Perspective from a fairly long term customer.

[greatgoogly]

Having been with T-Mobile since 2004 I initially signed up due to the value it provided. I was a voice only customer and although T-Mobile didn't have as big of a footprint as the other carriers the voice coverage was adequate. Fast forward to 2012 and I'm much more reliant on data coverage. I have an HTC Sensation. When at home my data toggles between 2G and "4G". When I'm on the "4G" I'm lucky to see 256kbps down and 200kbps up with a ping in the 500 to 600 range. fortunately I use Wifi at home so it's not a big deal. The problem is when I leave my home so much of the Central Massachusetts area has only 2G or very frequently simply GPRS coverage which basically makes the data useless. In areas where there is "4G" coverage it appears there is not enough backhaul to meet the data coverages. I've stood within a hundred yards of their tower in downtown Westborough, MA and only received about 2000kbps down.
I have a good deal $$ wise with T-Mobile, but it almost seems it's no longer worth it. T-Mobile is reducing their subsidies for their phones (i.e. Samsung Galaxy S3 for almost $350 before rebate) and without a real open competitive market for new phones (i.e. they all go for full list price), I'm starting to think it's time to bow down before Verizon as although they are expensive, at least they have the coverage to back it up. Back when I joined T-Mobile all I cared about was "can I make a phone call" and the answer most of the time was yes, but now I'm more concerned with "can I upload a picture, can I browse the web", and the answer once I walk out my door is too often no. Everything I've seen indicates T-Mobile will continue to improve their network in the main population centers, but it appears once you leave one by even a mile or two all bets are off and T-Mobile has no plans to change that (maybe they should just change their name to "MetroPCS V2.0"). My contract doesn't expire until the end of next year so I have some time to think about it, and I'm not enthused about seeing my bill increase by $50 a month for my wife and I's service if we jump ship. One final note I have also noticed that T-Mobile's customer service has gone to hell in a handbasket in the last year or so. I've had multiple instances of 611 reps making promises that I end up having to make repeated calls back to get to actually happen. One shouldn't have to spend hours on the phone to hold them to something that was promised by one of their reps. All in all it seems it may be soon time to cue up Roy Orbison for a spin of "It's Over"

[money69]

See what you can get a discounted Sprint plan for, if you consider the subsidy it definitely is very competitive.

[MrObvious]

Maybe they will improve 3g service where you are with the 1900 UTMS rollout.

Sent from my xt862 using HowardForums

[greatgoogly]

@MrObvious I can hope, but from the indications I've seen they are focusing on the main population centers. There was a t-mobile senior Engineer who did a AMA (Ask Me Anything) on reddit last week and it's my perception that didn't seem to give much hope that areas currently receiving only 2G/GPRS service would be getting any sort of data improvement in the near term. He states the LTE rollout will only happen in the areas that already have 3G coverage. It was an interesting read http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comment..._engineer_ama/

[jet1000]

When at home my data toggles between 2G and "4G". When I'm on the "4G" I'm lucky to see 256kbps down and 200kbps up with a ping in the 500 to 600 range.

You make some good points. T-Mobile should be upgrading their 2G network everywhere. In addition, there are places within metropolitan areas that fall back on EDGE because of a 4G signal. And even places that have a strong 4G signal, there is frequently not enough back haul to give 4G speeds. That all should be upgraded as well.

Those are upgrades should be a priority to the PCS UMTS rollout. T-Mobile is only rolling out PCS at this point, because they are too cheap to pay Apple. And also their LTE efforts are misguided at this point, because I have seen no evidence that on the limited spectrum they are planning on releasing LTE, that the speeds will be any faster than what they could achieve on HSPA+. It would take more spectrum for an LTE implementation to surpass HSPA+ speeds and they simply don't have it in most areas.

So I predict, they will continue to let their AWS UMTS network languish causing more customer losses as has been happening.

[i0wnj00]

T-Mobile is reducing their subsidies for their phones (i.e. Samsung Galaxy S3 for almost $350 before rebate) and without a real open competitive market for new phones (i.e. they all go for full list price)"

This is the problem with the current way wireless carriers do business. They shouldn't be in the business of bundling devices to the consumer which in turns reduces their ability to spend on their network. The device subsidy is nothing more than a short term gain for a customer who may or may not stick around to be loyal to the brand. Wireless carriers get pinched when they demand exclusivity or end up carrying a high demand (or even overhyped) device. I suspect that Samsung knows that their Galaxy S3 is a hit and like Apple is able to push the pricing on their terms.

IMO, wireless carries would have better networks if they weren't taking losses on subsidies they provide. Any loses they end up eating is money they don't have to spend on better service and coverage. Look at USCC, they're still losing money on the subsidies they provide to smartphones even though they aren't offering the iPhone.

Terrible business model.

[greatgoogly]

This is the problem with the current way wireless carriers do business. They shouldn't be in the business of bundling devices to the consumer which in turns reduces their ability to spend on their network. The device subsidy is nothing more than a short term gain for a customer who may or may not stick around to be loyal to the brand. Wireless carriers get pinched when they demand exclusivity or end up carrying a high demand (or even overhyped) device. I suspect that Samsung knows that their Galaxy S3 is a hit and like Apple is able to push the pricing on their terms.

I believe that wireless carries would have better networks if they weren't taking losses on subsidies they provide.
Look at USCC, they're still losing money on the subsidies they provide to smartphones even though they aren't offering the iPhone.

I would have no problem buying the phone separate from the service if the market was truly open for buying the devices. If there was real competition for the devices I suspect the prices would fall somewhat from the list prices instead of the lock step "don't want to sign a contract, then it will cost you at least full list price" strategy (yes I know you can buy a phone off Craigslist or Ebay, but that is a pretty risky method of buying a expensive device). I believe all the major players also require a 2 year contract for new service even if you bring your own device. The whole contract mentality is designed to lock customers in and force them to put up with marginal service. Imagine if the providers actually had to compete to keep your service on a month to month basis! I believe networks would improve, customer service would improve, and prices would stabilize.

[storm72]

@greatgoogly, you nailed it as far as this fairly long term TMo customer (also since 2004) is concerned. Your experience completely echoes mine in a completely different part of the country (a little south of Chicago), as well as that of friends with TMo here and elsewhere. This hasn't been the same company since the AT&T deal failed. Our contract is up in a few months and we're already looking at other options with yes, Verizon looming large among them. I'm not crazy about paying more with another provider either, but there's no value in a service that simply can't meet our needs anymore.

[N900Fan]

Sounds as if your expectations have changed. You basically state that you now need reliable 1 Mbps or faster service away from home for your intended uses. You will have to pay the piper for this kind of monthly service from the big two in rural areas. Alternatively, get a pre-paid mobile hotspot from Verizon and use just use that when necessary.

We're taking the opposite approach. We're staying with T-Mobile and are switching from Classic to Value. This will reduce our rates for 3 lines down to $100/mo. We will even add 2 new SIMS to this plan for only the activation fee and pay the same $100/mo price after taxes. We will buy new and used phones locally and from Ebay when the need arises. We will buy phones 1-2 years old that have highly depreciated from their overly inflated list prices. I really appreciate that T-Mobile offers such options. It will be good to see our monthly bill fall.

We rely on Wi-Fi at home for many uses, including UMA and T-Mobile Wi-Fi calling on Android. Both service work very well. Away from home in our 3G/4G market, we do like mobile data. At $10/mo. for 200 MB for the wife and I and $20/mo. for our son, it's affordable luxury. Even on the road with 2G speeds, POP email and Opera mobile work fine. We may get a pre-paid mobile hotspot down the road when more 4G providers come online and prices drop.

I think the tide is turning against the expensive and limited choice contract plans that Verizon and AT&T offer. The number of used and fully functional smart phones out there is huge. New smart phone prices are dropping. Straight Talk SIM is gaining ground, even with the worst customer service on earth.

T-Mobile CS has fallen due to offshoring. We rarely us CS, and try to self-serv using the online site. After that, we use online chat to get written evidence of conversations and transactions. Finally, we have been upgrading at Wal-Mart during black Friday week for new phones and that has worked well.

The good thing is there are still lots of choices available for every user. Thanks FCC & DOJ.

[Steveanderson13]

@greatgoogly, as someone said, your needs have changed but the carrier has not kept up. I am a long-time happy Verizon customer always very satisfied with coverage, service, phones and rates. Of course, you need to check what works where you spend your time.

If Verizon coverage works (I can give you Rootmetrics data from your neighborhood from the app), and since you are also concerned with your bill, you may wish to explore Page Plus. Make sure the data caps are adequate. I am considering them as an experiment in prepaid although it probably wouldn't work as I use a lot of data. Strangely enough, I would also like to add a Tmo account (for the Note partially).

[Steveanderson13]

T-Mobile is only rolling out PCS at this point, because they are too cheap to pay Apple.

Not to mention that Apple may bankrupt Sprint and even AT$T and Verizon are pursuing alternatives to Apple (Android, Windows).

[Steveanderson13]

T-Mobile should be upgrading their 2G network everywhere. In addition, there are places within metropolitan areas that fall back on EDGE because of a 4G signal. And even places that have a strong 4G signal, there is frequently not enough back haul to give 4G speeds. That all should be upgraded as well.

Those are upgrades should be a priority to the PCS UMTS rollout. T-Mobile is only rolling out PCS at this point, because they are too cheap to pay Apple. And also their LTE efforts are misguided at this point, because I have seen no evidence that on the limited spectrum they are planning on releasing LTE, that the speeds will be any faster than what they could achieve on HSPA+. It would take more spectrum for an LTE implementation to surpass HSPA+ speeds and they simply don't have it in most areas.

So I predict, they will continue to let their AWS UMTS network languish causing more customer losses as has been happening.

Who owns them and is making the decisions?

[Antenna]

I too have been with T-Mobile for eons, and I'm getting my monies worth out of my $5.99 data plan, even if I have to pay more.

I pay Verizon $30 for 3G also. And also don't get a subsidy. The grass isn't greener.....so why keep verizon? The promise of LTE... I am told LTE will be coming around by the end of this year. You think with the amount verizon charges they would have LTE everywhere.

Sent from my HTC Amaze 4G

[Antenna]

You make some good points. T-Mobile should be upgrading their 2G network everywhere. In addition, there are places within metropolitan areas that fall back on EDGE because of a 4G signal. And even places that have a strong 4G signal, there is frequently not enough back haul to give 4G speeds. That all should be upgraded as well.

Those are upgrades should be a priority to the PCS UMTS rollout. T-Mobile is only rolling out PCS at this point, because they are too cheap to pay Apple. And also their LTE efforts are misguided at this point, because I have seen no evidence that on the limited spectrum they are planning on releasing LTE, that the speeds will be any faster than what they could achieve on HSPA+. It would take more spectrum for an LTE implementation to surpass HSPA+ speeds and they simply don't have it in most areas.

So I predict, they will continue to let their AWS UMTS network languish causing more customer losses as has been happening.

Obviously you are happy with your free 4G hotspot and $30 voicstream plan. You need to have a more positive spin on things or leave. You really bring down every thread with the same views. You yourself use T-Mobile so it can't be that bad

Sent from my HTC Amaze 4G

[dutchtender]

This is the problem with the current way wireless carriers do business. They shouldn't be in the business of bundling devices to the consumer which in turns reduces their ability to spend on their network. The device subsidy is nothing more than a short term gain for a customer who may or may not stick around to be loyal to the brand. Wireless carriers get pinched when they demand exclusivity or end up carrying a high demand (or even overhyped) device. I suspect that Samsung knows that their Galaxy S3 is a hit and like Apple is able to push the pricing on their terms.

IMO, wireless carries would have better networks if they weren't taking losses on subsidies they provide. Any loses they end up eating is money they don't have to spend on better service and coverage. Look at USCC, they're still losing money on the subsidies they provide to smartphones even though they aren't offering the iPhone.

Terrible business model.

how is it st gain for the customer if customer has to pay large ETF? how is this a loss for verizon and att if a customer walks with their device after paying the etf? the carriers have modeled this out financially from every angle. I can almost assure you that the model is profitable for them. and the customer, if he doesn't reneg on his agreement to pay etf, is not getting a free lunch.