can VZW legally stop allowing unlimited plans for EVERYBODY in a couple of years?

[TC_Mits]

I did get a link once. FCC had removed the page! That's why I said, "secret" regs -- nobody seems to know exactly what they say. Wikipedia has a history of the auction with an account of the regs' origins. They would -- theoretically -- stay valid til the FCC changes its mind or a court annuls them -- or, maybe, a new White House administration rescinds them?

I'm guessing vzw could probably just ignore the 700C regs and beat the rap in court, but doing so might get messy PR-wise. That was the intent of my post above.


Perspective instantiates reality.
[From DX by HoFo app.]

[taoman54]

verizon can't throttle their LTE
FCC say so

I believe that is incorrect information. Please provide a link backing up that assertion.

Does Network Optimization apply to customers using 4G services?
No. We reserve the right to include 4G LTE users later, but right now this only applies to the top 5% of users with unlimited data plans using 3G devices. If you have a 4G LTE device you will not be affected at this time.

I strongly doubt Verizon would have that verbiage on their website if it wasn't true that they "could" throttle 4G data. What they are not allowed to do is throttle or block traffic on the basis of the content or the source of the data.

Content files are never selected for optimization based on the nature of the web content itself or the source or provider of the file.

http://support.verizonwireless.com/i...isclosure.html

On December 21, 2010, the FCC approved new rules banning cable television and telephone service providers from preventing access to competitors or certain web sites such as Netflix. The rules also include a more limited set of obligations for wireless providers. The rules would not keep ISPs from charging more for faster access. Republicans in Congress have announced plans to reverse the rules through legislation.[22] Verizon has also indicated that it will challenge the FCC's decision in court,[23] and Colin Crowell, the former Senior Counselor to the FCC Chairman, has called such court challenges "inevitable."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network...licy_statement

[tchaika]

Sorry, but you are the one who is mistaken. The data feature is not part of the contract like voice plans.

From the VZW customer agreement, located on their webpage:

My Service

Your Service terms and conditions are part of this agreement. Your Plan includes your monthly allowances and features, where you can use them (your "Coverage Area"), and their monthly and pay–per–use charges. You can also subscribe to several Optional Services, like text messaging packages. Together, your Plan and any Optional Services you select are your Service. The terms and conditions for your Service can be found in the brochures that are available when you activate, or online at verizonwireless.com

[TC_Mits]

I believe that is incorrect information. Please provide a link backing up that assertion.
I strongly doubt Verizon would have that verbiage on their website if it wasn't true that they "could" throttle 4G data...

For a link, google the WP 700 band auction history mentioned in my post above,

I think "that verbiage on their website" exists in anticipation of a change in the ruling. Not to have such verbiage would mean that throttling LTE, even after the 700 regs were gone, would be a -- very unpopular -- policy change. This way, the lady in red can just sorta wink, and say, 'I told you so.'


Perspective instantiates reality.
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[veriztd]

From the VZW customer agreement, located on their webpage:

The info you posted does not mention the contract. Try again. You quoted the Terms of service. Not the same thing.


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[Dust N Bones]

verizon can't throttle their LTE
FCC say so

But for how long is that rule in effect and do you have a link ?

That above statement that the FCC will not allow VZW to throttle LTE gets mentioned here a lot but I've never seen anyone be able to supply any proof of that. It almost seems it's more urban legend at this point.

[Vatothe0]

The info you posted does not mention the contract. Try again. You quoted the Terms of service. Not the same thing.


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So the customer agreement has nothing to do with the contract? Why even have one if its not required?

[veriztd]

The customer agreement is the same thing as the Terms of Service. It is not the contract. It is like a requirement for a smart phone to have data plan, not part of the contract either.

[Vatothe0]

Got it. You still have to follow it, it's just not called the contract. How is that relevant?

[veriztd]

Got it. You still have to follow it, it's just not called the contract. How is that relevant?

Clearly you don't read very well. I responded to post #15 which clearly referred to the contract and data features. Good job !!

[Vatothe0]

The customer agreement is the same thing as the Terms of Service. It is not the contract. It is like a requirement for a smart phone to have data plan, not part of the contract either.

Clearly you don't read very well. I responded to post #15 which clearly referred to the contract and data features. Good job !!

A quick google for Verizon Wireless Contract and the first result is Customer Agreement! directly from Verizon!!

My Service
Your Service terms and conditions are part of this agreement. Your Plan includes your monthly allowances and features, where you can use them (your "Coverage Area"), and their monthly and pay–per–use charges. You can also subscribe to several Optional Services, like text messaging packages. Together, your Plan and any Optional Services you select are your Service. The terms and conditions for your Service can be found in the brochures that are available when you activate, or online at verizonwireless.com

So if this isn't the contract, how can you accept the contract and not the Customer Agreement?

This is the same place they state:

Can Verizon Wireless Change This Agreement or My Service?
We may change prices or any other term of your Service or this agreement at any time,but we'll provide notice first, including written notice if you have Postpay Service. If you use your Service after the change takes effect, that means you're accepting the change. If you're a Postpay customer and a change to your Plan or this agreement has a material adverse effect on you, you can cancel the line of Service that has been affected within 60 days of receiving the notice with no Early Termination Fee if we fail to negate the change after you notify us of your objection to it.

So if this isn't the contract, what is?

[veriztd]

Let me clarify. All customers are subject to the Terms and Conditions of Service even when their contract has ended, hence my comment. I am done arguing this any further. We can disagree about the semantics and I can live with that.

[silver6054]

#1 is what I predicted in post #2 of this thread. Throttle early and throttle aggressively, that way the unlimited plan becomes unusable and drives user off of it. If V was smart they would ramp this up over the course of a number of months.

#2 is the current policy. To keep unlimited you must upgrade at full price, take the subsidized price and you have to change to the new shared plan.

Anyone recall exactly what happened to unlimited international data? I remember part of it, but maybe not the whole story.
International data (an amazing value at about $60 per month unlimited) was different in that people would add it when travelling, and then remove it when back, so more of a feature than part of the contract. Anyway, at one point, maybe Jan 2011, you could suddenly no longer add it, unless you had a business account. For other users, if it was active on your account on that date, you could keep it, but of course if you removed it, you couldn't add. And then, at some point, it went away entirely for everyone (apparently this really did cost too much for a carrier to sustain!). It's the mechanics of that last bit I don't remember. Did it go away as contracts ended, or was it declared a feature that was no longer available, even when active on your account?

[Vatothe0]

Anyone recall exactly what happened to unlimited international data? I remember part of it, but maybe not the whole story.
International data (an amazing value at about $60 per month unlimited) was different in that people would add it when travelling, and then remove it when back, so more of a feature than part of the contract. Anyway, at one point, maybe Jan 2011, you could suddenly no longer add it, unless you had a business account. For other users, if it was active on your account on that date, you could keep it, but of course if you removed it, you couldn't add. And then, at some point, it went away entirely for everyone (apparently this really did cost too much for a carrier to sustain!). It's the mechanics of that last bit I don't remember. Did it go away as contracts ended, or was it declared a feature that was no longer available, even when active on your account?

People were allowed to keep it until their current minimum term ended, changed to an incompatible device or got a subsidized upgrade.

[TC_Mits]

People were allowed to keep it until their current minimum term ended, changed to an incompatible device or got a subsidized upgrade.

What's "current minimum term"?

Then, at least theoretically, might there be a few folks hanging around that still have it?


Perspective instantiates reality.
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