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Thread: T-Mobile Replacing 1900 Mhz 3G With LTE in 31 Markets

  1. #1
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    T-Mobile Replacing 1900 Mhz 3G With LTE in 31 Markets

    This basically started on 6-23. Maybe I missed it , but I did not see where this was discussed?


    Is your T-Mobile or T-Mobile MVNO non-LTE phone is suddenly only getting 2G data? The reason may be that T-Mobile has shut down more of its non-LTE service.

    Mobile operators are moving toward an all-LTE future. As more devices support LTE and VoLTE there's less need for legacy 2G, 3G and non-LTE 4G service. AT&T has already completely shut down its 2G network and is using the old 2G spectrum for LTE. T-Mobile appears to be taking a different path to all-LTE world by keeping 2G but shutting down its UMTS 3G network piece by piece. (UMTS also includes HSPA and HSPA+, which are the 3G and pre-LTE 4G technologies that T-Mobile uses.)

    Two years ago T-Mobile shut down UMTS on the 1700 Mhz band in 23 Markets. Now T-mobile is replacing down 1900 Mhz UMTS with LTE in 31 markets, including some big ones like New York City. Here's are the affected markets and when 1900 Mhz UMTS was or will be replaced with 1900 Mhz LTE:

    June 23, 2017: Allentown-Bethlehem-Easton, PA-NJ, Boston, MA, Cambridge-Newton-Framingham, MA, Cincinnati, OH, Dover, DE, East Stroudsburg, PA, Elkhart-Goshen, IN, Florence-Muscle Shoals, AL, Hillsboro, TX, Lancaster, PA, Manchester-Nashua, NH, Providence-Warwick, RI-MA, Reading, PA, Rockingham County-Strafford County, NH, Sussex, DE, Tuscaloosa, AL, Waco, TX

    July 11, 2017: Long Island, NY, New Jersey, New York, NY

    August 15, 2017: Atlanta, GA, Bakersfield, CA, Cape Coral-Fort Myers, FL , Detroit, MI, Naples-Immokalee-Marco Island, FL, Orlando, FL, Port St. Lucie, FL, Santa Maria-Santa Barbara, CA, Seattle, WA, Tampa, FL, Ventura County, CA

    I believe that all the markets listed above still have UMTS on 1700 Mhz, which most T-Mobile phones and some non-T-Mobile ones support. However, a few T-Mobile and many unlocked phones including all iPhone 4. 4s, 5 phones and many iPhone 5s models do not support LTE or 1700 Hz UMTS. In the affected markets phones without either LTE or 1700 UMTS support will be stuck on 2G. T-Mobile is recommending that customers in the affected markets upgrade to LTE capable phones. It's offering affected postpaid customers discounted LTE phones but prepaid and T-Mobile MVNO customers are on their own.

    Borrowed from PPN

    T-Mobile
    Last edited by ls61; 07-20-2017 at 04:05 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ls61 View Post
    This basically started on 6-23. Maybe I missed it , but I did not see where this was discussed?


    Is your T-Mobile or T-Mobile MVNO non-LTE phone is suddenly only getting 2G data? The reason may be that T-Mobile has shut down more of its non-LTE service.

    Mobile operators are moving toward an all-LTE future. As more devices support LTE and VoLTE there's less need for legacy 2G, 3G and non-LTE 4G service. AT&T has already completely shut down its 2G network and is using the old 2G spectrum for LTE. T-Mobile appears to be taking a different path to all-LTE world by keeping 2G but shutting down its UMTS 3G network piece by piece. (UMTS also includes HSPA and HSPA+, which are the 3G and pre-LTE 4G technologies that T-Mobile uses.)

    Two years ago T-Mobile shut down UMTS on the 1700 Mhz band in 23 Markets. Now T-mobile is replacing down 1900 Mhz UMTS with LTE in 31 markets, including some big ones like New York City. Here's are the affected markets and when 1900 Mhz UMTS was or will be replaced with 1900 Mhz LTE:

    June 23, 2017: Allentown-Bethlehem-Easton, PA-NJ, Boston, MA, Cambridge-Newton-Framingham, MA, Cincinnati, OH, Dover, DE, East Stroudsburg, PA, Elkhart-Goshen, IN, Florence-Muscle Shoals, AL, Hillsboro, TX, Lancaster, PA, Manchester-Nashua, NH, Providence-Warwick, RI-MA, Reading, PA, Rockingham County-Strafford County, NH, Sussex, DE, Tuscaloosa, AL, Waco, TX

    July 11, 2017: Long Island, NY, New Jersey, New York, NY

    August 15, 2017: Atlanta, GA, Bakersfield, CA, Cape Coral-Fort Myers, FL , Detroit, MI, Naples-Immokalee-Marco Island, FL, Orlando, FL, Port St. Lucie, FL, Santa Maria-Santa Barbara, CA, Seattle, WA, Tampa, FL, Ventura County, CA

    I believe that all the markets listed above still have UMTS on 1700 Mhz, which most T-Mobile phones and some non-T-Mobile ones support. However, a few T-Mobile and many unlocked phones including all iPhone 4. 4s, 5 phones and many iPhone 5s models do not support LTE or 1700 Hz UMTS. In the affected markets phones without either LTE or 1700 UMTS support will be stuck on 2G. T-Mobile is recommending that customers in the affected markets upgrade to LTE capable phones. It's offering affected postpaid customers discounted LTE phones but prepaid and T-Mobile MVNO customers are on their own.

    Borrowed from PPN

    T-Mobile
    I wonder if they will add more markets after these, maybe even Nationwide?

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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    LTE uses the spectrum more efficiently. Verizon is slated to shut off both 2G and 3G in 2019 too.
    Soon, there will be no more "GSM" or "CDMA", just LTE on different bands.

    PS: LTE is IP-based, not a traditional switched circuit. So VoLTE is essential for transition, to allow voice calls without fallback to switched technologies like is happening now.

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    I am in one of the afflicted markets. With one of my older phones, I get 3G when trying an AT&T SIM and Edge with my T-Mobile with the following specs. Was not notified of any service change until Edge became the new normal. Not pleased with that but as prepaid we are the bottom of the barrel I suppose.


    WCDMA 3G / 4G
    band 2 (II) / 1900 MHz PCS
    band 4 (IV) / 1700 MHz AWS
    band 5 (V) / 850 MHz Cellular

    GSM 2G
    850 MHz / band 5 Cellular
    900 MHz / band 8
    1800 MHz / band 3
    1900 MHz / band 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoNic67 View Post
    Soon, there will be no more "GSM" or "CDMA", just LTE on different bands.
    So does that mean that new phones will be sold unlocked to use on any of the 4 networks? I noticed that the Moto G5 at Best Buy is advertised as being compatible with all 4.
    My smartphone is a lot smarter than I am.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Relztrah View Post
    So does that mean that new phones will be sold unlocked to use on any of the 4 networks? I noticed that the Moto G5 at Best Buy is advertised as being compatible with all 4.
    That phone along with Samsung Galaxy and unlocked iPhones work on all carriers. Other phones who knows right now

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Relztrah View Post
    So does that mean that new phones will be sold unlocked to use on any of the 4 networks? I noticed that the Moto G5 at Best Buy is advertised as being compatible with all 4.
    Not necessarily. Each carrier still has incentive to have low cost phones limited to just their LTE bands. So, even if unlocked, the phone is not too usable on other carrier.
    I gave into temptation, and bought the iPhone X, even though I had a perfectly good, though oversized, 7+.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    So, even if unlocked, the phone is not too usable on other carrier.
    I'm starting to see that the word "unlocked" is an elastic term. And I've never understood the difference between carrier unlocked, network unlocked and factory unlocked...assuming there is a difference.

    Anyway, according to Phonescoop the Moto G4 model XT1625 is "...available unlocked with good support for all US 4G networks." Does that mean I can put a Boom! Red (VZW network) SIM card in and use it with Boom! Red? I ask because my son just upgraded to the LG something or other and I'm wondering if I can use his Moto G4 with Boom! Red. He was using it with Cricket.

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    The word unlocked means just that.... Unlocked there is no grey area.... The different terms used to describe unlocked all mean the same thing.... If you unlock a device it well function on other carriers providing the phones hardware matches that of what bands the carriers use on there network.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Relztrah View Post
    I'm starting to see that the word "unlocked" is an elastic term. And I've never understood the difference between carrier unlocked, network unlocked and factory unlocked...assuming there is a difference.

    Anyway, according to Phonescoop the Moto G4 model XT1625 is "...available unlocked with good support for all US 4G networks." Does that mean I can put a Boom! Red (VZW network) SIM card in and use it with Boom! Red? I ask because my son just upgraded to the LG something or other and I'm wondering if I can use his Moto G4 with Boom! Red. He was using it with Cricket.
    You should have no issue using it on either of the Top US 4 carriers and most likely others (US Cellular?).

    As pointed out, the bands the device carries will determine it is actually compatible with a certain carrier. The problem with CDMA is that the MEID/IMEI needs to be white listed for that particular carrier where that is not the case with GSM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Netboy76 View Post
    The word unlocked means just that.... Unlocked there is no grey area.... The different terms used to describe unlocked all mean the same thing.... If you unlock a device it well function on other carriers providing the phones hardware matches that of what bands the carriers use on there network.
    Excellent description and as far as those devices that can be activated across GSM and CDMA carriers the better term would be carrier agnostic rather than unlocked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ls61 View Post

    August 15, 2017: Atlanta, GA, Bakersfield, CA, Cape Coral-Fort Myers, FL , Detroit, MI, Naples-Immokalee-Marco Island, FL, Orlando, FL, Port St. Lucie, FL, Santa Maria-Santa Barbara, CA, Seattle, WA, Tampa, FL, Ventura County, CA

    I believe that all the markets listed above still have UMTS on 1700 Mhz, which most T-Mobile phones and some non-T-Mobile ones support. However, a few T-Mobile and many unlocked phones including all iPhone 4. 4s, 5 phones and many iPhone 5s models do not support LTE or 1700 Hz UMTS. In the affected markets phones without either LTE or 1700 UMTS support will be stuck on 2G.
    Looks like it started early in Tampa. My phone cannot get incoming calls for the past few days as it does not support 1700 Hz UMTS so am forced to either buy another phone or leave Lycamobile and choose another provider.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by tampaite View Post
    Looks like it started early in Tampa. My phone cannot get incoming calls for the past few days as it does not support 1700 Hz UMTS so am forced to either buy another phone or leave Lycamobile and choose another provider.
    From the sound of various Lycamobile posts, Lyca seems to be aggressive with the U1900 switch over... since 2G is still turned on phone calls should work normally, but it sounds like Lyca is blacklisting phone models.
    Carriers I've used: Sprint, T-Mobile, Cricket, AT&T, Verizon, Page Plus, Virgin Mobile, Movistar, AT&T Mexico, Telcel, Straight Talk, RingPlus.
    Phones I've used: iPhone 6S, iPhone 5c, HTC One M9, Samsung Galaxy S3, LG G2, BlackBerry Storm, Nokia 820, Motorola Atrix HD, iPhone 4S, HTC One V, iPhone 4, Nokia Lumia 900, Nokia N9, Samsung Focus, Samsung Captivate, Nokia N900, HTC 8525, iPhone 3GS, iPhone, Nokia E61i, Siemens A56...

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    Quote Originally Posted by tampaite View Post
    Looks like it started early in Tampa. My phone cannot get incoming calls for the past few days as it does not support 1700 Hz UMTS so am forced to either buy another phone or leave Lycamobile and choose another provider.
    What carrie are you using? Lycamobile? If so, what do you see on your phone screen? Do you see 2G ("Edge" or "E") network indicator or no network at all? While you cannot receive calls, can you please calls? Is your phone T-Mobile branded device or just the phone without UMTS Band 4 1700 MHz?

    In my case, the phone just does not recognize Lycamobile SIM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RFK View Post
    What carrie are you using? Lycamobile? If so, what do you see on your phone screen? Do you see 2G ("Edge" or "E") network indicator or no network at all? While you cannot receive calls, can you please calls? Is your phone T-Mobile branded device or just the phone without UMTS Band 4 1700 MHz?

    In my case, the phone just does not recognize Lycamobile SIM.
    Yes, Lycamobile. I see 4G(LTE) but unable to receive any calls(all calls goto Voicemail). I can place outgoing calls, text and data works.

    I cannot change phone to 2G since the "network mode" option ( Settings -> More networks ->) is not available or has been disabled. Am using Samsung Galaxy Note 4 which is unlocked AT&T model(SM-N910A) and I believe this does not have UMTS Band 4 1700 MHz

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    Quote Originally Posted by tampaite View Post
    Yes, Lycamobile. I see 4G(LTE) but unable to receive any calls(all calls goto Voicemail). I can place outgoing calls, text and data works.

    I cannot change phone to 2G since the "network mode" option ( Settings -> More networks ->) is not available or has been disabled. Am using Samsung Galaxy Note 4 which is unlocked AT&T model(SM-N910A)
    I think I know what's going on in your case:

    Your phone does not have VoLTE, does not have UMTS band 4 but has LTE Band 4 that used by T-Mobile. You are right: your phone does not have option to switch manually to 3G (it's AT&T UI issue, I have same problem with ATT's ZTE Maven). Now, by default, the phone connected to LTE and, because of AT&T custom firmware or some other reason (for example, it may be related to specific configuration of Lycamobile network), in case of incoming call, it cannot switch directly from LTE to 2G. So, you miss all incoming calls. I will try to reproduce this problem with my AT&T's ZTE Maven.

    Inability to switch from LTE to 2G in case of incoming call (similar to Band 12 on T-mobile without VoLTE, potentially same problem exists for outgoing calls depending on specific phone) may explain the fact that Lycamobile aggressively disables/blacklists 3G phones without UMTS Band 2 1900 MHz.

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