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Thread: T-Mobile live with 600 MHz in 586 cities and towns!!

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10mm View Post
    There's a ton of visitors that come to the U.P. year round actually. Here are the statistics from the Mackinac Bridge Authority of how many vehicles travel across the bridge each month. This is just the Big Mac bridge and doesn't include travelers coming in from Canada and Wisconsin.

    http://www.mackinacbridge.org/fares-...ic-statistics/
    You are correct. I found a million visitors to the west and Central UP just by looking at two specific destinations. There are many. The number of people in any given region of the United States during a year always seems to be far larger than people think it is.
    "Government has three primary functions. It should provide for military defense of the nation. It should enforce contracts between individuals. It should protect citizens from crimes against themselves or their property." - Milton Friedman.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    T-Mobile covers the Mackinac Bridge and I-75 to the Canadian border. Just because a lot of people cross the bridge doesn't mean they're all headed for Copper Harbor. Looking at some statistics for the International Bridge in Sault Ste. Marie, a fair amount seems to be just passing through. The last time I was in UP, I was glad I could roam AT&T but didn't feel T-Mobile needed to provide native service to every rock and pine tree in that mostly lonely wilderness. UP has about 1/3 of Michigan's areas but only 3% of the population. UP's population density is about 1/10 of Michigan as a whole.

    Should T-Mobile provide some sort of service there? Yes. Customers do go there and having no signal in remote, desolate places is a good way to get them to change carriers. Does T-Mobile have to provide LTE service to every nook and cranny of UP? Certainly not. Not as long as they have some roaming for safety purposes.
    I agree, T-Mobile won't cover every part of the U.P. Neither AT&T nor Verizon cover the entire U.P. either regardless of coverage maps but T-Mobile wants to expand into these rural areas. Now, in the lower part of northeast Michigan where T-Mobile built out B12, their cell spacing isn't anywhere near T and VZ with about a 1/2.5 cell site ratio. I would expect the same in the U.P. which I guess they will cover the bigger towns and major highways.

    Edit: Some don't think there are enough people in areas like the U.P. to invest in expanding wireless coverage. Telcos and Cable companies that have built out fiber and broadband networks up there would disagree.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    You are correct. I found a million visitors to the west and Central UP just by looking at two specific destinations. There are many. The number of people in any given region of the United States during a year always seems to be far larger than people think it is.
    Agreed......................

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    These matters should be for property owners, not governments, to decide. When it comes to such matters, the "outsiders" are those in government (no matter how small the government ).

    And if someone from far away steps up (helping with legal action etc) for these owners to protect their basic rights from arrogant local government bullies, all the better.
    The local governments are elected by the local citizens (property owners & non property owners) to represent the citizens' interests. America has moved away from the times when only land owners could vote. (Something you apparently still advocate: "These matters should be for property owners, not governments, to decide") Furthermore you have stated that you are in favor of the courts forcing the desires of large outside corporations upon the local citizens: "I welcome the carriers being able to sue the pants off those who harass them"

    I support the rights of the citizens to govern their communities as they see fit. And I support the rights of all citizens to have a say whether they own land or not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    Donald, I recall the recent profit reports from T-Mobile in which they say how important it is for them to cover every corner of the US. I think this does include the UP. I don't think having people have to roam on to AT&T in the United States is part of T-Mobile's long-term plan, and it might be sort of an admission of failure that their network is incomplete. But that is just a guess on my part.......
    Would you agree that if USCC provided decent coverage with VoLTE roaming on their existing 700 MHz licenses, there would be no real reason for T-Mobile to build out 600 MHz there (except for FCC requirements)? I mean, from a financial standpoint, covering an area with 17 POPS per square mile can not be what you'd call "a winner."
    Donald Newcomb

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    It looks like (unless I'm wrong) tmobile is building out in an opposite way as they used to which is good. Used to see them build in the cities and branch out some. Now it appears with 600 they are going more rural with the plans to build in within the next few years. If that's the case I like the overall plans

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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    Would you agree that if USCC provided decent coverage with VoLTE roaming on their existing 700 MHz licenses, there would be no real reason for T-Mobile to build out 600 MHz there (except for FCC requirements)? I mean, from a financial standpoint, covering an area with 17 POPS per square mile can not be what you'd call "a winner."
    I really don't know much about USCC. Unlike some (not you, Dr), I don't enjoy making wild statements with no basis.

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    And it is unreasonable that someone here supports the unlimited rights of government elites to control people's personal property. It's as if the American Revolution and the Bill of Rights never existed.

    The justification of individuals being elected doesn't give them the right to control every aspect of our lives... That's advocacy of totalitarianism.

    But perhaps those infamous trolls who favor the complete government control and confiscation of private property should move this conversation to the stalinism pro-and-con forum.

    Because the issue here is nothing but the rights of property owners to control *their own property* and nothing else (including the rights to make deals with those who might pay to put cellular phone transmitters on this property), and is nothing like "only landowners can vote" or any of the other rubbish. I stand by the basic right for property owners to decide what to do with their own property. In America, this right belongs to the people and not the rulers. And this includes rulers at the local level, who are bound by the restrictions of the Bill of Rights as any other rulers at any level of the government.

    Now let's get back to the actual subject.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by themanhimself View Post
    It looks like (unless I'm wrong) tmobile is building out in an opposite way as they used to which is good. Used to see them build in the cities and branch out some. Now it appears with 600 they are going more rural with the plans to build in within the next few years. If that's the case I like the overall plans
    I get your point, the T-Mobile's expansion is also covering thousands of cities and urban areas which had been ignored before.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    The justification of individuals being elected doesn't give them the right to control every aspect of our lives... That's advocacy of totalitarianism.
    favor the complete government control and confiscation of private property
    I never mentioned anything about controlling "every aspect of our lives" nor the "complete government control and confiscation of private property". That's just something that you made up while you engaged in name-calling.

    The topic being discussed was clearly "tower/radio placement".

    And it is unreasonable that someone here supports the unlimited rights of government elites to control people's personal property. It's as if the American Revolution and the Bill of Rights never existed.
    Actually it's exactly the tenth amendment of the Bill of Rights which gives local governments the exact authority to make land use laws.

    "Zoning in the United States includes various land use laws falling under the police power rights of state governments and local governments to exercise authority over privately owned real property. "

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoning..._United_States

    Definition of Police Power:

    "In United States constitutional law, police power is the capacity of the states to regulate behavior and enforce order within their territory for the betterment of the health, safety, morals, and general welfare of their inhabitants. Under the Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, the powers not delegated to the Federal Government are reserved to the states or to the people. "

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police...itutional_law)

    Because the issue here is nothing but the rights of property owners to control *their own property*
    Well the rights of those property owners are subject to the police power of the local governments as stated above.

    In America, this right belongs to the people and not the rulers. And this includes rulers at the local level, who are bound by the restrictions of the Bill of Rights as any other rulers at any level of the government.
    There are no "rulers" at the local level or any other level of government in the United States. That's just a fabrication that you made up.

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    I will ignore the justification for a police state and close with a link to this site:

    "Options for Zoning Relief"

    http://realestate.findlaw.com/land-u...ng-relief.html

    which is one place people can fight to protect their basic rights to do what they want with their own property, including the decision to let someone put a cell phone tower there. Quite relevant to this issue.

    I also watched this case closely:

    http://www.9and10news.com/2014/09/11...-tower-permit/

    The people won, and the bad guy who went nuts trying to control someone else's property lost.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    I will ignore the justification for a police state
    No justification was made for a "police state". Just another false statement you made that such a thing was done. A police state was never even mentioned.

    The article made some good points:

    "State governments have the power to zone for the advancement of the health, morals, safety or general welfare of the community. They in turn grant this power to local governments, enabling them to control the character of a particular location. "

    "Their actions in exercising this power through zoning regulations are generally presumed valid, and are usually upheld in the face of a legal challenge."

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    Would you agree that if USCC provided decent coverage with VoLTE roaming on their existing 700 MHz licenses, there would be no real reason for T-Mobile to build out 600 MHz there (except for FCC requirements)? I mean, from a financial standpoint, covering an area with 17 POPS per square mile can not be what you'd call "a winner."
    USC would still have the issue they are a regional network that customers have to roam when they travel. USC outside of their Mid-West area just has very small patches of native networks. Some of these native sites are less than 100 miles wide or long. Also, USC is still pretty expensive since they have to pay for a lot of roaming outside their native coverage. AT&T has just announced they will have 5G in several location this year. Will USC have 5G by 2020 or 2021? I don't think so.

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    And roaming is hardly ever nearly as good as native coverage.

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    Sometimes the good guys do win, as in this recent victory:

    http://www.postcrescent.com/story/ne...wer/955572001/

    I hope any carrier can add towers to serve the people like this. A Verizon victory helps all.

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