T-Mobile is deploying 1900MHz HSPA/4G

[Androided]

There are a few, I think the Amaze is one and then one or two of the Samsungs.

Yes, you are right.
there are few phones with at&t 1900 band 3G..
thanks for pointing out .

[terryjohnson16]

How much pcs does att have? Do they have enough to give away to tmobile since they claim a spectrum shortage?

Will deploying pcs 3g hurt the 2g customers?

Even if they dual band 3g, apple will want $$$ just to give tmobile a shot at selling.

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[Kies]

If they increase power and reduce cell shrinkage of the 3G/4G network, they wouldn't need so much spectrum for GSM. As of right now, there are way too many structures that have GSM only coverage because WCDMA/3G drops out completely when you have roughly -95dBm on GSM and higher in some limited places (like Town Square in Las Vegas for example; a cell tower is close but the 3G/4G signal is weak) and higher for handsets with poorer 3G/4G reception.

So, yeah.. unless they actually focus to increase backhaul on the network where they have limited backhaul or where they don't have enough spectrum capacity and have reduced 3G/4G cell coverage to reduce network load, they will rely on GSM as a fallback. This new tower that got 3G earlier this year is still running on T1 backhaul or limited some-other-type of backhaul it seems and what did they do? They did some major network optimization and completely blocked YouTube. First they turned down the power to a 1/3 of the coverage it used to be (which was a good move honestly because it was running at 50Kbps even at 2AM). I'm guessing the reason being is that this is not a high traffic area and the "budget" prohibits them from doing backhaul upgrades this year. I see microwave dishes too on this site.

On the site further down the road which does not have DC-HSPA but does have 21Mbps HSPA+ speeds, they cut the ebb7 sector down so badly that it drops out as soon as you leave the area of the shopping center and are eventually left with EDGE on the same serving cell. On the 15 freeway, 3G/4G drops out badly of the weak signal and new construction. They only really upgraded this site to serve the Silverton and the immediate shopping center and it shows; they cut the coverage down so badly that those are the only two places that have an "ok" WCDMA signal. In the same shopping complex where the tower is located you can have a GSM signal of -65dBm but a WCDMA signal of -95 or so dBm if you are pointed towards the residential area, decatur blvd and the next shopping center over (ebb7 serving cell). What really bothers is that if they do cut down the power do NOT restore it to better coverage levels even if they increase backhaul or spectrum and speeds are 8Mbps all day long, from .10-.40Mbps before. Then there is a cell tower that was also activated this year but only got about 1Mbps during the day where they cut the power down so bad that you need to be next to the tower to get ANY 3G signal from the ee53 sector. It at the very FIRST moment of activation extended ALL the way into the Walmart and over to the 215! Now you can't even pick it up during the day and are left with 1 bar of 4G outside of the walmart, you can guess what you get inside.. -85-95dBm of GSM on the same serving cell. I have absolutely no idea why they did this because the speeds were OK but not amazing. This is mostly a problem in the SW part of Las Vegas but I also noticed it severely in some parts of North Las Vegas.




Here is the tower where they blocked ports for YouTube. During the day speeds are much lower naturally. Oddly enough this tower is usually running on full rate voice.
tl:dr: T-Mobile relies on their GSM coverage way too fukn much.

[Guest 214]

If they increase power and reduce cell shrinkage of the 3G/4G network, they wouldn't need so much spectrum for GSM. As of right now, there are way too many structures that have GSM only coverage because WCDMA/3G drops out completely when you have roughly -95dBm on GSM and higher in some limited places (like Town Square in Las Vegas for example; a cell tower is close but the 3G/4G signal is weak) and higher for handsets with poorer 3G/4G reception.

So, yeah.. unless they actually focus to increase backhaul on the network where they have limited backhaul or where they don't have enough spectrum capacity and have reduced 3G/4G cell coverage to reduce network load, they will rely on GSM as a fallback. This new tower that got 3G earlier this year is still running on T1 backhaul or limited some-other-type of backhaul it seems and what did they do? They did some major network optimization and completely blocked YouTube. First they turned down the power to a 1/3 of the coverage it used to be (which was a good move honestly because it was running at 50Kbps even at 2AM). I'm guessing the reason being is that this is not a high traffic area and the "budget" prohibits them from doing backhaul upgrades this year. I see microwave dishes too on this site.

On the site further down the road which does not have DC-HSPA but does have 21Mbps HSPA+ speeds, they cut the ebb7 sector down so badly that it drops out as soon as you leave the area of the shopping center and are eventually left with EDGE on the same serving cell. On the 15 freeway, 3G/4G drops out badly of the weak signal and new construction. They only really upgraded this site to serve the Silverton and the immediate shopping center and it shows; they cut the coverage down so badly that those are the only two places that have an "ok" WCDMA signal. In the same shopping complex where the tower is located you can have a GSM signal of -65dBm but a WCDMA signal of -95 or so dBm if you are pointed towards the residential area, decatur blvd and the next shopping center over (ebb7 serving cell). What really bothers is that if they do cut down the power do NOT restore it to better coverage levels even if they increase backhaul or spectrum and speeds are 8Mbps all day long, from .10-.40Mbps before. Then there is a cell tower that was also activated this year but only got about 1Mbps during the day where they cut the power down so bad that you need to be next to the tower to get ANY 3G signal from the ee53 sector. It at the very FIRST moment of activation extended ALL the way into the Walmart and over to the 215! Now you can't even pick it up during the day and are left with 1 bar of 4G outside of the walmart, you can guess what you get inside.. -85-95dBm of GSM on the same serving cell. I have absolutely no idea why they did this because the speeds were OK but not amazing. This is mostly a problem in the SW part of Las Vegas but I also noticed it severely in some parts of North Las Vegas.




Here is the tower where they blocked ports for YouTube. During the day speeds are much lower naturally. Oddly enough this tower is usually running on full rate voice.
tl:dr: T-Mobile relies on their GSM coverage way too fukn much.

I'm guessing they could possibly having some issue's getting backhaul in from the LEC or their fiber provider there. T-Mobile rely's on AT&T here for fiber, and for reasons unknown to me, there are many random HSPA+ capable tower's that are T1 fed in the major parts of Birmingham. Verizon uses Metro Ethernet from Level 3 around here, I guess they don't trust AT&T enough or they take their sweet time.

Another thing that could come into play in your area is cell shrinkage or the way the AWS antenna's are angled? I do notice in rural area's around here with AT&T, they turn the power down on UMTS so as you get further out it falls back to GSM on the same tower with much better signal even though both are running on the same 850mhz band. Likely because as you get users further away, cell breathing phenomenon becomes more apparent, and they don't have the capacity because they won't build new sites.

Now that could be something totally different from whats happening there, but likely unlike AT&T they are just pushing customers to GSM to preserve voice service instead of keeping them on 3G until the call just completely fails like many AT&T areas are.

[Guest 214]

I'm going to borrow my friends SIM card tomorrow and put it in my dual band 3G AT&T phone and see if we are up and running PCS 3G here in Birmingham.

We have SEVERE capacity issues with T-Mobile in the city center during peak times because we are one of the markets with only 10mhz of spectrum. During peak times, calls will immediately go down to GSM as do incoming calls. Yet data is still a useable 2mbit/s. They are likely employing a similar technique AT&T used a few years ago called N-SET. Calls go to GSM, and data stays on UMTS for capacity. Though they are applying it to all user's now, not just feature phone's. Losing simultaneous voice and data isn't as important to T-Mobile because they don't heavily rely on it to bring in customers like AT&T does in every single ad they have.

Until T-Mobile gets some seriously needed funding, relying on their GSM network and supplementing user's with HSPA+ on PCS, and maybe even DC-HSPA+ will do for now.

I really hope they are able to implement HSPA+ 84 MIMO this next year across the board somehow because as great as HSPA+ 42 is, one thing it won't ever be as good at compared to LTE is edge of cell speeds. MIMO will allow much higher edge of cell throughput, typically it doesn't matter for most because they are in a large city, but people who are bordering UMTS, this will greatly improve speeds and there won't be a need to migrate to LTE for a while.

If T-Mobile gets this breakup money like I hope and this additional spectrum, there is absolutely no reason why they should kick Sprint's butt and advance far.

[Kies]

They dont do that here at all

[tmotk]

Even if they dual band 3g, apple will want $$$ just to give tmobile a shot at selling.

Not if T-Mobile just requires people to get the iPhones non subsidized. In fact that might be smart, rather than to raise prices on all the plans to make their iPhone tithe to Apple.

[Kies]

What they could do is offer a bill credit over 6 months or so for anyone that brings over an unlocked iPhone. They should be offering that + a free WiFi hotspot right now but.. they aren't trying to be truly innovative.



Reports of PCS 3G in Birmingham, AL too (10MHz of AWS, 40MHz of PCS)

[money69]

I agree, there are several areas here in Houston where the 3G will drop out and the phone will revert to a really good EDGE signal. Its a little annoying but I can deal with it. In general the 4G speeds we have here are very good and I dont have many complaints especially for what I pay per month.

If they increase power and reduce cell shrinkage of the 3G/4G network, they wouldn't need so much spectrum for GSM. As of right now, there are way too many structures that have GSM only coverage because WCDMA/3G drops out completely when you have roughly -95dBm on GSM and higher in some limited places (like Town Square in Las Vegas for example; a cell tower is close but the 3G/4G signal is weak) and higher for handsets with poorer 3G/4G reception.

So, yeah.. unless they actually focus to increase backhaul on the network where they have limited backhaul or where they don't have enough spectrum capacity and have reduced 3G/4G cell coverage to reduce network load, they will rely on GSM as a fallback. This new tower that got 3G earlier this year is still running on T1 backhaul or limited some-other-type of backhaul it seems and what did they do? They did some major network optimization and completely blocked YouTube. First they turned down the power to a 1/3 of the coverage it used to be (which was a good move honestly because it was running at 50Kbps even at 2AM). I'm guessing the reason being is that this is not a high traffic area and the "budget" prohibits them from doing backhaul upgrades this year. I see microwave dishes too on this site.

On the site further down the road which does not have DC-HSPA but does have 21Mbps HSPA+ speeds, they cut the ebb7 sector down so badly that it drops out as soon as you leave the area of the shopping center and are eventually left with EDGE on the same serving cell. On the 15 freeway, 3G/4G drops out badly of the weak signal and new construction. They only really upgraded this site to serve the Silverton and the immediate shopping center and it shows; they cut the coverage down so badly that those are the only two places that have an "ok" WCDMA signal. In the same shopping complex where the tower is located you can have a GSM signal of -65dBm but a WCDMA signal of -95 or so dBm if you are pointed towards the residential area, decatur blvd and the next shopping center over (ebb7 serving cell). What really bothers is that if they do cut down the power do NOT restore it to better coverage levels even if they increase backhaul or spectrum and speeds are 8Mbps all day long, from .10-.40Mbps before. Then there is a cell tower that was also activated this year but only got about 1Mbps during the day where they cut the power down so bad that you need to be next to the tower to get ANY 3G signal from the ee53 sector. It at the very FIRST moment of activation extended ALL the way into the Walmart and over to the 215! Now you can't even pick it up during the day and are left with 1 bar of 4G outside of the walmart, you can guess what you get inside.. -85-95dBm of GSM on the same serving cell. I have absolutely no idea why they did this because the speeds were OK but not amazing. This is mostly a problem in the SW part of Las Vegas but I also noticed it severely in some parts of North Las Vegas.




Here is the tower where they blocked ports for YouTube. During the day speeds are much lower naturally. Oddly enough this tower is usually running on full rate voice.
tl:dr: T-Mobile relies on their GSM coverage way too fukn much.

[danska]

I've learned thtat if i know for sure i am in a 3g or higher area, i keep my phone on wcdma only. If i don't, in places like the quad cities and very recently in wilmington, NC, it will bounce from edge to 3g and back a lot. Keep it on wcdma only and thats not an issue until i leave the 3g coverage. And wcdma isn't like edge in the fact that a low signal will result is no or extremely slow data. I can download pretty fast while my amaze 4g shows 1 or no bars of 4g.

[jet1000]

What Kies described is what I see way too often in my city, HSPA dropping out in favor of the GSM network. How fast HSPA is meaningless if they can't get citywide HSPA coverage.

If T-Mobile gets this breakup money like I hope and this additional spectrum, there is absolutely no reason why they should kick Sprint's butt and advance far.

Well the reason is that I think the Germans will pocket the $3 billion instead of spending more than their usual amount to upgrade the network.

I've learned thtat if i know for sure i am in a 3g or higher area, i keep my phone on wcdma only.

I'll have to try that out to see if that improves the bounce down.

[microhaxo]

Anyone test this in Minneapolis? I'd love to pick up a htc titan unlocked and run it on TMO 3g.

[Radiux36]

We should probably create a separate thread where users can post all confirmed cities and locations of 3G running on 1900mhz.

[terryjohnson16]

I tried the code thing on my gs2. It picked up several towers with dc hspa+.

How would tmobile get people over to pcs hspa+ if majority of their phones dont support pcs 1900 3g? Wouldnt tmobile phones that have the pcs band need to be unlocked like on the vibrant?

Fcc will show a phone having certain bands but when tmobile lists a phone, they tend to hide other 3g bands since they are exclusively using aws.

Not everyone knows what bands their phones support.

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[Kies]

None of these phones have blocked bands. The Vibrant/GS4G and etc. support 1900MHz out of the box with no modification required.

Radiux36: yeah we should