In The News

[icemasta]

^^^^

Reading along the article:
"Ryan’s girlfriend had downloaded the app on her iPod through the iTunes App Store. HeyWire’s advertising on its App Store page says there is "no charge to you even if your friends don’t have the app."

"Both parties are thinking it’s free," Alex Dunsmore said. "There is no notification on her end, either. As far as she’s concerned, she’s texting for free."

I see this being more of an Heywire and customer issue than a Rogers issue, even that may be a stretch. The app says no charge to you, the user, not to the parties texting back.

The father understood completely that his son's plan includes unlimited texting to Canada and blames that his son didn't know he was texting a US area code so he shouldn't have to pay his dues. I can go then go by the same token and call any phone number I want and assume all my calls are local because I don't know if the area codes I'm calling are local or not.

As much as I'd want all carriers to adopt a MyWallet approach, blaming ignorance of not knowing area codes to debate this charge doesn't seem right.

[pjw918]

The father's argument was that there should have been notification of unusual charges. That his son didn't recognize the area code was secondary.

"Dunsmore said Rogers allowed 1,300 of those texts to go through in one month — all to the same number — without informing him his son's $35 "unlimited" texting plan was going way over the basic charge.

“Why was I not notified, as the legally responsible person in this contract, that there was suddenly this atypical spending?” Dunsmore asked."

We know that the carriers are perfectly capable of having the billing system trigger such alerts, as some now do under certain circumstances.

[icemasta]

The father's argument was that there should have been notification of the unusual charges. That his son didn't recognize the area code was secondary.

"Dunsmore said Rogers allowed 1,300 of those texts to go through in one month — all to the same number — without informing him his son's $35 "unlimited" texting plan was going way over the basic charge.

“Why was I not notified, as the legally responsible person in this contract, that there was suddenly this atypical spending?” Dunsmore asked."

We know that the carriers are perfectly capable of having the billing system trigger such alerts, as some now do under certain circumstances.

Sure the carriers are perfectly capable of triggering the alerts but not recognizing the area code was secondary is a moot point. Back to my example, by that token I call any phone number I want and assume all my calls are local because I don't know if the area codes I'm calling are local or not.

Look it would be nice for Rogers to backdate the charge for the son to add a US texting add-on, but ultimately the father knew the plan only included Canadian texting not US and since it's his name on the contract he is legally responsible for his sons actions. The app also stated there is no charge to the user, not her friends, so why would the son assume the user includes the son when he didn't have the app.

At least this isn't another people that get roaming text notifications and continue to rack up roaming charges only to play dumb and say I didn't know their plan didn't continue in a different country.

[pjw918]

I tend to look at things from the customer's perspective in these disputes, to help point the way to an appropriate and defensible resolution. The girlfriend lives down the block! she signs up for what is promoted as a free texting app, the son has an unlimited text package. If I were on the Rogers resolutions desk, I would not hesitate to have the charges adjusted off, and the account reinstated (with backdating of a US text add-on, just as you suggest). You can be sure someone at Rogers is getting their arse chewed for not having the judgement to do just that.

We'll eventually see alerts for overage/unusual charges become standard, with opt-out the option.

[xtachx]

Icemasta all carriers include international texts except rogers. Look at bellus / flankers.

But the best thing would be like what they do in India. After every chargeable transaction, a service message pops up informing you of the charge. Example, you make a call and when you hang up, a service message pops up "The last transaction cost $xx.xx. "

Sent from my Nexus One using HowardForums

[icemasta]

Icemasta all carriers include international texts except rogers. Look at bellus / flankers.

But the best thing would be like what they do in India. After every chargeable transaction, a service message pops up informing you of the charge. Example, you make a call and when you hang up, a service message pops up "The last transaction cost $xx.xx. "

Sent from my Nexus One using HowardForums

Just checked a Bell plan as an example and added it's unlimited text messages and it says otherwise. "Sent messages include domestic text messages and exclude international, roaming, alerts, premium text messages and messages sent with an instant messaging application."

Not trying to sound like a Rogers fanboy (I dont have any Rogers services anymore), but in this situation I need to side with Rogers.

[bluenote73]

One should be able to set limits, period. Not being able to do so is a cash grab pure and simple.

We've learned time and time again, that the big 3 will squeeze out as many dollars as they possibly can from us all. When one avenue dries up or gets too much public attention, they find another way.

Charging for texts in the first place was the biggest robbery in mobile history.

[Big Ang]

As much as I hate Rogers, I say the blame lands squarely on the boy.

Once the boy's girlfriend downloads the app, the boy starts received texts from an odd phone number, which the girl says belongs to her. So he texts that number back 1000+ times. Had he had an ounce of intelligence he would have googled where the area code was of the number he was texting to see if it was included in his "unlimited texting to Canadian numbers" plan. That's it. It's that simple.

The boy knew it was a number with a different area code, obviously one he didn't recognize. Whenever he texted his gf back he either had to see the number he was texting to, or he saw his gf's name because he stored that number in his address book under her name. Seeing that a huge majority of area codes in our phone system are in the US (and not covered by his "unlimited texts to Canadian cellphones" plan) the smart thing to do was to google the area code. He didn't do that, his fault for texting a US number 1000+ times.

It doesn't matter that his gf was 4 blocks away. It doesn't matter what app she was using (except that it explains WHY he was texting to a US number).

The boy screwed up. The boy's father overreacted. The Rogers customer service rep. didn't handle it well.

I heard that Rogers has offered to reinstate the accounts (so the father doesn't have to pay the cancelation charges). That's good. And I hear that Rogers is still asking him to pay for the texting fees. I think that's fair as well (since it wasn't Rogers' fault). However, since Rogers makes some money off those long distance texting fees (I know it costs them something, but it must be less than the 25cents they charge), perhaps Rogers can reduce the fees a little, just to smooth things over.

[droidacolyte]

I believe Bell/TELUS include texting to US numbers for free in their unlimited messaging plans. They make you pay through the roof for international SMS buckets though.

Koodo and Virgin offer Canada, US and international SMS/MMS for $5/month! $5! And Rogers wants $400? GTFO.

You can talk about consumer responsibility all you want. But Rogers are fleecing the dad charging him $400 for 1000+ US text messages. It's consumer exploitation. That's like $399+ profit for Rogers. For something I'm already getting from Koodo for $5.

[pjw918]

Dad takes stand against Rogers over texting charges

The CBC article was updated late yesterday:

Since he went public with his story, Dunsmore's texting charges have been cancelled by Rogers, but he remains on the hook for the cancellation fees.

Those cancellation fees will go away when the father reinstates his lines.

[droidacolyte]

Hahaha. Suck it Rogers. They don't give two ***** about you. And won't think twice about sending a $400 bill to a collections agency to damage your credit for a few years for a service that costs them less than $1. But get the media involved and they realize that they stand to lose way more than $400 from all the negative publicity (that's why it's important that the CBC is owned by the people. If Rogers and Bell Media controlled all the media, we wouldn't have watchdog reporting like this).

Hopefully Rogers learns their lesson and starts including US SMS in their messaging plans now. Bell and TELUS does it. And Koodo and Virgin one-up all of them as well as WIND (lol) by including international SMS/MMS (I don't even think Mobilicity has international MMS).

WIND need to take notes because they recently nerfed their messaging plan down to Canadian SMS only.

I bet the dad's credit will still take a bit hit over this. They already went to the collections agency. The damage is already done to the credit report. Even if Rogers decided to "forgive" them of this "debt".

[endlessdayz]

Mobilicity doesn't have international MMS but they have international SMS

[Prevailing Wind]

Hahaha. Suck it Rogers. They don't give two ***** about you. And won't think twice about sending a $400 bill to a collections agency to damage your credit for a few years for a service that costs them less than $1. But get the media involved and they realize that they stand to lose way more than $400 from all the negative publicity (that's why it's important that the CBC is owned by the people. If Rogers and Bell Media controlled all the media, we wouldn't have watchdog reporting like this).

Hopefully Rogers learns their lesson and starts including US SMS in their messaging plans now. Bell and TELUS does it. And Koodo and Virgin one-up all of them as well as WIND (lol) by including international SMS/MMS (I don't even think Mobilicity has international MMS).

WIND need to take notes because they recently nerfed their messaging plan down to Canadian SMS only.

I bet the dad's credit will still take a bit hit over this. They already went to the collections agency. The damage is already done to the credit report. Even if Rogers decided to "forgive" them of this "debt".

I remember when they TOOK AWAY US texting even though it was included in all our unlimited packages before (on Fido). It was one of the reasons I left.

[pjw918]

Carriers Warn of Crisis in Mobile Spectrum - New York Times, April 17

AT&T, Verizon, T-Mobile and Sprint say they need more radio spectrum, the government-rationed slices of radio waves that carry phone calls and wireless data.

The wireless carriers say that in the next few years they may not have enough of it to meet the exploding demands for mobile data. The result, they ominously warn, may be slower or spotty connections on smartphones and tablets. They imply in carefully couched language that, given the laws of supply and demand, the price of cellphone service will soar.

It will affect “the services they’re paying for because of the capacity issues,” said Ed McFadden, Verizon’s vice president for policy communications. “It potentially hinders our ability to meet consumer need.”

But is there really a crisis? Some scientists and engineers say the companies are playing a game that is more about protecting their businesses from competitors.
...
Why, then, wouldn’t carriers want to use these newer technologies that cause frequencies to not interfere? Because licensing spectrum is a zero-sum game. When a company gets the license for a band of radio waves, it has the exclusive rights to use it. Once a company owns it, competitors can’t have it.

Mr. Reed said the carriers haven’t advocated for the newer technologies because they want to retain their monopolies...

[pjw918]

Canada Telecom Rule Changes Threaten National Security - Bloomberg, April 18

Canada’s plan to allow foreign companies such as VimpelCom Ltd. (VIP) to increase their stakes in the country’s telecommunications providers poses a “considerable risk” to national security, Public Safety Canada warned.

“The security and intelligence community is of the view that lessening or removing restrictions from the Telecommunications Act, without implementing mitigation measures, would pose a considerable risk to public safety and national security,” Daniel Lavoie, a senior official with Public Safety, said in a letter to Industry Canada.

The letter, which was marked “secret” and dated Feb. 25, 2011, was obtained by Bloomberg News under Canada’s freedom-of-information law...

Public Safety conducted the review in consultation with CSIS and its other portfolio agencies, as well as the country’s defense department.

While Public Safety recognizes the “economic advantages of a prosperous Canadian telecommunications industry,” changes to the country’s system could impact “the integrity of Canada’s telecommunications sector and ultimately national security,” Lavoie said.

“Telecommunications systems are the backbone of all critical infrastructure systems in Canada” and are a key component of the government’s national strategy to protect such infrastructure, Lavoie added.