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Thread: Trying to have customer relations forgive a debt.

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hornos View Post
    Not quite right, assuming if OP got service 6 months ago he'd have been under the Simple Choice plan. IOW this has nothing to do with subsidized prices (because, looking at T-Mobile's phone prices and Uncarrier policies, phones are definitely NOT subsidized) or 2-year service agreements (which have been abolished under the Simple Choice plans), but rather a 2-year installment payment plan on phones. There are two separate things going on:

    1) T-Mobile service - OP's service sucked and he cancelled it. As bad as the service may have been, it isn't an issue at this point.

    2) OP has a sort-of independent financing deal on the phones whose return period has expired. In exchange for maintaining T-Mobile service, T-Mobile financed two full list priced phones interest-free for 24 months with the caveat that cancelling T-Mobile service accelerates the balance due = OP was obligated to pay off the balance due on the phones when he cancelled service. OP's problem (or perhaps lack of perspective) at this point is that T-Mobile is no longer his service provider but is solely the phones' financer. If OP had paid for the phones with his MasterCard, could he could stop paying MasterCard for the phones - which weren't themselves defective - because T-Mobile has poor service? No. Can he stop paying T-Mobile? No.

    OP had the option to pay off the phones, have T-Mobile unlock them, and resell them at a lower degree of loss than he did. The fact that OP didn't do due diligence and resold the phones below market prices isn't T-Mobile's fault. Even worse, OP shot himself in the foot and eliminated T-Mobile's only reasonable option for resolving the dispute, i.e. OP returns the phones and T-Mobile removes the debt. Objectively speaking, T-Mobile forgiving a $987 debt is absolutely unreasonable because OP made $300 selling the phones; T-Mobile forgiving a $687 debt in exchange for absolutely nothing is still unreasonable.

    IOW, pay for the phones and chalk it up to several lessons learned.

    I made an attempt to get them their phones back, actually several. Every attempt was met with "we don't take back phones for this" or "we only take trades on new devices."

    What I wanted to do was give the phones back for something close to what used or refurbished devices are selling for by the carriers, something that T-Mobile wouldn't even have to take a loss on. Then I would pay the remainder of the balance. I was told this was not an option.

    After that, I knew I was selling the phones at something of a loss, just a lot more than I realized at the time. My wife looked at ebay and said they weren't going for too much, I think she said $200 or so (which after eBay fees and hassle begins to not be worth it). Maybe she saw one of the 10 other variations of phones made by HTC with One in the name. So the moral of the story is never trust a woman...

    I guess I should have been a squeakier wheel all along and had large portions of my bills credited to me? I don't know, but I have paid 100% for all the services provided and those not provided because I felt they were making a good faith effort to correct the issues, and frankly because everyone I talked to on the phone about it was so damn nice. If I had done this at least I would feel better about the whole situation.
    Last edited by agreendc; 12-28-2013 at 08:12 AM. Reason: Making it a little more clear

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwantgizmos View Post
    tmobile is not going to forgive that debt. they're going to send the case to collection and you're either to have pay up, or you're going to have set up a monthly payment plan to pay that all off over time. the tmo billing people and eventually the collection people will not seriously read that too long letter with any real sympathy. tmo is just going to respond to your letter with a bill telling you to call an 800 number to resolve the situation (meaning to arrange the payment plan). (the billing people will want this paid off in a short time, but if you need much longer then expect to deal with collections for a longer payment arrangement.) if your friend is a good attorney, he would rewrite that letter into something much shorter because he is not going to have that go out under his signature. but the result is going to be the same: you have to get ready to pay what you owe all now or pay it off on a monthly basis. if your attorney friend were to actually bill you for his services, because he will essentially be representing you if that letter goes out under his signature, you would probably instead just only want to pay what you owe to tmobile instead. seriously, if your friend is a good attorney, he will tell you to shorten that letter yourself, or simply just have yourself call tmobile asking for an monthly installment payment plan, while being happy if tmobile takes only a little bit off, but don't be surprised if tmo says you're on the hook for the full amount. dude, you made a cell phone deal that went bad for you, while making even more mistakes afterwards, and now you have to eat the consequences.


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    Everyone is really stuck on this whole my friend is an attorney thing.... I was merely asking if anyone thought a letter from an attorney would improve my odds. And the only reason I would even consider that is because my buddy would likely do it for free, not because I thought litigation was even an option, definitely not a reasonable one. Nothing more than that... he is involved in no way at all with this situation.

  3. #33
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    Most people are 99% sure that they will not rule in your favor. The only issue that matters is the two devices, for which you took possession of and sold. They did not have to take them back after the return period. And you are obligated to pay for them in full. Yes, you're aware that you could have sold them for more money, and should have. That is where the real loss is, and T-Mobile should not be faulted for that. In fact, you could have kept the devices and moved them to AT&T or another prepaid service that uses GSM phones. Or you could have sold them for at least $250 cash on craigslist to recoup your loss.

    The fact that their service got worse, or that they wouldn't let you return the phones after the return period, has no bearing on the fact that you took full possession of two flagship devices, agreed to pay for them in full at the time of purchase, and then sold them. It's like buying a new car for full price, selling it for significantly less because you have to sell it used, and then asking the financing company to forgive your debt.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by agreendc View Post
    I made an attempt to get them their phones back, actually several. Every attempt was met with "we don't take back phones for this" or "we only take trades on new devices."

    What I wanted to do was give the phones back for something close to what used or refurbished devices are selling for by the carriers, something that T-Mobile wouldn't even have to take a loss on. Then I would pay the remainder of the balance. I was told this was not an option.

    After that, I knew I was selling the phones at something of a loss, just a lot more than I realized at the time. My wife looked at ebay and said they weren't going for too much, I think she said $200 or so (which after eBay fees and hassle begins to not be worth it). Maybe she saw one of the 10 other variations of phones made by HTC with One in the name. So the moral of the story is never trust a woman...

    I guess I should have been a squeakier wheel all along and had large portions of my bills credited to me? I don't know, but I have paid 100% for all the services provided and those not provided because I felt they were making a good faith effort to correct the issues, and frankly because everyone I talked to on the phone about it was so damn nice. If I had done this at least I would feel better about the whole situation.
    I hate to hear that the experience with the service itself was poor, and I would absolutely see disputing the service charges being reasonable, but it sounds like you are disputing charges for handsets which are totally unrelated and are not affected by service, in fact when the balance is paid like another user said can be unlocked and used with another GSM wireless provider.

  5. #35
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    I actually do have a bit of sympathy with you - up to the point of selling the phones - because I almost ended up in a similar situation with poor service, new phones, and an ex-service provider. That said ...

    Quote Originally Posted by agreendc View Post
    I made an attempt to get them their phones back, actually several. Every attempt was met with "we don't take back phones for this" or "we only take trades on new devices."

    What I wanted to do was give the phones back for something close to what used or refurbished devices are selling for by the carriers, something that T-Mobile wouldn't even have to take a loss on. Then I would pay the remainder of the balance. I was told this was not an option.
    This is one of those lessons learned from this experience. Once "regular" customer service, i.e. the store and/or phone or chat customer service says "We can't do that" - several times, no less - that is your cue to call the CEO's office/Executive Dept.

    After that, I knew I was selling the phones at something of a loss, just a lot more than I realized at the time. My wife looked at ebay and said they weren't going for too much, I think she said $200 or so (which after eBay fees and hassle begins to not be worth it). Maybe she saw one of the 10 other variations of phones made by HTC with One in the name. So the moral of the story is never trust a woman...
    At the minimum do your research. In determining the price, which we all agree was seriously too low (except the person who got a pleasantly early Christmas by getting $350 worth of used HTC One for $150), not only did your wife look up the wrong phone, but she ignored the fact that those T-Mobile phones weren't only valuable to T-Mobile customers, but if unlocked they had significant value - at the right price - to AT&T customers.

    I guess I should have been a squeakier wheel all along and had large portions of my bills credited to me? I don't know, but I have paid 100% for all the services provided and those not provided because I felt they were making a good faith effort to correct the issues, and frankly because everyone I talked to on the phone about it was so damn nice. If I had done this at least I would feel better about the whole situation.
    You should have probably been the squeakier wheel all along, especially in light of your profession and requirement for reliable phone service. Then again you probably shouldn't have even gotten to the squeaky wheel point, due to the fact that if your signal at home was so poor that you needed to use WiFi calling (which flat out doesn't work with SMS/MMS) then you had a glaring sign that you should have probably cancelled T-Mobile ASAP and not even gotten to the point of trying new phones.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by agreendc View Post
    Everyone is really stuck on this whole my friend is an attorney thing.... I was merely asking if anyone thought a letter from an attorney would improve my odds. And the only reason I would even consider that is because my buddy would likely do it for free, not because I thought litigation was even an option, definitely not a reasonable one. Nothing more than that... he is involved in no way at all with this situation.
    mentioning the attorney part was like a red flag. so yeah people are going to respond to that part. your friendship with him must be really strong if he does it for free and the moral support is nice but it was never going to improve the odds. especially with everyone jumping on you about this. lol

    too bad about your phone. too bad you screwed up. hopefully you'll get this annoying experience behind you soon and be much happier with your next phone.


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    Last edited by iwantgizmos; 12-30-2013 at 10:33 PM.

  7. #37
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    There's a strong possibility T Mobile will not forgive the debt. However, you have other recourse, e. g., small claims court or arbitration, in accordance with the contract in effect when you first signed up and took possession of the phones

    Pay up and then contest the debt later to avoid ruining your credit

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boy_Pinoy View Post
    There's a strong possibility T Mobile will not forgive the debt. However, you have other recourse, e. g., small claims court or arbitration, in accordance with the contract in effect when you first signed up and took possession of the phones
    What is there to contest? Tmobile sold him two phones on credit and they delivered two working phones. He owes for them.

  9. #39
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    good gawd. don't you just hate paying bills that you don't want to pay. particularly when they got you over a barrel where you should just pay up to get it over with. but of course if you're broke, then that's just another story. lol


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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hornos View Post
    I actually do have a bit of sympathy with you - up to the point of selling the phones - because I almost ended up in a similar situation with poor service, new phones, and an ex-service provider. That said ...



    This is one of those lessons learned from this experience. Once "regular" customer service, i.e. the store and/or phone or chat customer service says "We can't do that" - several times, no less - that is your cue to call the CEO's office/Executive Dept.



    At the minimum do your research. In determining the price, which we all agree was seriously too low (except the person who got a pleasantly early Christmas by getting $350 worth of used HTC One for $150), not only did your wife look up the wrong phone, but she ignored the fact that those T-Mobile phones weren't only valuable to T-Mobile customers, but if unlocked they had significant value - at the right price - to AT&T customers.



    You should have probably been the squeakier wheel all along, especially in light of your profession and requirement for reliable phone service. Then again you probably shouldn't have even gotten to the squeaky wheel point, due to the fact that if your signal at home was so poor that you needed to use WiFi calling (which flat out doesn't work with SMS/MMS) then you had a glaring sign that you should have probably cancelled T-Mobile ASAP and not even gotten to the point of trying new phones.

    I actually traded the phones in to Best Buy... so I wasn't a complete a-hole selling locked phones.

  11. #41
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    You're being a child about this. You failed to research the network, as well as the feature set of 2 phones, both sets of data are widely published, and easy to research/verify before sale.
    I'm in sales, believe me, if your really a Dr. That trumps my profession handsomely, however, I am extremely cautious in making moves in technology to the point of doing a trial before porting the number. You could have obtained a cheap tmobile phone and prepaid sim card, and spent a week testing it at essential locations. I also read the manual to a device I plan to obtain to make sure I don't miss something silly like MMS. I have a really hard time agreeing with any of your actions or plans for future action. It seems you need to slow down and make more thoroughly informed decisions.
    Phones can easily be unlocked and sold to any gsm customer , this should recoup more than half of your debt. You should pay it ASAP, once they inevitably report it, your problems will be a lot worse.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrew04 View Post
    You're being a child about this. You failed to research the network, as well as the feature set of 2 phones, both sets of data are widely published, and easy to research/verify before sale.
    I'm in sales, believe me, if your really a Dr. That trumps my profession handsomely, however, I am extremely cautious in making moves in technology to the point of doing a trial before porting the number. You could have obtained a cheap tmobile phone and prepaid sim card, and spent a week testing it at essential locations. I also read the manual to a device I plan to obtain to make sure I don't miss something silly like MMS. I have a really hard time agreeing with any of your actions or plans for future action. It seems you need to slow down and make more thoroughly informed decisions.
    Phones can easily be unlocked and sold to any gsm customer , this should recoup more than half of your debt. You should pay it ASAP, once they inevitably report it, your problems will be a lot worse.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

    I actually agree with some of your points... I should have had t mobile unlock the phones and sold them for a more reasonable amount of money. I am fairly confident that I will be giving them their thousand bucks.

    However, I did research the service, as I have already stated at least once. The service was more than adequate when we tested vital locations. It got worse once any trial period was over, I owed a lot on my phone, so we decided that wifi calling would work for my wife while at work and home... As soon as leaving either building it was in a relatively strong service area. 3-5 bars of LTE service outside my house to be specific.

    I may not have done adequate research on the Note 2, I came from a galaxy nexus that was able to do group messaging for over a year, so I mistakenly assumed it was a default android feature. I replaced that phone with the HTC One which was known to send mms group messages on Android 4.1, even on wifi. (once again doing my research) Regardless the Note was paid in full well prior to now and was only mentioned to detail my experience.

    I don't doubt that you're in sales as you claim, why would I? ...You have no cause to doubt my profession.
    Last edited by agreendc; 01-04-2014 at 07:19 AM. Reason: Decided to be less of a ****.

  13. #43
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    It sounds like you need to pay this debt. If it's still in-house, you may be able to negotiate a settlement with no derogatory credit report. If it goes to outside collections, you may be able to negotiate a settlement, but it will most likely go on your credit report as slow pay. Slow pay is better than not paying, but will still show for 7 years. Save your credit and chalk this up to lessons learned.

  14. #44
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    To anyone following this, first off thanks for any of the input, I got my letter back from T-Mobile today. What a complete joke it was. I don't have it with me or I would scan it in, but it was a form letter that said that they cannot guarantee service, etc. I thought it operated as a legal department, but apparently they still just use scripts just like customer service.

    I was obviously denied, at this point I honestly wasn't even that upset about that, just really frustrated that all I get is form letter from some lady who obviously didn't even read my letter.

    The good/bad news is after receiving it I found one of those "call these numbers to talk to the president of XYZ company" articles online. Picked one of the numbers and had a real person pick up the phone almost immediately. She actually reviewed everything I said and actually didn't just read a script. Where the bad/good news comes in, is she said that I could send in the devices and they would forgive my debt... I'm not sure if I should laugh or cry or... idk. So if anyone happens to be anywhere close to my situation call Executive Relations at 1-877-290-6323. <-- that is a real working number, I have extensions too, but I don't want to be a **** and put out people's personal extensions.

    She did offer me a "I feel bad cause you are stupid" $100 credit and extended my time to pay until March.

    Seriously if you guys have issues customer service can't solve, call that number.
    Last edited by agreendc; 01-09-2014 at 04:30 PM.

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    too bad you don't have that phone anymore to send in. oh well live and learn. if they're knocking $100 off on paying it off, you might as well take advantage of that and put this behind you. it's a good thing you're a doctor, so you should be able to afford this expensive error. shees, write it off as a business expense on your taxes if you did some if any business related stuff on it when you had the phone.


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