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Thread: "Freedom Mobile Threatens Lock Out Notice" Windsor ON

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Driver8666 View Post
    Even if we did elect a right wing Federal and Provincial Government, that still will not fly. Unions would have both out of office before you'd even sneeze.

    Look up the GMD (EMD Canada) closure in London, Ontario in I believe 2010 or 2011. That's what you call "Industrial rape". When Caterpillar threatened to close the plant down, that made national headlines. That is one major reason a "right-to-work" law will never get past any kind of reading. You bring this up (EMD Closure) in the House Of Commons and the bill would be dead. I had a couple of friends work there. They work somewhere else, but don't make the same amount of money they made there, especially with the skill set they have. It was also part of the reason Stephen Harper wasn't re-elected.

    EMD Locomotives are now built in Muncie, IN. Indiana has a "right-to-work" law.
    Michigan has right to work also, and Ohio has cheap corporate taxes with cheap payroll tax burden...

    I wonder if the union bosses have figured out why their workers' job are going to those states?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirtate View Post
    Michigan has right to work also, and Ohio has cheap corporate taxes with cheap payroll tax burden...

    I wonder if the union bosses have figured out why their workers' job are going to those states?

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    Probably after they've been raped. I think Texas is another one too. From what I heard, it's not very good down there at EMD Muncie. They only make minimum wage and they are constructing locomotives for the world. Something is wrong with that picture for sure. If you have the specific skill set, pay wages commensurate with that skill set. You're not going to pay a test technician minimum wage so he has to check off a thousand items before the locomotive can ship are you? Don't pay minimum wage to these people. Same thing goes with the Freedom techs. Pay these people what they deserve, not what you think they deserve.

    The EMD closure in London, however wasn't without a fight. Locomotives partially finished had to be stored elsewhere and there were locomotives on the floor for Union Pacific, the EMD lease fleet and KCS on the floor at the time of the shutdown. It was very nasty.

    In my opinion, there is no way Canada will ever entertain a "right-to-work" law after what happened at EMD London. This all happened under Harper's watch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Driver8666 View Post
    Probably after they've been raped. I think Texas is another one too. From what I heard, it's not very good down there at EMD Muncie. They only make minimum wage and they are constructing locomotives for the world. Something is wrong with that picture for sure. If you have the specific skill set, pay wages commensurate with that skill set. You're not going to pay a test technician minimum wage so he has to check off a thousand items before the locomotive can ship are you? Don't pay minimum wage to these people. Same thing goes with the Freedom techs. Pay these people what they deserve, not what you think they deserve.

    The EMD closure in London, however wasn't without a fight. Locomotives partially finished had to be stored elsewhere and there were locomotives on the floor for Union Pacific, the EMD lease fleet and KCS on the floor at the time of the shutdown. It was very nasty.

    In my opinion, there is no way Canada will ever entertain a "right-to-work" law after what happened at EMD London. This all happened under Harper's watch.
    The jobs advertised for employment agencies in Muncie show $13/hr or so for warehouse work at CAT.
    Tow-motor drivers make $17/hr in not GTA Ontario.
    Skilled trades make commensurate wages as they do here, eg; $25/hr for a millwright.

    Floor supervisors are $18-22.

    Not as much as CAW wages, but not much is, unless you're talking OTF wages.

    One has to understand that it costs many orders of magnitude less to live in the US, a 4 bedroom 1800SqFt house in a good school district ( nevermind charter schools) is only $122k. Nevermind 60 cans of beer at Costco for $22!

    So a $20/hr job would pay those bills. Add a spouse with $15/hr and you have lifestyle.
    The CAT jobs all include health insurance, so that isn't a worry.

    I work in the US, we tend to view different localities through the paradigms we have cultivated at home. The fear we have of the American's healthcare is only matched by the fear they have of ours. "Your mom had to wait over 6months for a new hip!?" (She did)

    I broke my ankle in Monroe, MI (on my own property, dammit!) On a Friday afternoon. I had internal fixation within hours, not after the weekend. I Was out and back home Sunday AM.

    This was 'small town Michigan' regional hospital, not metro Detroit. Care was better than the big hospitals at home, and crazy faster.



    My sources;


    https://www.indeed.com/m/jobs?q=Caterpillar&l=Indiana


    https://www.zillow.com/homes/?utm_co...le%22:false%7D

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    10 digits..........
    Last edited by sirtate; 09-18-2017 at 04:16 PM. Reason: Duplicate post

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirtate View Post
    The jobs advertised for employment agencies in Muncie show $13/hr or so for warehouse work at CAT.
    Tow-motor drivers make $17/hr in not GTA Ontario.
    Skilled trades make commensurate wages as they do here, eg; $25/hr for a millwright.

    Floor supervisors are $18-22.

    Not as much as CAW wages, but not much is, unless you're talking OTF wages.

    One has to understand that it costs many orders of magnitude less to live in the US, a 4 bedroom 1800SqFt house in a good school district ( nevermind charter schools) is only $122k. Nevermind 60 cans of beer at Costco for $22!

    So a $20/hr job would pay those bills. Add a spouse with $15/hr and you have lifestyle.
    The CAT jobs all include health insurance, so that isn't a worry.

    I work in the US, we tend to view different localities through the paradigms we have cultivated at home. The fear we have of the American's healthcare is only matched by the fear they have of ours. "Your mom had to wait over 6months for a new hip!?" (She did)

    I broke my ankle in Monroe, MI (on my own property, dammit!) On a Friday afternoon. I had internal fixation within hours, not after the weekend. I Was out and back home Sunday AM.

    This was 'small town Michigan' regional hospital, not metro Detroit. Care was better than the big hospitals at home, and crazy faster.



    My sources;


    https://www.indeed.com/m/jobs?q=Caterpillar&l=Indiana


    https://www.zillow.com/homes/?utm_co...le%22:false%7D

    Sent from my XT1563 using HoFo mobile app
    Building locomotives is an advanced skillset. More so than building cars. When EMD London was still open, and my friends were there, they told me they were making close to $40.00/hr. Somewhere around the $30.00/$40.00/hr. Cat bought EMD, and wanted to slash the wages of the workers. They voted "f--- you", and that's when the lockout and eventual closure hit. $13/hr is the minimum wage in IN? I've toured EMD London many times. Believe me, when CAT came in, is when the depression started. You had this laid back attitude while still getting the job done. Once CAT came in they started installing security cameras all over the place. I made it a point to give the finger to one. WE won't go on about what I did or was allowed to do with the locomotives on the test track however (under supervision). Fun times for sure.

    Floor Supervisors, well, I'd say it goes by experience. Skilled Trades, that's commensurate for sure.

    I love your analogy on the 60 cans of beer at Costco for $22.00. But I'm not so sure on the 20/15 an hour job.

    Up here as you know the government pays for health care. What I'd be more concerned with is the out of pocket expenses (dental/eyeglasses, that stuff). I'm covered through my employer for that, through the insurance plan.

    The first link you provided, did you look at Test Technician? That's an advanced skill set right there and your wages should correspond to such skills. I also noted that you need an Associates Degree for it. You're definitely not going to be paid minimum wage for that. If you are, that's a problem. A huge one.

    As for your lines on health care I won't argue with you on that. Matched fears is yes. But you still have the GOP trying to repeal Obamacare. It's not going to work. I told my mom, if it's repealed, that will hurt Trump's (I have another word for him that I cannot use here) voter base. He already tried it once and I watched Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) give the thumbs down. Once I saw that I said "there's a campaign promise out the window now. He's never going to be able to say repeal and replace". In addition his threats aren't going to work in Congress, because even they are starting to realize (I hope) that this President cannot and should not be trusted. If the Dems get control of the House and Senate next year, you can almost certainly bet Trump, Pence and Ryan are gone through impeachment. There's enough **** to get Trump impeached. If that happened here in Canada, the Prime Minister would be out quick. A "no confidence" vote in Parliament would all but be assured. That's all it takes to kick him out and force an election.

    Small town Michigan hospital? Not Detroit? Well, Detroit is not the most dangerous city in America. It is one, but it's not #1.

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    Yes you can get a house for cheap but you'd have to live there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Driver8666 View Post
    Building locomotives is an advanced skillset. More so than building cars. When EMD London was still open, and my friends were there, they told me they were making close to $40.00/hr. Somewhere around the $30.00/$40.00/hr. Cat bought EMD, and wanted to slash the wages of the workers. They voted "f--- you", and that's when the lockout and eventual closure hit. $13/hr is the minimum wage in IN? I've toured EMD London many times. Believe me, when CAT came in, is when the depression started. You had this laid back attitude while still getting the job done. Once CAT came in they started installing security cameras all over the place. I made it a point to give the finger to one. WE won't go on about what I did or was allowed to do with the locomotives on the test track however (under supervision). Fun times for sure.

    Floor Supervisors, well, I'd say it goes by experience. Skilled Trades, that's commensurate for sure.

    I love your analogy on the 60 cans of beer at Costco for $22.00. But I'm not so sure on the 20/15 an hour job.

    Up here as you know the government pays for health care. What I'd be more concerned with is the out of pocket expenses (dental/eyeglasses, that stuff). I'm covered through my employer for that, through the insurance plan.

    The first link you provided, did you look at Test Technician? That's an advanced skill set right there and your wages should correspond to such skills. I also noted that you need an Associates Degree for it. You're definitely not going to be paid minimum wage for that. If you are, that's a problem. A huge one.

    As for your lines on health care I won't argue with you on that. Matched fears is yes. But you still have the GOP trying to repeal Obamacare. It's not going to work. I told my mom, if it's repealed, that will hurt Trump's (I have another word for him that I cannot use here) voter base. He already tried it once and I watched Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) give the thumbs down. Once I saw that I said "there's a campaign promise out the window now. He's never going to be able to say repeal and replace". In addition his threats aren't going to work in Congress, because even they are starting to realize (I hope) that this President cannot and should not be trusted. If the Dems get control of the House and Senate next year, you can almost certainly bet Trump, Pence and Ryan are gone through impeachment. There's enough **** to get Trump impeached. If that happened here in Canada, the Prime Minister would be out quick. A "no confidence" vote in Parliament would all but be assured. That's all it takes to kick him out and force an election.

    Small town Michigan hospital? Not Detroit? Well, Detroit is not the most dangerous city in America. It is one, but it's not #1.
    $38/hr was the wage for a top pay floor associate.

    It was/is commensurate with other CAW (now Unifor) jobs of similar ilk.

    For exactly the same reason that Ford Talbotville closed, CAT shut down the plant on Oxford.

    CAT, at least gave the workers an option to continue working at $28/hr.
    The CAW told the workers misinformation about the ability of the employer moving operations.

    It was (still is) a hit to London's economy.

    I have worked at union shops, and for the amount of money I paid in union dues, I never saw a return on that cost.

    When you pay more than your CPP contribution to a large business who only helps the layabouts and crooks, it irks you...

    Right to work laws, just say;" you don't have to"...

    The unions are too strong in Canada anymore and they are big business, which is why they won't allow (as you say, correctly) any government to pass similar legislation to prohibit their garnishment of my wages.

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    *UPDATE*

    "Next, a campaign in support of hard-working Windsor call centre employees.Our union and our members across Canada will back you up with a range of public actions. If Freedom Mobile’s senior managers lock you out, this dispute will not be taking place only in Windsor. We have actions planned in other cities to show our support for you. Here is a letter that we sent to Shaw Communications yesterday."

    http://usw1944.ca/en/freedom-mobile-...ning-update-23




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    Last edited by qag01; 09-20-2017 at 11:52 AM. Reason: Wrong Link Provided
    Damn!

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    *UPDATE*

    It looks like the Union voted to accept Freedom's offer

    http://usw1944.ca/en/freedom-mobile-...ning-update-24

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    Last edited by qag01; 09-21-2017 at 05:03 PM. Reason: Link

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    lol they actually wanted jobs after all

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    Quote Originally Posted by qag01 View Post
    *UPDATE*

    It looks like the Union voted to accept Freedom's offer

    http://usw1944.ca/en/freedom-mobile-...ning-update-24

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    The rank and file voted to accept AGAINST the union's recommendations...

    That says something about the solidarity of the workers...

    It sounds a bit like the CTEA with Bell back in the day.

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    eventually the freedom call centres might be moved just like some of the shaw calgary ones!

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    Shaw's Victoria call centre is being converted to a dedicated Freedom centre.

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    Quote Originally Posted by icq2000b View Post
    eventually the freedom call centres might be moved just like some of the shaw calgary ones!
    I wouldn't be surprised. I don't think they could have done this at a worse time, with Shaw Mobile around the corner

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