In-depth: How do we fight the fakes/clones?

[skatistic888]

I am totally clueless when it comes to Artes nowadays, I've held a clone in my hand and I had no idea...They seem to be spot on appearence-wise, technical specifications are most likely off even though I didn't get to turn it on

I am starting to think that those housings are real but the guts are different..The reason I think this is that housings are made in China even in genuine Nokias, even if they are assembled in Finland, Germany or Korea (or Made by Nokia)

I was gonna wait for the next price drop but I may not buy the Arte at all if I can't even be sure what I am getting

[slashd0t]

As long as you can see the OS, it's pretty obvious if it's real or fake.. Just make sure to order it from a reputable shop and you have nothing to worry about... Unfortunately, these scammers have made eBay and places like it places to avoid.. Too bad eBay doesn't police these things better

[jaekidd1012]

I agree with Slashd0t. These scammers use sites like EBay to rip people off by selling these fakes and they don't do anything about it. The most a buyer can do is leave negative feedback... It's hard and, in some cases, impossible to distinguish a real phone from a fake when buying online because the crooks can steal pics of the real thing and post them. Being able to distinguish between the real thing and the knockoff and dealing locally or with trusted sources is the best bet.

[james42519]

so what would you call the helio? it is samsung phones but have a different os so does that make it a clone or what? and if you are happy with something it shouldn't matter if it is a clone or generic. it is mostly a status symbol and i don't like that kind of stuff now.

[slashd0t]

so what would you call the helio? it is samsung phones but have a different os so does that make it a clone or what? and if you are happy with something it shouldn't matter if it is a clone or generic. it is mostly a status symbol and i don't like that kind of stuff now.

Simple... Some people don't want to support illegal activities and fraud.

[alexandre77]

you forget. the originals are made in china too so?

you right

[RedDragonUT]

I am new here, but this thread bugs me. If the cell phone companies weren't rapping us so bad then I could afford a 600 dollar phone. Instead the Iphone Clone I picked up will do everything I want (mainly making calls and listening to music) plus still look cool compared to a base line phone. So I would be stupid not to save myself some money.

Oh and show me exactly where it is illegal to have a phone that is touch screen and has some of the same options as a iphone. If so then all phones would be illegal except for the first brick phone.

[Moderator HF 25]

^ Hi, welcome to HoFo but I couldn't agree more! First, if you can't AFFORD to own a piece of expensive, non-essential article i.e. fancy gadget, then accept the reality. I could understand what you're saying about the copycats/follower however the distinction w/ the knock-off/clones/fakes: they're trying to IMITATE EVERYTHING incl the BRAND! This is wrong.

Imagine this: you've invented the a very cool Reddragon phone that will revolutionize the way we communicate, then someone copy your idea as a copycat/follower. You can accept the fact, it's all natural because you're ALWAYS the first, the leader. Then another guy copy your phone in the exact looks, packaging and details, but stuff w/ diff software, hardware inside. He's also selling his phone w/ everything you've built upon: A REPUTATION. The world knows about your great idea, great phone but surely don't know anything about this guy. Do not still think it's legit and deserves a place to even sell his side by side w/ yours? If it isn't Reddragon, so be it. But why could a knock-off/clones/fakes be allowed to be a "Reddragon" and selling as a "Reddragon"?

[RedDragonUT]

I understand the argument about someone saying that its a real Iphone or whatever when its not being illegal and whatnot. However I went into it knowing its not the real thing, and the advertising doesn't say it is.

I just believe in a free market, if you see something that people might like and can offer a version of it cheaper then why not get a share of the pie. The clones aren't saying they are the phone, just offering a cheaper version. Its only illegal by the way if they install the same O/S and market it as the same thing. Otherwise as I stated everything we use would be illegal except for the original person to come up with that idea.

[kyosuke]

I understand the argument about someone saying that its a real Iphone or whatever when its not being illegal and whatnot. However I went into it knowing its not the real thing, and the advertising doesn't say it is.

I just believe in a free market, if you see something that people might like and can offer a version of it cheaper then why not get a share of the pie. The clones aren't saying they are the phone, just offering a cheaper version. Its only illegal by the way if they install the same O/S and market it as the same thing. Otherwise as I stated everything we use would be illegal except for the original person to come up with that idea.

Most clone phones do just that though and Nokia is like #1 they do advertise it as the real deal and try to deceive people out of money they busted their *** for. Just for some swindler to come along and pawn off a fake to them.

That is the main purpose of fakes. They take nice phones and try an make a carbon copy of it and if you dont know then you are easily taken advantage of. Most people are clueless to fakes and think they are getting a good deal.

If you know its fake and thats fine with you,then your in the wrong thread. This is for people not wanting to get scamed because they can not tell and want to stop the illegal trafficking of counterfeit merchandise.

[RedDragonUT]

No this is the right thread to be in. Because you accused those ebayers of promising a Iphone and getting a IBroke. When in reality they are not. So you can have your witch hunt if you like, but as someone that has taken the time before throwing down cash they aren't promising the iphone.

[dohdough]

I understand the argument about someone saying that its a real Iphone or whatever when its not being illegal and whatnot. However I went into it knowing its not the real thing, and the advertising doesn't say it is.

I just believe in a free market, if you see something that people might like and can offer a version of it cheaper then why not get a share of the pie. The clones aren't saying they are the phone, just offering a cheaper version. Its only illegal by the way if they install the same O/S and market it as the same thing. Otherwise as I stated everything we use would be illegal except for the original person to come up with that idea.

Is the free market some kind of new religion or something? There's no such thing as a free market because that would rely on perfect knowledge of products. There never has been and never will be a free market.

Legality has to do with copyright, patents, licensing, and intellectual property. Your example of the ibroke is flawed because if they're marketing it as a comparative product, then they need a full spec and functionality comparison in order to reach your new conservative catchphrase called the "free-market." If there's an honest comparison, then people won't have an issue, but we all know that cloners generally prey on the uneducated consumer.

[Moderator HF 25]

I understand the argument about someone saying that its a real Iphone or whatever when its not being illegal and whatnot. However I went into it knowing its not the real thing, and the advertising doesn't say it is.

I just believe in a free market, if you see something that people might like and can offer a version of it cheaper then why not get a share of the pie. The clones aren't saying they are the phone, just offering a cheaper version. Its only illegal by the way if they install the same O/S and market it as the same thing. Otherwise as I stated everything we use would be illegal except for the original person to come up with that idea.

^ Of course, all the smart ppl would understand "buyer bewares" when things get too good/cheap to be true. Though you may not have a prob, however, we aren't even talking about a "cheaper" version or "look alike", "replica" at all: We're finger-pointing those crooks selling ppl a fake but claims to be GENUINE article w/ the price of a GENUINE article. It's already bad to encourage the imitation/look-alike/replica, at least it tells everyone upfront it ISN'T SAME REAL thing, but it's the WORST to call it REAL! Don't tie "free market" w/ the crooks! What real is real, no exception.

[GadgetTravel]

Fakes have obvious giveaways... shouldn't be too hard to spot cuz the dimensions may not add up, features and specs will be different. I don't see what the big deal is cuz price should be an indicator as well. It's not like fake clothing where it may be harder to spot unless u know exactly what to look for but fake mobiles will never match the quality of the real thing.

Im not an expert on fake phones by any means, but I wouldnt be so sure that they are all that easy to detect. There is clearly an ascertainment bias at work here, in that you only detect the ones that are relatively easy to detect, if they are close to the original, they may not be detected.

While I dont know much about fake phones, I do know a bit about fake watches. Most are real easy to detect. But some are simply impossible to detect without being a watchmaker, and tough even then. I have heard of two cases, and Im am sure there are more, of fake, high end Swiss watches. One was discussed in an online forum, the other happened to a friend of mine. In both cases jewelers even took them apart and thought they were real. In one case it wasnt discovered until the manufacturer took it apart and compared codes on some of the internal pieces to determine that they didnt match. I realize that the markup in watches is such that it provides more motive and capability to make a good fake. The watches in question were in the 12-14 grand range new. But with phones being in the $800 - $1000 range and I think easier and cheaper to fake than watches, I would be concerned. And by the way, my friend bought his watch used from a decades old store in Switzerland. They apparently got taken as well by someone who sold it to them. They did give him his money back when it was discovered, however.

[RedDragonUT]

As I said, there is not difference between att getting a phone by one manufacture that looks and acts like a phone from t-mobile made by someone different. It happens all the time and will because of the free market. I just think some are pissed that they paid 600 bucks for a phone that they could have gotten cheaper if they looked around.

You know for such a big site for cell phones, you guys sure are not welcoming to anyone outside of your little phone circle.