vB Easy Archive - P800 selling fraud BEWARE

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P800 selling fraud BEWARE
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Posted by: iridium

Just wanted to mention this on this board as I know many of you are like me, pretty much desperate to get a P800

On my search to find a p800 I ended up on ebay.de and got in touch with a "company" suposedly selling the phone. I enquired as to whether they had it in stock to which they answered yes and that they had 30 units ready to ship from Europe... They even offered me the entire lot for just under 7000euro

)
The scam was a little obvious given the "too good to be true" price, but one never knows, which is why I insisted on getting proof that they did have the phones in stock... When you read the email transcript, you will see that these scammers are not very subtle as they avoided answering questions too much etc...
Now the last email they sent me (as if I accepted the deal) had a UPS tracking number... when I checked the tracking, it was valid on the UPS site with my info as receipient, giving the impression that they have it packed and ready to ship

Now, I'm sure most of you know that the courier companies allow you to create a tracking through the internet even before shipping the item, so it is very easy for individuals to make it look like "things are ready"... Seeing this I decided to call UPS to investigate it a little... the funny thing is that as soon as I gave her the tracking number, the UPS lady said "hum there is a 'T' in the number..." "is this about something you purchased on the internet?" "there is a lot of fraud going on with people creating tracking numbers and not shipping out the items, they always make up different company names, and move around a lot ... if you see the letter T in one of our tracking numbers, this is a clue" ... (btw she confirmed that not all UPS tracking#s with a 'T' are frauds). From what she explained it seems there is a lot of such frauds going.
I'll post the email exchange with the sell below. Have fun reading it

Posted by: iridium

Dear David,

Thank you for agreement.
As we agreed we have made the reservation at UPS for you and we payd for all taxes.
Here are all details:

Transaction Date 23 Sep 2002

ADDRESS INFORMATION

Ship To:

David Weissenberg
xxxxx
xxxx xxxx
FRANCE

SHIPMENT DETAILS

Service : UPS Express
Guaranteed By*: 12:00 P.M., Tues. 24 Sep. 2002
Payment Method : MasterCard XXXX-XXXX-XXXX-3498
Description of Goods : 5 Brand new Sony Ericsson P800
Shipment ID : 74T623VPKL3

Actual Weight : 10,0 kg
Billable Weight : 10,0 kg

PACKAGE DETAILS

Package 1 of 1
Tracking Number 1Z74T6236698861626

Package Type UPS Express Box
Declared Value Amount 1750,00

All currencies in EUR Total : **237,77

We already payd 237EURO,but that is included in the price.
Shippment is inssured 1750EURo for a safely delivery to France.
Also shipping taxes are included in the price 1750EURO.
All you have to pay is the Western union transfere fee to italy at the company.
Here are the company details where you will transfere the funds 1750EURO via Western union service:

Cashier name: STXXX XXXX

Company addres: STR XXXXXX
xxxxx,MILANO 20035
ITALY

We will wait for the Western union MTCN(money transfere control nr) with the payment 1750EURO so we can proced with the shippment.

Kind regards,

----- Original Message -----
From: David Weissenberg <dw@globalassets.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 10:33:34 +0200
To: xxx <xxx@europe.com>
Subject: Re: 5 P800 offer

> Sir,
>
> You are not answering my questions. Please re-read the last paragraph of my
> previous email and let me know where you stand. Here are my shipping details
> for your reference:
>
> David Weissenberg
> xxxxx
> xxxxxx
> France
> Phone:xxxxxx
>
> Again I am ready to go forward with this deal, but you must provide me
> evidence you do have these items. Given that this is the first time we do
> business together and that I do not have any precise details about you or
> your company, you must certainly understand my position.
>
> Regards,
>
> David
>
> > From: "xxxx" <xxxx@europe.com>
> > Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 18:24:24 -0500
> > To: dw@globalassets.com
> > Subject: 5 P800 offer
> >
> > Dear David,
> >
> > Thank you for the location details.
> > As we told you before shipping is free so we will ship to France for free to.
> > If the price is ok 1750EURO+about 70EURO for the Western union transfere fee
> > to Italy is a deal.
> > Please send us the shipping details so we can proced with the order and
> > provide you all details required.
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: David Weissenberg <dw@globalassets.com>
> > Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 00:41:35 +0200
> > To: xxxxxx <xxx@europe.com>
> > Subject: Re: P800 offer
> >
> >
> >> Sir,
> >>
> >> Thanks for your reply. Your pricing is fine and I appreciate the free
> >> shipping, but a couple of things need to be addressed:
> >> I would prefer payment by wire transfer, so please forward me your banking
> >> details.
> >> Notice that I am located in France (not Germany) so please let me know if
> >> your free shipping offer still holds.
> >> Lastly, as I mentioned before, I would need proof that you do have these
> >> items ready to ship before committing to this transaction. The reason I am
> >> specific on this is because the P800 is not officially released at this time
> >> and most of the ones offered for sale on sites like eBay are fraudulent
> >> (i.e.. The sellers don't have the phones). Once I have that information, I
> >> can have a wire sent to you immediately via urgent SWIFT and you can then
> >> ship the goods.
> >>
> >> Please let me know where you stand.
> >>
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> David Weissenberg
> >>

Posted by: iridium

> >>> From: "xxxx" <xxx@europe.com>
> >>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 17:22:42 -0500
> >>> To: dw@globalassets.com
> >>> Subject: Re: P800 offer
> >>>
> >>> Dear csutomer,
> >>>
> >>> Thank you for reply.
> >>> Units are with MemoryStickDuo slot built in.
> >>> If you agree to order 5 phones is a deal.
> >>> Total amount is 1750EURO+about 70EURO for the Western union transfere fee to
> >>> Italy.
> >>> We offer you shipping taxes included in the price and our company offer you
> >>> shippmnet inssured 1750EURO,no fee,for a safle delivery to Germany.
> >>> As we told you before units are boxed at UPS and if we will have a deal we
> >>> will make the reservation forst and we will confirm you'r order.
> >>> We will provide you the origianlinvoice from UPS,a copy of the shipping to
> >>> you
> >>> and the UPS tr#.
> >>> Please confirm us you agree with the price and send us the shipping details
> >>> so
> >>> we can proced with the order.
> >>>
> >>> Kind regards,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: David Weissenberg <dw@globalassets.com>
> >>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 23:42:52 +0200
> >>> To: xxx xxx <xxxx@europe.com>
> >>> Subject: Re: P800 offer
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Sir,
> >>>>
> >>>> I have no problem ordering 5 phones, but I would need the proof that you
> >>>> indeed have these items in stock and ready to ship.
> >>>> Also, you omitted to answer my question whether these P800 are the ones
> >>>> with
> >>>> MemoryStickDuo slot built in?
> >>>>
> >>>> Regards,
> >>>>
> >>>> DW
> >>>>
> >>>>> From: "xxx xxxx" <xxxxx@europe.com>
> >>>>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 16:28:20 -0500
> >>>>> To: dw@globalassets.com
> >>>>> Subject: P800 offer
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Dear csutomer,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Units are boxed at UPS ready to delivery.
> >>>>> We could not sell just 1 units because all fees are to expensive.
> >>>>> We accept paypal just for the entire lot of phones.
> >>>>> We sell minimum 5 phones.
> >>>>> Please advice us how many units you want to buy and send us the shipping
> >>>>> details.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>>> From: David Weissenberg <dw@globalassets.com>
> >>>>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 20:41:22 +0200
> >>>>> To: xxx xxx <xxxx@europe.com>
> >>>>> Subject: Re: p800 offer
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Sir,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We are indeed interested in your P800 offer. We would initially be
> >>>>>> looking
> >>>>>> to purchase one unit to sample the device, and potentially be interested
> >>>>>> in
> >>>>>> your whole lot.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Could you confirm the following details so we can move forward with this
> >>>>>> transaction:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Are these SonyEricsson P800 units are the models with the "Memory Stick
> >>>>>> DUO"
> >>>>>> slot?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> You mention these units can be shipped within 48 hours, are they
> >>>>>> currently
> >>>>>> in Europe?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> You mention you can accept PayPal for the purchase of the lot of 30
> >>>>>> units;
> >>>>>> is it possible for you to accept PayPal for a single unit purchase also?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Also, would it be possible for you to email me photos of some of the
> >>>>>> units
> >>>>>> you have in stock.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> David Weissenberg
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From: "xxx xxxx" <xxx@europe.com>
> >>>>>>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 12:41:29 -0500
> >>>>>>> To: dw@globalassets.com
> >>>>>>> Subject: p800 offer
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Dear customer,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Thank you for you'r e-mail.
> >>>>>>> The company is in EUROPE and we have 30 units availeble for sale.
> >>>>>>> We have a range of Electronics and Computers perhiperals to suit every
> >>>>>>> organization's or person needs and budget. All our Computers/Laptops -
> >>>>>>> Electronics, are custom made to order, therefore, you may pick and
> >>>>>>> choose
> >>>>>>> only those items which will provide you with the best system to suit
> >>>>>>> your
> >>>>>>> requirements.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Our company offer u Shippment assured - INTERNATIONALY/INSIDE COUNTRY
> >>>>>>> shipped.
> >>>>>>> - USUALLY NO FEE.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Units are brand new in the box and it will came with 3 years
> >>>>>>> internationaly
> >>>>>>> warranty and all original documents.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> USUALLY SHIPS - 24/48 hours
> >>>>>>> CONDITION - NEW
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> - SHIPPING -
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Service : UNITED POSTAL/PARCEL SERVICE
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Fees : $129 - UPS Express
> >>>>>>> $89 - UPS 2 Days Air
> >>>>>>> $79 - UPS 3 Days Air
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> Please let us remind you we have negociable and promitional prices!!!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We have 20 units availeble for sale,same specs.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We have a buy now price for 350EURO+Western Union transfere fee to
> >>>>>>> EUROPE
> >>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>> 1 unit.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> If you will buy more then 10 phones you will benefy 10% discount.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> If you will buy more then 15 phones you will benefy 20% discount.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> IF YOU WILL BUY THE ENTIRE LOT OF 30 PHONES YOU WILL BENIFY A VERY BIG
> >>>>>>> DISCOUNT AND THE PRICE WILL BE 6990EURO and we will accept paypal.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Our agents - are looking forward to recive funds using
> >>>>>>> WESTERN UNION or bank wire transfere service. Easy and safe.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> - PAYMENT - MONEY ORDER,because the money should be sent in
> >>>>>>> Europe at the company.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> All we need is u'r full name and address where the unit will be shipped.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Please advice us how many units you want to buy so we could make you an
> >>>>>>> offer.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We will send our contact/agent's billing address as soon
> >>>>>>> as we will recive your REPLY.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Don't hesitate to get back immediatly.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We are looking forward to hear from you.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>>>>> From: dw@globalassets.com
> >>>>>>> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2002 09:11:39 PDT
> >>>>>>> To: xxxx@europe.com
> >>>>>>> Subject: Question for seller -- Item #908513952
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Hello,
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Do you have this item in stock, ready to ship?
> >>>>>>>> Is it possible to pay using paypal?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Thanks.
> >>>>>>>> --------------------
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Question from: iridium69
> >>>>>>>> Title of item: New Sony Ericsson P800 for sale
> >>>>>>>> Seller: sugipulaat
> >>>>>>>> Starts: Sep-21-02 20:40:52 PDT
> >>>>>>>> Ends: Sep-24-02 20:40:52 PDT
> >>>>>>>> Price: Currently EUR 181.00
> >>>>>>>> To view the item, go to:
> >>>>>>>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...&item=908513952
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> __________________________________________________ ________
> >>>>>>> Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com
> >>>>>>> http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup
>

Posted by: ComedicIntent

Wow, you're right. They ARE subtle! I'm surprised he didn't try to sell you the Arc D'Triumph as well. I must admit, it was very entertaining to read someone toying with the con-artists for once! Sadly though, for every informed person like yourself, I'm sure 5 others get taken.
-C.I.

Posted by: iridium

ComedicIntent,

Check out this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...item=1383450091
As you can see it lists only one item and has even "Escrow possible" enabled

Here is my email to him yesterday, and todays response

)
----------------
(ME)
Hello,

Can you confirm you have this phone in stock and ready to ship?
Is this the model with a "Memory Stick DUO" slot?

Thanks.
--------------------
(SELLER, notice the quality of the sales pitch, and again the Tracking scam, this time with Fedex)

DERA CUSTOMER,
I want to tell you that the final price for one pices is 267GBP.If you want to buy 4 pices you get one free.I have 37 pices brand new,sim free and the phoneS is Memory Stick DUO.
If you want to buy, I can send the phone tomorrow.
If you are interested in buying,here are our standard
procedure.
We use for shippment FEDEX Express so you will receive your unit in maximum 2 days after shippment.The payment is to be done through Western Union money transfer as our company is in Europe.We will make the reservation for the shippment before you will make the payment and we will send you a copy of the shippment details and a copy of the FEDEX tracking number.
After we will receive the confirmation from the bank that the funds have been received we will shipp you the unit.
You don`t have to worry about the Import taxes for the shippment as we will declair the shippement value only 20GBP so you will not have to pay any additional taxes.
So,if you agree,please reply with all requiered details for the shippement.
We will be waiting for your reply as soon as posibile so we can proceed with the deal.
Best regards,
-----------------------------
(ME.... BWT I love escrow.com, they are fast, not expensive, and easy to use)
Your ebay auction mentions that you accept escrow for payment. I would like to use escrow.com if we decide to go forward with this transaction.
Also could you email me photos showing you do indeed have these items in stock.
Thank you.
----------------------------
(SELLER... )
SORRY BUT I NEDD THE MONEY VERY FAST AND IF ACCEPT escrow THE DEAL IS TO TIME FOR MY.

Posted by: iridium

here is the last email I got from the first scammer, along with my response... I guess this is the last time I'll hear from him ...
---------
Dear David,

Did you sent ehf money yet?
We are still waiting for the payment so we can ship the phones,because the package is in stand by at UPS.

Kind regards,
-------------
Sir,

I have not sent the money, as you have failed to answer my questions and I believe you do not have any P800 units. The UPS tracking number you sent me unsolicited means absolutely nothing except that you created a tracking on the UPS website... If I am wrong and you do indeed have these P800 units as described, then please ship them to me and I will wire you a payment upon receipt. Thank you.

Regards,

DW

Posted by: ComedicIntent

Hahaha!!!
I tried to use that line at a car dealship once...
Well, I hear that the subway is quite nice this time of year!
I took another look at the ebay auctions. Not only do ALL of them use the same 4 pictures, but there isn't a SINGLE seller with a rating above 0! Personally, I'm dissapointed. It's like they're not even trying anymore...
-C.I.

"SORRY BUT I NEDD THE MONEY VERY FAST AND IF ACCEPT escrow THE DEAL IS TO TIME FOR MY."

Posted by: nowson

is there any way that paypal can retract money if there is a possible fraudulent seller? i currently tried to buy a p800 from someone on ebay.ca. he's from salt lake city, he posted his number and everything, he has good feedback(one bad one, but it wasn't that bad, it was just some dad complaing about a scrathed up motorcycle piece he purchased from him for his son) we've talked many times and he seems pretty cool. I checked out the area code on his number to see if he really IS from salt lake, and he is. What do you guys think

i'm skurred

he seems ligit and pretty trusting. i guess we'll just have to see.

Posted by: [MDS]

hey , i got scammed just like that... two years ago, i was getting an 8890, it was new and hot. i just registred to ebay and was naive, so i bid i win, before that i established pretty strong communication pattern with the seller... so then all of a suden he gets fifteen negative feedbacks and gets suspended, dissapears, defrauds over 20 people in couple of days, so now he's got 400 from each of us... and vanished... i got my money back, eventually,my bank caught the *******, but it took around 3 month... so be ware, we were talking, alright, until a certain point.... so i fell for it once, but that was just pathetic in my case the phone was out, the guy had an american address, not veryfied pay pal, but then no one had, paypal just started back then... so there were not enough means to protect the consumer, but now i smell fraud miles away, i got a special instinct developed after that crap. be careful man and best of luck...

Posted by: nowson

i did pay through paypal, but it was my buddies account. so there is some sort of way to get your money back eventually? i guess only if he gets caught that is. my buddy told me he was a certified paypal user. i'm really starting to get worried. how do you go about trying to get your money back?

Posted by: bingo

There's been a report in the UK (admitedly on a not-very-reliable TV show) about escrow fraud as well, so you probably still have to be careful when using that.

Watchdog report

Watchdog is a program where naive (i.e. fairly dim) people explain to the nation how they got ripped off. It doesn't have a good track record for accuracy, and is a bit like a tabloid newspaper but on TV.

Posted by: [MDS]

it gets even more complicated... you have screwed your buddy, i see... so now if the guy is a fraud, your buddy's money will be gone? right? anyway... all i am saying, ebay protects up to 200 i think, pay pal another 300, but to get all the money it will take like a month or even three month, i mean i got screwed like in april, got my money back in september.. so go figure, if u used amex or something with nice fraud protection, you should get the money right away, and another thing, they might credit your account right away (i now remember, my bank fleet, they gave me the money back within 4 days... but that there is always a danger that they won't catch the guy and you will have to give the money back.... so all i am saying, is you will have the cash, but also you will need to deal with the feeling that that money isnot yours) finally, i mean i got screwed, the guy had 15+ rating, then overnight, it went to -15 ( i am not kidding) he just vanished, and i was talking to him on the phone... online, on the msn messenger, yahoo.. all possible things.. because he was taking his time mailing the thing.. i got the tracking number... it showed same crap. that it is headed to my house... and bluf.... no guy... no more response, no more support, no more shite... so honestly, i think you might be in trouble, but lets hope for the best...
btw; tell us the link to the product, how much did you pay... what is the guys actual feedback. lets all see into it....

Posted by: nowson

i will definetly try to get that item number. but i have to rush to work right now(go figure, i sell cell phones) i deeply appreciate your responses and i hope to get more feedback from you guys later. btw-I paid $480 us, which is like $750 can. i live in toronto. thanks again guys, i'll talk to you guys soon.

Posted by: MrSavoy

You know Ebay really is great it brings buyers and sellers from all over the worlld together and you can sell/buy things never before possible with ease. Thats all great and good but I agree, something has to be done about the fraud. I think there needs to be an international consortium of cyber cops to deal with this. They need access to all govt's systems to catch people. Because without it I don't think ebay or any other sites like it can really prosper. I knoe ebay is doing really really well but, all it takes is 6 months or a year of people constantly ripped off and as fast as ebay grew is as fast as they can dwindle. It's all word of mouth imo.

Posted by: nowson

here is the link for the auction. Another problem is that i didn't actually bid on it, i actually bought on the side

my friend(the person which let me use their paypal) told me not to worry, and that the guy was a premier user and he should be ligit, and tried to re-assure me that there should be a way to retract your money if all else fails. check this guy out and let me know what you guys think...

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...1392596733&rd=1

Posted by: nowson

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...1392596733&rd=1

Posted by: jchris3201

Quote:

Originally posted by nowson
here is the link for the auction. Another problem is that i didn't actually bid on it, i actually bought on the side
my friend(the person which let me use their paypal) told me not to worry, and that the guy was a premier user and he should be ligit, and tried to re-assure me that there should be a way to retract your money if all else fails. check this guy out and let me know what you guys think...

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...1392596733&rd=1

If you purchased outside of eBay you are not protected by eBay even if the item was up for auction.

Posted by: nowson

yea i realized that, thanks. but what i posted never showed up. i posted the item number and hoped you guys would check the item number out and tell me what you think of the dude. i have no idea why the message didn't post, and it's quite frustrating. any way here is the item number, the only thing you could actually do is open another window, go to ebay and check the item number out. the # is 1392596733....i hope you guys reply! thanks!..

Posted by: [MDS]

i don't even know what to tell you here, honestly i don't think you have done the right thing by sending the guy money... another point is that he does not have any feedback for selling phones, only some bike parts... and if you did not bid, and he only has one, so what about the guy who had actually won the item on ebay???? it looks cheezy, please keep us informed....

Posted by: flyhen

[QUOTE]Originally posted by iridium
[B]ComedicIntent,

Check out this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...item=1383450091

sadly, someone already fell for this scam... we need to inform more people on ebay