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Thread: Sprint and T-Mobile USA rekindle merger talks (2018 Edition)

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    Sprint and T-Mobile USA rekindle merger talks (2018 Edition)

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    Looks like crazy Masa Son is at it again. Seems like he's willing to make more concessions to make this deal happen.

    This makes me wonder about Sprint's recent barrage of "5G" announcements. Were they just teasing T-Mobile? Will they put that $6B network investment on hold? What it all just a show?

    Are they really confidant the Trump regime will approve a deal? Will Trump care about all the job losses?

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    Don't think this has much to do with "crazy Masa son" much. TMobile hasn't shut up about a sprint merger since the talks formally ended 5 months ago. Son likely will be willing to make more concessions but TMobile is clearly a very open party in these negotiations.

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    This just finally needs to happen. It's been years now and clearly they want to merge together. Just get it done already.

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    Quote Originally Posted by b1geast View Post
    Link

    Looks like crazy Masa Son is at it again. Seems like he's willing to make more concessions to make this deal happen.

    This makes me wonder about Sprint's recent barrage of "5G" announcements. Were they just teasing T-Mobile? Will they put that $6B network investment on hold? What it all just a show?

    Are they really confidant the Trump regime will approve a deal? Will Trump care about all the job losses?
    Bet this new merger talk has more to do with the several Billions of dollars of loans Sprint has that is coming due again than anything T-Mobile cares about in a merger. Masa Son isn't crazy about sinking billions of dollars into a bottomless hole of Sprint debt that does nothing to fix and upgrade Sprint's network for 5G. Masa Son has shopped Sprint around and even circled back to most of potential partners again and again that just don't want Sprint's debt. So far only T-Mobile has shown the most interest in Sprint and I sure don't know why other than Sprint's extra spectrum that a meger with DISH could fill that roll without all the tons of debt.

    Trump would be right to block this since consumers would be much better off with four major networks than just three major networks. I am not a enemy of Sprint but I do think four major networks would be best to preserve for consumers.

    However, This guy's post ( CommentsOnPizza) especially on this comment has me re-thinking this merger... "Charter is a $70B+ company with 17M customers. The home internet and TV industry is ready for disruption and there's a lot of money there."

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    Yea, clearly it has more to do with that than TMobile wanting a merger....


    Jan 2018
    http://www.fiercewireless.com/wirele...ever-say-never

    “This team was highly convicted that we had a unique opportunity for value creation with the Sprint deal,” said T-Mobile CFO Braxton Carter. “Very conservatively, there were at least $37 billion of hard synergy [in the now-collapsed deal]. Mostly in the network. You know, Neville [Ray, T-Mobile’s CTO] and his team for 4-5 months built the most detailed Newco [combined T-Mobile and Sprint] network model—it was a thing of beauty.It’s a shame it didn’t happen,” he said, noting that T-Mobile’s leadership team formed tight relationships with their counterparts at Sprint during months of negotiations between the two companies. Indeed, he said he plans to go fishing with*Sprint’s outgoing CFO Tarek Robbiati*in New Zealand sometime this year.

    March 20, 2018
    http://www.mobileworldlive.com/featu...-growth-stall/

    Talk of a merger with Sprint also resurfaced during the conference, as Carter and T-Mobile CTO Neville Ray pointed out network-driven synergies from a potential tie up still exist.

    Carter reiterated a deal with Sprint would have put its growth trajectory “on steroids”. He added “the prize is still there” for the taking if the companies can get past their differences on price and control of the combined entity.

    https://www.investors.com/news/techn...r-is-for-real/

    "We believe T-Mobile was likely was motivated to re-engage in discussions upon hearing of Sprint's plans for aggressive network investment over the next two years,"*

    Gotta love how people try to make their own narrative based on what they want to believe. TMobile hasn't shut up about the merger since talks formally ended.

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    I think TMobile is realizing they will be left behind in the 5g race if they don't do something.

    Everyone talks about a potential auction in 2 years but by then Verizon and att will have left TMobile in the dust with their 5g rollouts.

    That's why TMobile went from knocking Verizon and att on their mm spectrum plans to wanting to get more of their own. If they don't you'll most likely see tmoble with much slower speeds than Verizon and att once they get their 5g rolling. TMobile is still focusing on coverage also so higher band spectrum is definitely needed for speeds and capacity. TMobile definitely doesn't want to be catching up on 5g also

    With sprint spectrum they could easily hang with the rest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
    I think TMobile is realizing they will be left behind in the 5g race if they don't do something.

    Everyone talks about a potential auction in 2 years but by then Verizon and att will have left TMobile in the dust with their 5g rollouts.

    That's why TMobile went from knocking Verizon and att on their mm spectrum plans to wanting to get more of their own. If they don't you'll most likely see tmoble with much slower speeds than Verizon and att once they get their 5g rolling. TMobile is still focusing on coverage also so higher band spectrum is definitely needed for speeds and capacity. TMobile definitely doesn't want to be catching up on 5g also

    With sprint spectrum they could easily hang with the rest.
    I agree. Tmobile needs to be proactive when it comes to 5g if they want to hang with the big boys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
    I think TMobile is realizing they will be left behind in the 5g race if they don't do something.

    Everyone talks about a potential auction in 2 years but by then Verizon and att will have left TMobile in the dust with their 5g rollouts.

    That's why TMobile went from knocking Verizon and att on their mm spectrum plans to wanting to get more of their own. If they don't you'll most likely see tmoble with much slower speeds than Verizon and att once they get their 5g rolling. TMobile is still focusing on coverage also so higher band spectrum is definitely needed for speeds and capacity. TMobile definitely doesn't want to be catching up on 5g also

    With sprint spectrum they could easily hang with the rest.
    They're also realizing it's hard to compete when you want to build out a network, while trying to undercut the competition price wise, and do it only with a postpaid base that's a little over a quarter of what your competition has. Makes it tough. Somebody has to pay for all those network improvements and 5g plans they keep talking about, there is no such thing as a magic money tree.
    Last edited by SecretAgentCarl; 04-12-2018 at 10:52 AM.

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    I think TMobile is making the right moves though so they should be fine in the long run. There may be an auction in November but not completely sure

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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretAgentCarl View Post
    They're also realizing it's hard to compete when you want to build out a network, while trying to undercut the competition price wise, and do it only with a postpaid base that's a little over a quarter of what your competition has. Makes it tough. Somebody has to pay for all those network improvements and 5g plans they keep talking about, there is no such thing as a magic money tree.
    That's a good point. I do like that TMobile is being proactive so that's a plus.

    I've always wanted there to be 4 carriers but I'm leaning towards a tmo sprint deal now, especially with how sprint seems to be sluggish in a lot of ways. The part I worry about most is the debt sprint has

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
    I think TMobile is realizing they will be left behind in the 5g race if they don't do something.

    Everyone talks about a potential auction in 2 years but by then Verizon and att will have left TMobile in the dust with their 5g rollouts.

    That's why TMobile went from knocking Verizon and att on their mm spectrum plans to wanting to get more of their own. If they don't you'll most likely see tmoble with much slower speeds than Verizon and att once they get their 5g rolling. TMobile is still focusing on coverage also so higher band spectrum is definitely needed for speeds and capacity. TMobile definitely doesn't want to be catching up on 5g also

    With sprint spectrum they could easily hang with the rest.
    More like T-Mobile will be the 1st Nationwide 5G Network by EOY 2019 or by mid-2020 as Verizon and AT&T are stuck on their 5G Hockey Puck Islands in their homes.... T-Mobile has as much spectrum as Verizon does now in tradition Cell Spectrum with half the customers as soon as they can deploy all their 600 Mhz. Verizon owns a lot more mmWave spectrum than T-Mobile but T-Mobile own's 200 MHz or more LMDS mmWave spectrum in 9 of the Top 25 CMA markets including NYC, LA, Dallas, Atlanta, San Francisco, Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinati and Miami. The FCC will auction 3 GHz of mmwave spectrum in top 50 markets within 1-2 years. There are no 5G phones out yet or any phones that support mmWave spectrum. The FCC is talking about a 28 Ghz FCC auction in 2018 to be followed by a 24 Ghz FCC Auction in 2019. On top of that the FCC is planning a CBRS 3.5 Ghz Auction in the same time period.

    T-Mobile's 39 Ghz mmWave Map

    T-Mobile's 28 Ghz Map

    Since those maps T-Mobile added this;

    T-Mobile buys 1150 MHz of millimeter-wave spectrum covering Ohio for 5G

    Outside of the top 50 markets don't expect much mmWave spectrum from anyone since it would be too expensive except for backhaul between towers.
    Last edited by shilohcane; 04-12-2018 at 02:53 PM.

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    I have a dumb question: Is Sprint's 2.5 GHz spectrum considered "mmWave?"
    “The Internet wasn’t meant to be metered in bits and bytes, so it’s insane that wireless companies are still making you buy it this way. The rate plan is dead — it’s a fossil from a time when wireless was metered by every call or text.” John Legere 1/5/2017

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    Quote Originally Posted by shilohcane View Post
    More like T-Mobile will be the 1st Nationwide 5G Network by EOY 2019 as Verizon and AT&T are stuck on their 5G Hockey Puck Islands in their homes.... T-Mobile has as much spectrum as Verizon does now in tradition Cell Spectrum. Verizon owns a lot more mmWave spectrum than T-Mobile but T-Mobile own's 200 MHz or more LMDS mmWave spectrum in 9 of the Top 25 CMA markets including NYC, LA, Dallas, Atlanta, San Francisco, Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinati and Miami. The FCC will auction 3 GHz of mmwave spectrum in top 50 markets within 1-2 years. There are no 5G phones out yet or any phones that support mmWave spectrum. The FCC is talking about a 28 Ghz FCC auction in 2018 to be followed by a 24 Ghz FCC Auction in 2019. On top of that the FCC is planning a CBRS 3.5 Ghz Auction in the same time period.

    T-Mobile's 39 Ghz mmWave Map

    T-Mobile's 28 Ghz Map

    Since those maps T-Mobile added this;

    T-Mobile buys 1150 MHz of millimeter-wave spectrum covering Ohio for 5G

    Outside of the top 50 markets don't expect much mmWave spectrum from anyone since it would be too expensive except for backhaul between towers.
    I think speed and capacity(as in ready for 5g) is where they really need to tweak things (and they are). TMobile already has a clear path for great coverage. They could be first to 5g as long as they don't just rely on 71 and call it a day. The marketing trains from all the carriers will be out in fill force when 5g comes

    I think TMobile is going in the right direction and that 5g will utilize multiple bands

    Sprint should allow them to get there faster so it makes sense now to really try and work out a deal from that perspective

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    Quote Originally Posted by themanhimself View Post
    I think speed is where they really need to tweak things (and they are). They could be first to 5g as long as they don't just rely on 71 and call it a day

    I think TMobile is going in the right direction and that 5g will utilize multiple bands

    Sprint should allow them to get there faster so it makes sense now to really try and work out a deal from that perspective
    This is true. 5G is much more than supersonic speeds in small urban clusters. It will involve multiple layers of spectrum and frequencies.

    In terms of winning speed tests of course T-Mobile will need to acquire more high band spectrum. I believe a combination with Sprint can help them do this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by @TheRealDanny View Post
    This is true. 5G is much more than supersonic speeds in small urban clusters. It will involve multiple layers of spectrum and frequencies.

    In terms of winning speed tests of course T-Mobile will need to acquire more high band spectrum. I believe a combination with Sprint can help them do this.
    Yeah that's where all the marketing will focus on. Now the 3 have great coverage and speed and capacity will be the differentiator I think

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