautiful. All the colors are very sharp and vibrant. It's great for Video watching too! I put a movie on and it was great.

Other than these few points, I found some other features on both phones comparable.

1) Music player. Some people say that the iPhone/iPod is one of the best music devices out there. I'm not an Audiophile or whatever so I'm not really going to comment on the quality, the frequencies, etc etc. Usually if I play music on the phone, I hook it up to the car. It's safe for me to say that the iPhone and N95 playback quality was similar. However, if I did play music by itself (on a very rare occasion) and the N95's speakers were a lot louder and sounded good too. The iPhone's speakers sounded nice too but was a little too soft.

2) Gaming. I downloaded a lot of games for the N95 and tried a few games on the iPhone. While they're both fun, I'm not going to say if 1 is better than the other. Mobile gaming for me is just to kill time on the go. If I was at home, I'd very much rather be playing XBox instead.

3) Screen Visiblity in Sunlight. I'd say that the iPhone was a bit better, but I'd also have to mention that the N95's screen was also decent in direct sunlight. Whatever does the job is fine.

4) Text Messaging. Both T9 and the QWERTY keyboard were fine. I was just annoyed that for the iPhone, I constantly had to tap the "x" at the top of the words (for the auto-correct) when I was typing abbreviations. T9 did the job fine and I guess I'm already used to it so I can't really compare. However, I did miss being able to send MMS. It's not really an issue for me since I don't use it excessively.

At the end of the day, for me personally, the cons of the iPhone outweighed the pros and I couldn't deal with the limitations of no voice calling, crappy camera, and constantly having to look down at the screen while doing anything. It's also really annoying because the iPhone's a fingerprint magnet!! While the aesthetics are nicer on the iPhone (nice and thin, beautiful screen, fashionable, etc), the N95 doesn't look bad either. I think it looks fine. On the other hand, when I see 20 other people in the mall holding the iPhone, it looks kind of bad. I'd very much rather be holding the N95. You can also say I'm cheap. I don't like to pay for apps from the app store and stuff. I didn't jailbreak this phone so I can't really comment on the apps available from "Installer" and "Cydia". However, the N95 does have a lot of FREE useful apps. Other nice apps I have on the N95 are handy taskman, profile scheduler, core player, etc. I think the iPhone is nice as a fashion item. However, if you're talking about full functionality, I'd very much rather stick with te N95.

By the way, I disliked using the iPhone so much that I've decided to sell it after 2 days of usage lol. It's in the BST forum if anyone's intersted LOL

Thanks for reading.

Posted by: Slapshot47

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

Comparing "platforms" overall doesn't make too much sense from PC to smartphone. Computers running a "unified platform" like Windows can do so because of how extensively large the collection of hardware and drivers for that hardware exist. You don't see people rebuilding any smartphones like you can a desktop, so in this respect, none of the smartphone OS's can be considered a platform. They all have specific firmware with specific drivers to that devices hardware.

But smartphones do not have a unified hardware/software UI. Game consoles do (controllers), as do desktop machines (keyboard and pointing device). It's easy to create software for these devices since you know, as a developer. how the thing is going to work.

The iPhone is more like a PSP or a DS than it is like other smartphones. It's simply not the same kind of device. It overlaps in functionality with smartphones, but it isn't the same kind of device. Hence my original claim that the comparison was pointless.

Comparing the Apple devices and the Nokia devices qua phone is artificially restricting the comparison.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Once again, I was using the other dude's definition of a platform to show that he was incorrect. I agree with what you said.

Posted by: Dr Tran

Quote:

Originally Posted by beyond

Some features that I found the iPhone better were:

1) Browser. Having a big screen really helps. Although the N95's browser is really good, the Safari browser did some of the basic things better. For examle, I was looking up movie times and I found it was easier just tapping the link instead of using the D-Pad to position the pointer to "click" the link.

2) Screen. It's beautiful. All the colors are very sharp and vibrant. It's great for Video watching too! I put a movie on and it was great.

Other than these few points, I found some other features on both phones comparable.

1) Music player. Some people say that the iPhone/iPod is one of the best music devices out there. I'm not an Audiophile or whatever so I'm not really going to comment on the quality, the frequencies, etc etc. Usually if I play music on the phone, I hook it up to the car. It's safe for me to say that the iPhone and N95 playback quality was similar. However, if I did play music by itself (on a very rare occasion) and the N95's speakers were a lot louder and sounded good too. The iPhone's speakers sounded nice too but was a little too soft.

2) Gaming. I downloaded a lot of games for the N95 and tried a few games on the iPhone. While they're both fun, I'm not going to say if 1 is better than the other. Mobile gaming for me is just to kill time on the go. If I was at home, I'd very much rather be playing XBox instead.

3) Screen Visiblity in Sunlight. I'd say that the iPhone was a bit better, but I'd also have to mention that the N95's screen was also decent in direct sunlight. Whatever does the job is fine.

4) Text Messaging. Both T9 and the QWERTY keyboard were fine. I was just annoyed that for the iPhone, I constantly had to tap the "x" at the top of the words (for the auto-correct) when I was typing abbreviations. T9 did the job fine and I guess I'm already used to it so I can't really compare. However, I did miss being able to send MMS. It's not really an issue for me since I don't use it excessively.

At the end of the day, for me personally, the cons of the iPhone outweighed the pros and I couldn't deal with the limitations of no voice calling, crappy camera, and constantly having to look down at the screen while doing anything. It's also really annoying because the iPhone's a fingerprint magnet!! While the aesthetics are nicer on the iPhone (nice and thin, beautiful screen, fashionable, etc), the N95 doesn't look bad either. I think it looks fine. On the other hand, when I see 20 other people in the mall holding the iPhone, it looks kind of bad. I'd very much rather be holding the N95. You can also say I'm cheap. I don't like to pay for apps from the app store and stuff. I didn't jailbreak this phone so I can't really comment on the apps available from "Installer" and "Cydia". However, the N95 does have a lot of FREE useful apps. Other nice apps I have on the N95 are handy taskman, profile scheduler, core player, etc. I think the iPhone is nice as a fashion item. However, if you're talking about full functionality, I'd very much rather stick with te N95.

By the way, I disliked using the iPhone so much that I've decided to sell it after 2 days of usage lol. It's in the BST forum if anyone's intersted LOL

Thanks for reading.

You should get an iPod Touch

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

Are you serious?

Can you be anymore of a "Hater'.

Facts are facts, I bet you don't buy Japanese Cars, only American.

I'm Canadian, *******. If anything I'd buy Japanese over American when it comes to cars.

I said it hasn't advanced the market, not that it hasn't influenced it. The two are quite different. An influence isn't necessarily an advancement. Touch screen devices have been around for ages, you're acting as if the iPhone was the first to do it.

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blakthorn

It's still so far behind in many ways that a 2+ year old phone still outdoes it. It's compared because it's a good point of comparison. Some people think it's too large, so the screen size isn't necessarily an advantage, not to mention the fact that so much scrolling is necessary with the browser, which requires constant thumb swiping which leads to RSI. It has a long way to go, it doesn't yet do anything better that can't be done through a different input method.

Posted by: giant236

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matchoo

I had been considering either the N95 or iPhone for a long time, and the more I thought about it, the more I realised I'd rather have the iPhone.

I love the iPhone so far, and don't regret not getting the N95 in any way. I do agree that the N95 is an awesome phone, but the keypad is a big negative imo.

Totally agree! I have the same situation, but finally I also pick the iphone for it's big screen which i can browse, play game and watching movie easily!

Posted by: J.Bruha

Preference for text input probably has something to do with the means of transportation and lifestyle in addition to how often that person needs to use it. If I had to guess, I'd venture that those who travel on foot or by train frequently would prefer the iPhone or some other QWERTY input method because they have the time to devote both hands and all of their attention to their device. For someone like me, I prefer T9 because I drive everywhere and only have one spare hand throughout most of my day to dedicate to my phone. I guess to someone who hasn't used it, it can be confusing, but I still have yet to have someone beat my one handed speed on T9 with a two handed device, and I don't have to stop what I'm doing to use my phone simultaneously.

Posted by: migo

I used to prefer QWERTY, but then I used it so much I got cramps in my hands. Doesn't help much if it creates problems. T9 is slow but not frustrating, so I prefer it to touch screen which is slow and frustrating.

Posted by: RogerPodacter

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

I used to prefer QWERTY, but then I used it so much I got cramps in my hands. Doesn't help much if it creates problems. T9 is slow but not frustrating, so I prefer it to touch screen which is slow and frustrating.

that's odd because i am 10 times faster using T9 over qwerty. qwerty is just too damn slow. you have over 30 keys to worry about and poke at!

Posted by: RufusRyker

So now that the N95 and iPhone 3G are selling side-by-side at places like O2 stores and Carphone Warehouse in the UK, which phone is selling more units? It's safe to state that Nokia smartphones were well established in the UK before the iPhone arrived, unlike in the U.S. If the prices are similar for the phones and the carrier plans, it should tell us how the competition is shaping up in the "real world."

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufusRyker

So now that the N95 and iPhone 3G are selling side-by-side at places like O2 stores and Carphone Warehouse in the UK, which phone is selling more units? It's safe to state that Nokia smartphones were well established in the UK before the iPhone arrived, unlike in the U.S. If the prices are similar for the phones and the carrier plans, it should tell us how the competition is shaping up in the "real world."

Not necessarily since the iPhone is a standalone option. If someone decides they don't want the iPhone, they don't automatically choose the N95. Someone could choose the N82 for its xenon flash instead. That's why a sales comparison between the iPhone and any other device is just pointless. Nokia and other manufacturers offer a variety of devices for a variety of users, whereas Apple offers one choice in two different colors and capacities.

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

that's odd because i am 10 times faster using T9 over qwerty. qwerty is just too damn slow. you have over 30 keys to worry about and poke at!

I can hit 50WPM with QWERTY, I think I'm maybe around 25WPM with T9.

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

It would work for Rogers, where N95 and iPhone are the two options (not surprising, since that's the reason I started this thread...)

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

I can hit 50WPM with QWERTY, I think I'm maybe around 25WPM with T9.

My all time high is 71 WPM with T9 from iPhonetypingtest.com.

Posted by: migo

Hmm. I guess it's a matter of practice. I'll have to play with that.

Posted by: dimsum05

Once you learn T9, you can have any phone in the world.

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

Preference for text input probably has something to do with the means of transportation and lifestyle in addition to how often that person needs to use it. If I had to guess, I'd venture that those who travel on foot or by train frequently would prefer the iPhone or some other QWERTY input method because they have the time to devote both hands and all of their attention to their device. For someone like me, I prefer T9 because I drive everywhere and only have one spare hand throughout most of my day to dedicate to my phone. I guess to someone who hasn't used it, it can be confusing, but I still have yet to have someone beat my one handed speed on T9 with a two handed device, and I don't have to stop what I'm doing to use my phone simultaneously.

Not that I encourage phone operation while driving, but when I do send off a quick text at a stop light, I prefer the numeric touch keypad with T9 over the compact QWERTY on my touch cruise. Yes there is no feel for the buttons because it is a touchscreen, but it's better than nothing.

It's too bad the iPhone doesn't offer a similar input mode, not that the vertical keyboard is bad, its just that the numpad + t9 offers bigger screen buttons so one-handed text input can potentially be faster.

I think the upcoming E75 Slider offers the best of both worlds, the regular numpad and the slide-out QWERTY for two thumbed texting.

http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/19/...yboards-leaked/

Posted by: RogerPodacter

Quote:

Originally Posted by dimsum05

Once you learn T9, you can have any phone in the world.

yes and in addition, you can use one hand to type full sentences, and usually you can do it without even looking. after a few weeks of using T9, you pretty much have memorized each number button and what letters are on each key. 12 keys is so much easier to deal with then 30+ keys.

and here i am using a qwerty phone! its probably the best qwerty phone in existence though. but i still miss T9!!

Posted by: JoeyDee

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

Not to be off-topic, but why'd you switch phones?

Posted by: beyond

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Tran

You should get an iPod Touch

LOL
Um yeah...sure...why not?

You guys should enter a text messaging contest...

Posted by: RogerPodacter

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeyDee

Not to be off-topic, but why'd you switch phones?

i wanted to sell my n95-4 now in preperation for the n85 release. i figure i would get more money for the n95 now then if i wait until a new model comes out. and because the e71 is such a small and awesome device, i bought it to use in the mean time. and i will keep it even after i get an n85 just because it will be my permanent backup phone since it fits all the criteria: maximum battery capacity, smallest size and formfactor, great specs to boot.

Posted by: dimsum05

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerPodacter

Love the battery and speed on that thing, but it chokes and gags hard on video, especialy on video made for iPod. However, now I know why they say the battery life on the N95 is rubbish.

Posted by: aggie99

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

My all time high is 71 WPM with T9 from iPhonetypingtest.com.

This means nothing without a screenshot

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by aggie99

This means nothing without a screenshot

...'K.

Posted by: aggie99

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

...'K.

Lol I was just jokin with ya man...but wow that's crazy! I don't know if I can even type that fast on my computer!

Posted by: dimsum05

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

...'K.

Just tried matching that and my thumb broke off. Does anyone know how to reattach it?

Posted by: J.Bruha

To be fair, it's not technically 71 WPM. There's supposed to be a set of rules for calculating WPM that has to do with words being so many characters long and things like that. The iPhone typing test is completely different though because it measures how fast you type common/simple phrases that would be normal to spit out in a text message on a mobile device.

Either way, I'm sure you all agree, it's pretty fast.

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

To be fair, it's not technically 71 WPM. There's supposed to be a set of rules for calculating WPM that has to do with words being so many characters long and things like that. The iPhone typing test is completely different though because it measures how fast you type common/simple phrases that would be normal to spit out in a text message on a mobile device.

Either way, I'm sure you all agree, it's pretty fast.

You are an alien that speaks only in T9.

I'm lucky if I can break 12 WPM on my touch screen. =p

Posted by: dimsum05

Quote:

Originally Posted by mobileobsession

You are an alien that speaks only in T9.

I'm lucky if I can break 12 WPM on my touch screen. =p

Have you tried Swype? If not, Google it... it's T9 for touchscreen devices and it's crazy fast!

Posted by: mobileobsession

Quote:

Originally Posted by dimsum05

Have you tried Swype? If not, Google it... it's T9 for touchscreen devices and it's crazy fast!

I've seen a demo video of it. I read it's from one of the founders of T9. It looks pretty wicked, but I haven't actually tried it yet.

http://www.swypeinc.com/product.html

I did register on the swype site to be notified when it becomes available to the public though so when it does becomes available I'm so on it...

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufusRyker

Apple has sold 7 million 3G iphones in less than three months. That is more than Nokia's whole N Series lineup. Let alone the N95.

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2008/10/21results.html
http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2008/1...n-iphones-sold/

Posted by: mib1800

Nokia sold 16mil S60 in Q3 out of which 12mil are N-series. Nokia has been doing 16-17 mil S60 sales every quarter for the last few quarters.

Iphone 3G sales is quite remarkable for the first few months. The only thing is whether it can be sustained. If I remembered correctly out of the 5-6mil Iphone-1 sold more than half were sold in the first few months. Will history repeats itself for Iphone3G?

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

Nokia sold 16mil S60 in Q3 out of which 12mil are N-series. Nokia has been doing 16-17 mil S60 sales every quarter for the last few quarters.

Iphone 3G sales is quite remarkable for the first few months. The only thing is whether it can be sustained. If I remembered correctly out of the 5-6mil Iphone-1 sold more than half were sold in the first few months. Will history repeats itself for Iphone3G?

You're right Nokia sold more units with the "whole' N series lineup, but not by much. They sold just under 9 million units. They sold 15.5 million units total of s60 devices for Q3 2008. It was 16 million in Q3 2007. Nokia s60 sales have been going down steadily for months. They are losing market share to Apple and RIM. Unless they change their marketing strategy in the US market expect that trend to continue.

http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1260299
http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news...008_results.php

In don't expect Apple to sell over two million a month forever. But 1.5 million is not out of the question and easily doable. And this is just one handset, one model. Nokia is selling many N series models to apples one model. I think it is very clear the 3g Iphone is outselling the N95, or any other Nokia N series handset by a wide margin. No question. No comparison.

You cannot compare the 1st gen iphone sales to the 3g model because the 3g model is being sold in many more countries around the world. The 1st gen would have sold even more if it was sold in more countries, no doubt about it.

Posted by: mib1800

ok, it was 9mil N-seris and 3 mil E-series. technically we should count all the S60 phones as well since they are smartphones. the new 5800XM is neither n or e-series but it is more capable than Iphone and everyone is expecting it to be sold by the truckloads.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

IT IS THEIR ONLY MODEL!

You can also say that all of the mobile devices Nokia is selling is significantly outselling all of the mobile devices that Apple is selling. It makes no difference. If someone decides not to get an iPhone, they don't automatically get an N95, but given the numbers, they still bought an Nseries.

Now get back under your bridge and rejoice that you are just like every other 12-year-old with an iPhone. You are part of the crowd of dumb, average Americans that Apple is exploiting.

Posted by: RufusRyker

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

Now get back under your bridge and rejoice that you are just like every other 12-year-old with an iPhone. You are part of the crowd of dumb, average Americans that Apple is exploiting.

This is a bit off topic, but I wanted to inform JonnyBruha that the results of the DNA test he requested are in. Steve Jobs IS your daddy.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Steve Jobs is MY *****. I spent $700 total on his iToys and turned it into over $1000, selling them unlocked to the same sheep that think it's the first phone that can play music.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mib1800

ok, it was 9mil N-seris and 3 mil E-series. technically we should count all the S60 phones as well since they are smartphones. the new 5800XM is neither n or e-series but it is more capable than Iphone and everyone is expecting it to be sold by the truckloads.

It is 15.5 for all s60 devices, including the N series and E series. Fact of the matter is that the 3g iphone is the best selling single smartphone in the world right now.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

It is 15.5 for all s60 devices, including the N series and E series. Fact of the matter is that the 3g iphone is the best selling single smartphone in the world right now.

Actually, it's number 2. Which phone do you think is number one? Guess.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

I just said it is their only model.

Why are you comparing all Nokia's devices together. What thread are you reading? The question was wether the N95 is outselling the iphone, which it is not. How doesn't it make a difference when the title of the thread is " iphone 3g vs N95 8 GB?

Nokia sold 15.5 million S60 "devices or smartphones' which constitute many models, to Apples one model of phone. Which they sold 7 million of. I think my answer was on topic and pertinent to the discussion at hand.

"Now get back under your bridge and rejoice that you are just like every other 12-year-old with an iPhone. You are part of the crowd of dumb, average Americans that Apple is exploiting.[/QUOTE]"

No need for name calling here. We are all adults.

While your adolescent rant has nothing to do with the topic at hand. You are whining like a young adolescent 12 year old that got his lunch taken off of him at the bus stop. The only dumb person here is you. I have been using smartphones since you were playing with GI Joes. You're new to the smartphone game by most peoples standards. My wife has used more smartphones than you. As do most people with iphones on this site. Your in your early twenties, so when I was using my Bell Simon with BellSouth you were not even ten years old.

Try acting like a adult and quit with the name calling.

I told you this would come to pass months ago unless Nokia adopted Apples business model. Well looks like I was right and they are trying to do that with the 5800, but a little to late I am afraid.

"If someone decides not to get an iPhone, they don't automatically get an N95, but given the numbers, they still bought an Nseries. "

Most people looking for a iphone are "Not"looking for a Nseries or a iphone. They also might consider a Samsung, LG, Moto, Blackberry etc. I don't see how you can come to that conclusion. The 3g iphone is surpassing the amount of sales of any single S60 device. There were 15.5 million S60 Nokia devices sold, to Apples 7 million Iphones. One Model. to Nokia's many models. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the iphone is outselling any single Nokia S60 handset.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

Actually, it's number 2. Which phone do you think is number one? Guess.

I said "smartphone'. The RAZR is not a smartphone.

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

I just said it is their only model.

Why are you comparing all Nokia's devices together. What thread are you reading? The question was wether the N95 is outselling the iphone, which it is not. How doesn't it make a difference when the title of the thread is " iphone 3g vs N95 8 GB?

Nokia sold 15.5 million S60 "devices or smartphones' which constitute many models, to Apples one model of phone. Which they sold 7 million of. I think my answer was on topic and pertinent to the discussion at hand.

"Now get back under your bridge and rejoice that you are just like every other 12-year-old with an iPhone. You are part of the crowd of dumb, average Americans that Apple is exploiting."

No need for name calling here. We are all adults.

While your adolescent rant has nothing to do with the topic at hand. You are whining like a young adolescent 12 year old that got his lunch taken off of him at the bus stop. The only dumb person here is you. I have been using smartphones since you were playing with GI Joes. You're new to the smartphone game by most peoples standards. My wife has used more smartphones than you. As do most people with iphones on this site. Your in your early twenties, so when I was using my Bell Simon with BellSouth you were not even ten years old.

First off, I didn't call you dumb. I said you were part of the same crowd. I will call you ignorant, but I don't think you're dumb.

Second, your credibility in regards to how many smartphones you have used is worthless since you got rid of your N65...whatever that is. At the very least, I have had the decency to try all operating systems before trying to compare them, and I haven't lied about it.

Third, you don't seem to get it. I am thoroughly impressed by the sales numbers of the iPhone, but they are NOT to be inflated out of proportion. If someone wants a phone made by Apple, they have two choices; 8 or 16, and either way, it's still the same phone, all forced into contract and data plan with very limited options. If someone decides they want a Nokia smartphone, they have dozens of varieties of devices and plans from which to choose. Given this, there is NO POINT to comparing the iPhone to any single model. NONE of the information holds any water whatsoever. All you can do is sit back and be impressed that the iPhone sold as much as it did, not enjoy how much it is selling MORE than any other single device. That just doesn't make sense.

Fourth, neither is the iPhone. Smartphones have copy+paste, document editors, send files over Bluetooth, download and upload files from websites, and have operating systems supported across several manufacturers. The iPhone is a feature phone, the current trend, made a commodity right next to the RAZR and will fade out just like the rest of the fads. Given the upcoming offerings from Blackberry, Nokia, HTC, and the rest of the manufacturers, Apple's time atop their hill will be very short-lived. Enjoy being like everyone while it lasts.

Edit: Fifth, learn to quote.

Posted by: dimsum05

Wasn't this thread dead?

Posted by: J.Bruha

It was. Homeboy found a reason to bring it back instead of doing anything constructive on these forums.

Posted by: migo

N95 already sold 7 million before Apple hit 1 million.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

"First off, I didn't call you dumb. I said you were part of the same crowd. I will call you ignorant, but I don't think you're dumb."

Last time I checked, calling someone part of a "dumb crowd' is calling them dumb.

I will make you a deal. How about i post a pic with all my current smartphones in a row with your screen name across them. If I do you have to leave the site and come back with your name changed to Johnny Brewpub, or Brewski. Deal?

Saying someone is lying just because they spelled a name of a phone wrong is reaching. I will not make up for your lack of experience in using smartphones. Which you have little compared to most on this site, myself included. Have you owned any device other than a S60 device and a iphone. A Blackberry, WM, Palm, Linux?

It makes perfect sense. Any smartphone and that includes any S60 device is a direct competitor to the iphone. If Nokia had a device that is selling as well as the iphone then it's numbers would reflect that. Regardless of how many different model of phones they are selling. Are you telling me that since they are selling more models that those models are not selling as well as the iphone because they are competing with other Nseries models. That doesn't make sense. Trust me. They don't have a model that can compete with the iphone. Simple as that.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by migo

N95 already sold 7 million before Apple hit 1 million.

What does that have to do with the 3g iphone. Nothing

Posted by: J.Bruha

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

Yes it does, and that's exactly what I'm saying. If Apple had 6 or 7 devices from which to choose, all of which specialized in one particular feature or another, and one of those models was outselling the N95, then I would agree with you. But people don't have that option. They can choose the iPhone, or the camera focused N82, the all-in-one N95, the E90 as a messaging powerhouse, the E71 for a solid business device, or they can choose lighter models like the N78, E51, N81, or a ton of other devices. Nokia designs several different phones to match everyone. Apple makes ONE phone to try to match everyone. In any normal discussion between two smartphones made by smartphone manufacturers that make more than one device, this whole argument would be thrown out the windows because the two devices are so completely diverse. The only difference is that you and everyone else on the bandwagon has an obsession with proving that it's the BEST phone than everyone else's, and you all have the same device!

If you had only typed an incorrect model number (transposing two letters nowhere near each other on a keyboard, mind you), that would be reaching, but you have yet to show that you know anything about S60 other than what you dig up on a quick Google search.

I'll leave this forum when you start contributing instead of only coming back here to use your phone as an extension of.. I don't have to say it.

Posted by: iamthedudeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBruha

Yes it does, and that's exactly what I'm saying. If Apple had 6 or 7 devices from which to choose, all of which specialized in one particular feature or another, and one of those models was outselling the N95, then I would agree with you. But people don't have that option. They can choose the iPhone, or the camera focused N82, the all-in-one N95, the E90 as a messaging powerhouse, the E71 for a solid business device, or they can choose lighter models like the N78, E51, N81, or a ton of other devices. Nokia designs several different phones to match everyone. Apple makes ONE phone to try to match everyone. In any normal discussion between two smartphones made by smartphone manufacturers that make more than one device, this whole argument would be thrown out the windows because the two devices are diverse. The only difference is that you and everyone else on the bandwagon has an obsession with proving that it's the BEST phone than everyone else's, and you all have the same device!

It seems to me that I am discussing a topic about the iphone 3g and the N95 on a thread about the iphone 3g and the N95. I posted sales figures and answered a question as to which one was selling better. That's it. Simple as that.

I never said the iphone was the best phone there is. You did.

If I remember correctly we were discussing a N95. I probably typed N95 a 100 times in that thread. And I probably typed E65 once or twice if you count N65. So saying that they are not close to each other on a keyboard is irrelevant. Again your reaching.

Sorry kid, but you don't make sense. This isn't a game. You don't get to make the rules. Saying that Nokia makes diverse phones and Apple does not and you can't compare them is nonsense. Sorry. I own and operate a Marketing Firm. You don't know what your talking about period. The iphone and any other smartphone compete with one another for market share. It's as simple and cut and dried as that. Not complicated.

Do you really thing I give a rats *** if you believe me or not? You have not owned a WM, Blackberry, Linux, Palm smartphone. How you can say I have not used other OS's coming from a guy that has not owned half of the smartphone OS's out there is a joke into itself. Believe it or not everyone is as young and inexperienced as yourself.

Fact of the matter is that the iphone competes with Nokia's smartphones regardless of feature and is outselling and stealing market share on a daily basis. Nokia's lack of innovation and complacency has reared it's ugly head and is biting them in the ***. That is a fact. The iphone, G1, Bold, Storm, will all take a big chunk out of S60. Big time. That is a fact. It is already happening.

Posted by: J.Bruha

I seem to keep skipping over your posts about my lack of experience because they don't even register. Thanks for checking my list of phones I've purchased and assuming that's all I know about, as you've done several times before.

What is so diverse about Apple's mobile division? How much variation are you going to have in your customer between 8 and 16 gigs? They certainly do compete for market share, and we all know which one is leagues ahead of the other. I don't have to post that, but I will just in case you wanted something more current.

http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=754112
Let me know when that 2.8 turns into anything close to a 50 or better. Apple can have their slice of the pie, as long as it they keep their death grip on it, they'll only be able to take as much of the mobile market as they have the PC market, if not significantly less.

Posted by: migo

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamthedudeman

What does that have to do with the 3g iphone. Nothing

Sales comparisons. If the 3G iPhone is at 7 million, and the N95 was at 7 million before the 3G was released, clearly the N95 has more sales.

Posted by: JoeyDee

Where's a moderator to close this thread?

IAMTHEDUDEMAN, nice name btw, you replied to this thread after no one else has for a MONTH just to say 'oh wow, mine is bigger than yours.'

Cut the crap and learn when to stop, all you're doing is making this forum look bad.

(edited for typo)

Posted by: technotask

i like Nokia N95.... its great phone with lots of features.