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Thread: Motorola DROID 4 XT894 Release Thread

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasaero View Post
    ... What I find very disconcerting is how few are willing to speak up and REALLY defend these choices I go on about. Most of you I think want more just like me and are just willing to "settle" with what has been offered to a larger extent than I because of fringe reception, love for Moto, or call quality or something that is probably a bit better on a Moto device. ...
    You're going to have to wait for defensive postures, because you would need either: 1) An engineer from Motorola who was involved in the design and development phase to speak up on why each specific compromise was made, or 2) Users who have used the device sufficiently long to analyze the device and come to a hypothesis as to why the engineers elected to go a particular direction. #1 is unlikely to happen, as such employees are no doubt under NDAs to not disclose their research. #2 can't possibly happen 24 hours after release - if you got this sort of response, I would easily suspect that we had a fanboy or zealot.

    Try to calm your horses and give it a bit of time. Fear not, there's no reason to be disconcerted -- yet.

    --Kidd
    Hear me on Twitter: @alexkidd1 / Fun connection:

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Pearl View Post
    One question that may seem ridiculous, but . . . how does the Droid 4 compare to the Stratosphere? I know that the Stratosphere is not as good in many respects, ie, the camera isn't good, etc. But it does have a decent keyboard, the display is good, it is LTE, and it is cheap. Just wondering if anyone has checked it out and what they think.
    The display on the Stratosphere is mind blowing -- I loved that. The battery life and reception was atrocious though. The display is a nice bonus, but relatively speaking last place in priority for me, so I sold it 2 months later for about $200 cash. Buying it was the worst decision I made in a long time. Since I blew my phone upgrade, I now have to spend $350 more (above the $200 I sold the Strat for) to get a Droid 4, which is the phone I most likely should have gotten for $200 to start with.

    --Kidd

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexKidd1977 View Post
    You're going to have to wait for defensive postures, because you would need either: 1) An engineer from Motorola who was involved in the design and development phase to speak up on why each specific compromise was made, or 2) Users who have used the device sufficiently long to analyze the device and come to a hypothesis as to why the engineers elected to go a particular direction. #1 is unlikely to happen, as such employees are no doubt under NDAs to not disclose their research. #2 can't possibly happen 24 hours after release - if you got this sort of response, I would easily suspect that we had a fanboy or zealot.

    Try to calm your horses and give it a bit of time. Fear not, there's no reason to be disconcerted -- yet.

    --Kidd
    I held it for 2 minutes and in less than that understood it had either the exact same screen as D3 and just tuned differently or maybe some other minor tweaks, but nothing to make the display of reasonable grade. That's one thing that stands out as a sore thumb to not being improved, but that was in biggest need of improvement as most see it as inferior to D1 and D2 other than size.

    But really my points go above engineering and to the marketing and product prelim design points. Why has NO Droid after OG Droid ever been a top tier device? Basically it's not just design choices themselves that engineer sorts would be making. It's quite clear the RAZR is what it is because of marketers demands for a razer thin device. Also pretty clear a lot of what the D4 is, is that way because of a price point goal. These are things the engineers are forced to design around. Basically my concerns don't lie with Motorola engineering so much as marketing and product planning and maybe engineering sorts involved at those levels. It seems somewhat clear these sorts are putting pretty hard requirements on designs that require too much compromise from the engineering. I think my real annoyance is that I am pretty confident Motorola has better device engineers than other companies that are producing devices I desire A LOT more than Motorola's.

    Then there is the bootloader locking they insist on blaming on VZW even though we now have GNex and most new HTC devices that don't have this issue. This is obviously not something the engineers are pushing. I don't like Blur either, but the BL would solve this issue for me. I had high hopes as I got to know my OG Droid for Moto and then realized Milestone peeps got screwed and more or less every device since.

  4. #64
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    @jasaero

    Most of your points are enlightening and well-taken. Personally, I find your contributions stimulating.

    Reality is though, that many just need to get the best compromise phone they can right now and get on with life. That, too, is their choice to make.

    Your effort to be briefer is appreciated.

    Perspective instantiates reality.
    ( By DX w/HoFo app. )
    Last edited by TC_Mits; 02-13-2012 at 04:58 AM.
    Learning Android root on my SGSIII while waiting for Ubuntu Phone OS.

    The Borg has assimilated US: Supreme Court Blocks Ban on Corporate Political Spending ~ "Resistance is futile."


    Perspective instantiates reality.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by TC_Mits View Post
    Reality is though, that many just need to get the best compromise phone they can right now and get on with life. That, too, is their choice to make.
    Thanks for the good words.

    What I quoted really is what bothers me. I didn't feel such a compromise was required of me with the OG Droid when I purchased it. There were maybe some compromises on Motorola's end, but I as a customer didn't feel I was making any in choosing that particular device as it was just clearly better than anything at the time. Camera(not the fastest or best colors, but VERY competitive), reception, call quality, display size/quality, latest android version, and the rest were all a match for most any device at the time or better. Processor was basically as good as it got for the snapshot in time it hit even though better were just around the bend.

    Things are more competitive now and it's less clear what exactly each consumer wants most(particularly display and device size wise), but I really think Motorola could being doing a lot better with just how broad the appeal of their devices could be.

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    These Droid-Life review quotes say it all!

    If this isn’t one of the worst screens to come out on a smartphone in the last year, I’d love for someone to show me what is.
    And who knows, the lack of ultra-smoothness could just be an optical illusion thanks to its crappy display.
    I may agree it's a "good enough" display for many in the end, but I really can't come up with a reply to Kellex's point here. When I tried the device I found it seemed just as bad as he is pointing out here. He is a pretty well respected personality in the Android community at this point also so Moto not impressing him isn't doing them any favors.

  7. #67
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    I suggest starting a thread where you can continue your crusade against Pentile displays and the downfall of Motorola due to their inability to understand that they are inherantly inferior and should be abolished.

    That seems to be all you are interested in doing here and every post you make is directed to that end.

    It gets old...sorry.
    kbman

    Droid RAZR M/HD MSM8960 does HSPA+ on US GSM carriers!

    If we knew what we were doing, they wouldn't call it research. - Albert Einstein

    Read more, post less.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jasaero View Post
    My only reason for posting here is in case people within Motorola who can make something different and better might understand some of us want A LOT more of a QWERTY slider. I doubt most who have written off this device or the RAZR as I have are even remaining hopeful Moto might eventually come through for those like us and are not even going to bother to publicize their criticism so much as speak with their wallets only as I have also done.
    I am going to help you out here and say this as nicely as possible, no disrespect meant.

    The people that make the decision on the display have not now, nor will they ever read your posts. Ever.
    Those decisions are made 6 months to 1 year before the device is released and there are always considerations that aren't considered here. And the guys that make them don't read the blogs, they can't because what they are looking at it further out than the people here can see. And take into items that you can't be aware of yet.

    I know if feels good to complain about your dream device, I have my own idea as well. But would your dream device sell well, and at a margin that makes since? Would the chips available in that time frame support it, and are they available (enough supply)? Do the costs work and what are the risks to the schedule? Is there something else coming that would affect your thoughts (new AP and new feature)? What is the battery and thermal situation? What is Google going to introduce in the next OS (contrary to popular belief, Google releases their OS to everyone at the same time with only some hints at what is coming base upon questions they ask)?

    So much in to every decision. At the end of the day is the D4 the best qwerty on the market? Is a better one on the way? If nothing better is coming than someone must have done a good job.

    One comment on the display, and only one. Perhaps the display criteria for the D4 and RAZR and GN are diffferent? Everyone speaks about trade offs, perhaps your trade offs are different than someone else?

  9. #69
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    I've been sitting on my upgrade credit for some time waiting specifically for this phone and finally ordered it online on Friday. I went to a Verizon store but they wouldn't give me the price it shows on their own Web site, which was 149.99 if I log in with my account. To the general public it shows as 199.99 of course. Go figure. In the end I got it for 119.99 including an additional $30 upgrade credit. I won't be complaining about much at that price.

    For those of you who actually have the phone, any more feedback on what I am looking forward to? The blur on the screen when scrolling is definitely annoying, I didn't notice it when I played with it as CES but it was very obvious when I played with it at the store last week. Probably because I was aware of it and really looking for it. Not looking for technical reasons why this is happening because it's a blah blah blah display, looking for usability and actual experience feedback, thx.

  10. #70
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    The scrolling blurriness is there and you can't hide it. It only becomes a problem if you're a speed reader, I'm not

  11. #71
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    D4 pros & cons -->

    Pros:
    LTE 4G plus...
    Possibly best tactile keyboard ever
    Dual-core with good speed
    Full gig of RAM
    SD card support
    HDMI
    8mp camera w/1080p video
    Gorilla glass
    LED notification
    Speaker is loud
    Moto build & reception
    Docks available
    ICS update likely
    Global update possible
    Rooted
    Best in its class atm
    Cheap.


    Cons:
    Poorly thought-out KB layout
    Aging tech [Note is [email protected]]
    Partitioned IM - only 50% available
    Not global & no ICS at release
    Encrypted bootloader
    Iffy battery life
    No battery pull resets
    Phone is trash if battery dies
    Battery has safety issues
    Display mediocre at best -
    Display ghosting & hatching
    Brickish by current fashion
    Only show in town


    Perspective instantiates reality.
    ( By DX w/HoFo app. )
    Last edited by TC_Mits; 02-13-2012 at 02:28 PM.

  12. #72
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    @ TC_Mits: did you buy the phone? Or are you summarizing pros/cons from what's been published about the phone?

    @Standard101: I bought the phone Friday night so I've only had a couple of days with it, but my overall impression is that this is a fantastic buy and - more importantly - a really great fit for my needs. I'm someone who uses my phone heavily for business purposes, but also manages my personal life with the phone. So the important features to me are reliability of signal, fast performance, great keyboard, great call quality, nice-enough camera (I have young kids), great ergonomics for handling my phone on the move.

    I'm sure you've read all the published facts on this phone so I won't cover the same ground. I also owned a galaxy nexus for a month and returned it due to call quality problems and lack of keyboard. Prior to that I've been a blackberry user, so that's my point of reference.

    - I think it's too early to tell on battery life, but so far I've been impressed (although I haven't taken it on a business trip yet). I'm easily getting a 12 - 14 hour day of usage, but I'm not doing gaming/videos during that time.

    - The ergonomics are really nice and far better for me than the GNex. I'm finding it easy to handle and use on the go, which is important since I'm traveling on business a lot (or hauling myself, numerous bags, and young kids around) and need to be nimble with my phone. The positioning of the lock key and volume keys is great. Only complaint is that when you slide the keyboard out it's hard to get to the volume keys and I would like to have a physical mute button like on my old blackberry. The ability to VERY quickly mute/unmute while on busines calls while working in noisy environments is important to me and having to toggle to the phone app and delicately press the mute key -- which is DANGEROUSLY NEAR THE END CALL button -- is a major bummer.

    - Call quality is excellent - much superior to the GNex and Blackberry. I use headphones and the sound is wonderfully crisp with strong volume levels. I'm down at 1/3 the total volume level and it's perfectly loud.

    - The sound in general on this phone is amazing. I was streaming Pandora through the speaker and through the headphones and it's a glorious sound! When I'm traveling, I love to listen to music while I'm enduring the endless torture of waiting in lines and transitioning. This phone is going to make those times so much better for me!

    - The keyboard is fantastic in terms of speed, accuracy and ease of adjustment. Coming from a blackberry, I don't see any problems with the layout of the keyboard. The D4 keyboard layout seems great to me (I like the equal sign being where it is for using the calculator). I would like to find out the hot keys for navigating and editing within text -- if there are any -- as that would make it close to perfect for me.

    - The camera has been better than I expected. I tried the RAZR camera in stores and it seems to me that the D4 camera is better than the RAZR. I didn't do a side-by-side so I'm not sure if that is an accurate assessment.


    That's all for now...

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by geekmomof3 View Post
    - I think it's too early to tell on battery life, but so far I've been impressed (although I haven't taken it on a business trip yet). I'm easily getting a 12 - 14 hour day of usage, but I'm not doing gaming/videos during that time.
    I'm looking forward to as much detail as you can provide on the battery life, geekmom. If I had this phone, I would no doubt use it for streaming audio or video for as much as an hour per day, at least one hour of phone calling, a few dozen text messages and/or e-mails and do that over a 24 hour period before going kaput. I can do this now with my Droid Pro with it's extended battery. (Extended for Droid Pro is about 1800mAh which is about the same as standard capacity on the D4 IIRC) If I use the Droid Pro very little, I can actually make it to about 36 hours on this battery from full charge with no wall visits in between.

    - Call quality is excellent - much superior to the GNex and Blackberry. I use headphones and the sound is wonderfully crisp with strong volume levels. I'm down at 1/3 the total volume level and it's perfectly loud.

    - The sound in general on this phone is amazing. I was streaming Pandora through the speaker and through the headphones and it's a glorious sound! When I'm traveling, I love to listen to music while I'm enduring the endless torture of waiting in lines and transitioning. This phone is going to make those times so much better for me!
    My friend who bought this phone said the same thing. He said he'd never heard a voice call so clear from any cell phone he had in the past. He asked me if it was perhaps going over the 4G network it was so clear? I had to give him the news that it's still 1X voice, but must just be a great speaker. He said he'll be very spoiled by the quality for years to come. When he was showing me the phone we were playing with some streaming audio and video and the speaker was incredible as well. I'm also very pleased with that aspect.

    Thanks so much for keeping us updated geekmom,

    --Kidd

  14. #74
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    I think its really too soon to determine battery life but it is certainly adequate. It seems somewhat shorter than Bionic with standard battery.

    I am in a 3g only service area 90% of the time so my experience may not reflect the average user's experience.

    It has lasted thru my 10 hour days at work with light to moderate use primarily browsing and gtalk and a few calls.

    The blurry text during scrolling is annoying but i dont think that is a result of the display but rather due to anti aliasing being disabled during scrolling to
    speed up the UI.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by geekmomof3 View Post
    @ TC_Mits:
    did you buy the phone? Or are you summarizing pros/cons from what's been published about the phone?
    ...
    I won't be buying a D4G MAXX until I can get one free, or nearly so. I worked mainly from posts in this thread.

    As to KB layout, here is an extended discussion:

    http://www.droidforums.net/forum/sho...d.php?t=193699


    .
    Quote Originally Posted by TC_Mits View Post
    D4 pros & cons -->

    Pros:
    LTE 4G plus...
    Possibly best tactile keyboard ever
    Dual-core with good speed
    Full gig of RAM
    SD card support
    HDMI
    8mp camera w/1080p video
    Gorilla glass
    LED notification
    Speaker is loud
    Moto build & reception
    Docks available
    ICS update likely
    Global update possible
    Rooted
    Best in its class atm
    Cheap.


    Cons:
    Poorly thought-out KB layout
    Aging tech [Note is [email protected]]
    Partitioned IM - only 50% available
    Not global & no ICS at release
    Encrypted bootloader
    Iffy battery life
    No battery pull resets
    Phone is trash if battery dies
    Battery has safety issues
    Display mediocre at best -
    Display ghosting & hatching
    Brickish by current fashion
    Only show in town

    Perspective instantiates reality.
    ( By DX w/HoFo app. )

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