Actually, they subsidize phones, but sell service. Pretty good service, if you ask me.
After all the one upmanship we still haven't gotten much further than knowing that instore sales reps know less than techs, Verizon's business model confuses even the middle managment types, and that some are happy with their service.
I found the instore reps helpful too. I bought an e815 and an LG8100 when I switched from ATT, or whatever. After much waiting I was eventually informed that the data package could only combine with aircards or PDA/Phones, not VCAST phones. Fine. Where I live solid 11KBS throughput is a vast improvement over the sub-standard-even-for-dial-up rates I get via SBC lines, even if I have to limit my cell surfing to mostly off peak hours. (I've almost completely bailed on SBC thanks to Verizon)
So, I'm happy too, I guess. But I had to hack the phone to get there. Whether you bought the steak or the sizzle doesn't matter much. I bought the service because I live in a black hole of other services. But no one brought up anything about plans until after we talked phones.
I don't see any way that Verizon would allow wildcatting on their EV-DO service for long. When the problem is big enough they will devote the resources to stop it in accordance with conventional bottom line thinking, IMO. They obviously attempted to do this through hardware control. It's more managable than devoting manpower to it. They are still expanding EV-DO, with everything riding on it, and can't afford the perception of being aggressively anti-consumer because of it. This will change.
What I don't get about all this, I expressed to both SBC and Verizon. I would give either company all of my telecom and internet biz if they would market something to that end. You know, give the customer what they want and are asking for. Instead Verizon intentionally rations it's service and cripples it's phones, and SBC literally won't expand another mile or two to provide DSL or standard phone services, yet gives it away cheaply elswhere. I don't even have voice mail on my landline, and I live right between two major metro areas. I'm not in the boonies, just a black hole of service.
So anyway, if I setup WebSessions in the handset's root directory to use a proxy does this afford me any anonymity?
Slow down, big guy. Sorry, if my attempt at humor offended you, but you might at least try to get your story straight. First you say that "VZW does not have an investigation team set up to find the people that are doing this" and then you talk about how you know all "about people being caught and how to catch them." Which is it?
Nobody told me I wouldn't get caught. They told me that I'm not doing anything wrong. Period. I spoke with people on *611 several times. Two people tried to help me set up what I wanted to do and another spoke with his supervisor for a long time and came back and said it was not allowed. So I told him to speak with the people in my store. In the end, he did more than that--he even sent a guy out in a truck to find out why my EVDO coverage at home was not as good as they thought it should be in the store. I pay my bill, I like my service, I'm a good customer, and I get good customer service. No reason for my tone to change. I do wish Verizon would offer you guys more consistent training, though, it's silly the way you all disagree about what's allowed and why. Good luck!
I apologize if I took your humor wrong. Knowing that now, when I look back it was actually very funny. Honestly at first I didn't take it that way. VZW does not have a task force set up to catch people. Some people are billed. Very few, but it does happen. When this does happen, I'm just saying that tech support can tell. As far as the training...Most VZW employees don't receive training on an item until after it is released if ever. What I know, I know because I dig into things for my own use.(Thanx to the guy that posted the e815 hack.) I consider all people on this forum my friends because I feel they have similar concerns or needs unless you are one of the ^&*holes that just post whatever you were thinking at the time. At the end of the day a trained VZW employee can tell you that tethering via EVDO phone is not allowed. Be peaceful my friend.
"You put my money to sleep, I'll put your brain to sleep!" Nicky Santoro - Casino
After all the one upmanship we still haven't gotten much further than knowing that instore sales reps know less than techs, Verizon's business model confuses even the middle managment types, and that some are happy with their service....
I don't see any way that Verizon would allow wildcatting on their EV-DO service for long. When the problem is big enough they will devote the resources to stop it in accordance with conventional bottom line thinking, IMO. They obviously attempted to do this through hardware control. It's more managable than devoting manpower to it. They are still expanding EV-DO, with everything riding on it, and can't afford the perception of being aggressively anti-consumer because of it. This will change...
So anyway, if I setup WebSessions in the handset's root directory to use a proxy does this afford me any anonymity?
True, V seems reasonably content with ambiguity for now, but I'm more optimistic about it eventually changing for the better. I assume they've padded their plans to be more than profitable and the competition hasn't been strong enough to force them to do much of anything. Sorry I can't help you much with your root directory question, except to say that I doubt that you can achieve much anonymity. Good luck.
I apologize if I took your humor wrong. Knowing that now, when I look back it was actually very funny. Honestly at first I didn't take it that way. VZW does not have a task force set up to catch people. Some people are billed. Very few, but it does happen. When this does happen, I'm just saying that tech support can tell. As far as the training...Most VZW employees don't receive training on an item until after it is released if ever. What I know, I know because I dig into things for my own use.(Thanx to the guy that posted the e815 hack.) I consider all people on this forum my friends because I feel they have similar concerns or needs unless you are one of the ^&*holes that just post whatever you were thinking at the time. At the end of the day a trained VZW employee can tell you that tethering via EVDO phone is not allowed. Be peaceful my friend.
No problem, I was probably a little over the line anyway.
As far as training goes, at the end of the day, some V employees will tell you EVDO tethering is OK, while others will tell you it's not OK. With lots of silly variations in between. Hence the ambiguity wwz refers to above. I've learned to trust some very competent people but I've also learned not to ask too many questions from others.
Why do you think some (and only very few) people are billed in the first place??? Is it the amount of data usage exceeding a certain threshhold? So far I think there's only been one person on this board warned via phone call from someone "investigating high data usage."
Why do you think some (and only very few) people are billed in the first place??? Is it the amount of data usage exceeding a certain threshhold? So far I think there's only been one person on this board warned via phone call from someone "investigating high data usage."
Honestly don't have an answer for you at this time. I have only had to research and stick it to a few people since this whole fiasco began. In the future I will take notes on usage and post what I find.
Honestly don't have an answer for you at this time. I have only had to research and stick it to a few people since this whole fiasco began. In the future I will take notes on usage and post what I find.
You're welcome. Can't say that I didn't actually enjoy bumping heads with someone that actually knows something.
P.S. For the EVDO phone tethering issue, don't take anyone's word on it not even mine. Being that we are all anonymous here I will just advise you to have whatever employee you are speaking to check his VZW Methods and Procedures (M&Ps). I have checked them since we began posting on this forum and they deny EVDO tethering.
You're welcome. Can't say that I didn't actually enjoy bumping heads with someone that actually knows something.
P.S. For the EVDO phone tethering issue, don't take anyone's word on it not even mine. Being that we are all anonymous here I will just advise you to have whatever employee you are speaking to check his VZW Methods and Procedures (M&Ps). I have checked them since we began posting on this forum and they deny EVDO tethering.
I'd recommend that for employees, but as a customer I'm happy with my current situation and wouldn't want to upset the apple cart. That might change, of course, if a clearly defined better plan comes along with a better phone ... Gotta feed the tech addiction sometimes.
I'm thinking to move to Verizon from Cingular and I have a quick question, probably basic...
I'm not living in BroadbandAccess (VCAST) area. In my case do I use my airtime when I want to tether since I cannot have NationalAccess data plane with Moto e815
Do I have to have mobile Web 2.0 plan to tether, or doesn't matter
I'm thinking to move to Verizon from Cingular and I have a quick question, probably basic...
I'm not living in BroadbandAccess (VCAST) area. In my case do I use my airtime when I want to tether since I cannot have NationalAccess data plane with Moto e815
Do I have to have mobile Web 2.0 plan to tether, or doesn't matter
Most would say that you can have NA MOU (National Access Minutes of Use) plan with 1xRTT phones (eg, V710 or disabled E815). Not sure if this is 100% official, but you'll find many sales and cust serv reps and tech support geeks to explain it this way for you, especially for the 710, though they'll probably try to sell you a mobile office kit also. Talk to 10 reps, get 15 answers, document the one you want and have your account so annotated and sleep well at night ... or hack the local tower and beam yourself up to the mothership. But, whatever you do, don't listen to anything anyone tells you on the Internet!
Just saw Verizon's new phone & it looks nice! I'm thinking my 815 may have an unfortunate accident requiring me to upgrade to this bad boy! Oh yeah, and if you look at the bottom of the page it says
"* Compatible with devices that support the headset, hands-free,
and/or dial-up networking profile(s)."
I wonder how they're going to pull this off? Are they going to make up new charges specifically for DUN? I don't know, but I would expect whatever they decide to have implications for the rest of us.
Now I got my E815.
I tried tethering to my HP Pocket PC, and it worked fine.
Username: XXXXXXXXXX@vzw3g.com
Password: vzw
Dial-Up Number: #777
Now, this weekend I will visit SF area, and EVDO is available there.
What's gonna happen when I try tethering?
Do I get EVDO speed?
If so, how Verizon charges for that
In my area there is no EVDO, and I think I'm using NA MOU for tethering as robrecht said. My Verizon guy also said the same thing, I mean he said I can do that with V710, not with E815 hehe.
I didn't buy VCAST package (first month one month free) because I cannot use it here.
You don't need to input a username or password. As long as you dial #777 it will connect. By using your phone number as a username, the only good that I can see coming from it is Verizon using it to monitor your online activity. Sure, they can probably do this even without you providing them the info, but if I were you I wouldn't volunteer any more information than is absolutely neccessary.
Due to a number of problems- I was talking to the folx over in Data support.... I asked her the following:
Since I do not have VCast enabled- and I do have NA-MOU - can I tether my laptop to the E815?
She told me No. That they were "disabling phones" as we were speaking for tethering, even without VCast.
I did ask her if I was on 1X it made a difference- rather than EVDO. She said that it did not matter- tethering was not allowed [on my phone].
From looking at the VZW web site there seem to be two data plans...
1. NationalAccess (Which I think is 1x) $60
2. BroadbandAccess (Which I think is EVDO) $80
Both require you to purchase a wireless PCMCIA card.
I suspect that they have no automated way of detecting traffic that is from tethering versus GIN/Mobile Web/VCast. The expectation, at $15 a month, is that you will be using limited bandwidth. Allowing tethering would drain resources that exceed $15 per month in costs.
The LG VX9800 is being advertised that it will allow DUN. I wonder if this can be taken as an indication that they are upgrading the proxy's that they use to better control flow.
There's no reason why they can't make all the phones communicate through a proxy server that only allows you to go to certain networks based on what you pay for. For example, only allow connections to the GIN/Vcast/MobileWeb proxy servers if you only pay for that.. and let you out to the rest of the internet if your paying for one of the access plans.
I don't fault VZW for wanting to get paid for the service. I even think, for a business person, that the cost of monthly wireless access is pretty reasonable. Many hotels are charging $10 for 24 hours of broadband- and that only works in the room. (Yes, some hotels do "throw it in" free).
Personally, I would like to see VZW come up with a data cap of some type. Allowing a low-demand user to do a quick check of email or check Google for a map... or some low-drain activity like that- included and then charge those who have high-usage needs for that service. To me, it's about the keyboard- I just want to be able to type a letter without pressing a button 3 times.
I wonder if the VX9800 coming out will have impact on phones like the E815 - and make DUN officially available for us. Of course, the full keyboard on the 9800 will make the whole need for tethering, for me, go away... I could type a quick email.. I'm too old to learn how to "TXT".
Originally Posted by robrecht
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