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Thread: New York Attorney General and nine other states file lawsuit to block Merger

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by shilohcane View Post
    If you don’t have enough customers to pay for a network it should go out of business.
    Correct, that also applies to Sprint as well.

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  2. #17
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    Please refresh my memory on that.

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    Don't make me turn this car around.....

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wide_opeN View Post
    If they want to protect me we need to have a repeat of 84' and 96'.


    The New T-Mobile


    Quote Originally Posted by veriztd View Post
    Please refresh my memory on that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qt0 View Post
    Canada only has 3 players and their customers are screwed big time. Have there really been any real examples where reduction of competing companies still leads to competition? Maybe in the short term, but eventually prices and offerings will probably be virtually the same between all 3. Then it becomes 'pick your poison'. I also recall many times where after mergers, companies fired a ton of people. For example when HP and Compaq merged Carly Fiorina gutted some 40,000 jobs.
    Let me educated you. Sprint is dead man walking if this merger is denied. There will be only 3 anyway I many places( like where I live Sprint doesn't even offer service and I'm not paying more than places where all 4 offer service ). I 100% guarantee you that if this merger is denied within 30 days MAX Sprint will announce layoffs. So the notion that the merger will kill jobs, well those jobs are going to be killed off regardless

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    Canada actually only has 2 players the 3rd one shares a network

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    "Glenn Pomerantz, lead counsel for the state attorneys general, asked federal Judge Victor Marrero of the Southern District of New York to approve a temporary restraining order, or TRO, to block the controversial merger. "


    "The T-Mobile/Sprint merger would cause irreplaceable harm to millions of subscribers nationwide, particularly affecting low-income & communities of color. "

    https://nypost.com/2019/06/12/t-mobi...major-trouble/

    If the 6 month TRO goes into affect, T-Mobile & Sprint should jack their rates on their prepaid plans sky-high. They can note that should the merger be approved in the future, they'll return to the previous rates. But due to the inability to obtain the cost savings that they had predicted would come from the merger, they have no choice but to raise prices now.

    Let the attorney generals deal with that.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    If the 6 month TRO goes into affect, T-Mobile & Sprint should jack their rates on their prepaid plans sky-high. They can note that should the merger be approved in the future, they'll return to the previous rates. But due to the inability to obtain the cost savings that they had predicted would come from the merger, they have no choice but to raise prices now.

    Let the attorney generals deal with that.
    Such a stunt would be viewed really badly by courts, regulators, pols, etc, and probably further torpedo this already mess of a deal. Further, everyone would just go to T and Vz, who offer cheap prepaid both on their own brands, as well as through various re-sellers. Plus, TMUS has long-term contracts with Wal-Mart, Simple Mobile, and others, so they can't jack those rates anyway.

    It's true that the T-Sprint merger would cause irreparable harm that disproportionately impacts low-income and communities of color, since richer and whiter communities would presumably benefit from having a stronger third competitor to Vz and T.

    Of course a merger would be bad for competition, especially at a time of such great change in the industry, and one where TMUS has been wildly successful by cutting a happy medium between T and Vz on one end and Sprint on the other and focusing on value in order to avoid just being a bargain basement also-ran like they were 5 years ago.

    The DISH spectrum needs to be freed up and sold/re-allocated/whatever so that Vz, TMUS, and Sprint can get more low-band and mid-band spectrum.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFan76 View Post
    It's true that the T-Sprint merger would cause irreparable harm that disproportionately impacts low-income and communities of color, since richer and whiter communities would presumably benefit from having a stronger third competitor to Vz and T.
    As if low-income users deserve to have poorer coverage and weaker signals. That's basically your position. Don't let a combined T-Mobile/Sprint company bring up their coverage to the levels of AT&T and Verizon. Their customers should continue to be subjected to worse coverage. That's basically what the attorney generals are deciding and you are agreeing with.

    Further, everyone would just go to T and Vz, who offer cheap prepaid both on their own brands, as well as through various re-sellers.
    Not according to the all-knowing attorney generals. They believe those companies would raise their prepaid plans too if T-Mobile & Sprint weren't around to keep the prices low. The bottom line is T-mobile and Sprint can charge whatever they want for their service. There are no price controls. So if that's the issue blocking the merger, it's time to raise the rates. If they want the lower rates back, approve the merger.

    Of course a merger would be bad for competition,
    You only think that way if you're an AT&T or Verizon supporter. They don't want a strong third competitor. They want two weak competitors who can't challenge them on coverage, who aren't a threat to take away their corporate customers, who have a higher overhead ratio and can't spend as much on capital expenditures. Yes, they very much don't want to have to compete against that. They like their perch and are doing everything they can, spinning it every way possible behind the scenes so that Legere doesn't have more resources to really come after them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    As if low-income users deserve to have poorer coverage and weaker signals. That's basically your position. Don't let a combined T-Mobile/Sprint company bring up their coverage to the levels of AT&T and Verizon. Their customers should continue to be subjected to worse coverage. That's basically what the attorney generals are deciding and you are agreeing with.
    Nope, literally not my position. Those communities already have good Sprint and T-Mobile service, and eliminating a competitor from the market is just going to raise prices and reduce innovation. There is a market for people who don't travel as much, or are willing to give up coverage for price and other features like larger hotspot allowances. There are also very reasonable prepaid/MVNO options on T and Vz. If Sprint and T-Mobile merge, then the merged company will charge as much as T and Vz, and people will have no choice but to pay higher prices and get more coverage, even if they didn't need it or want it in the first place.

    If you're worried about overall coverage, then support roaming agreements to get that coverage as opposed to consolidation that we know will be bad for competition.

    Not according to the all-knowing attorney generals. They believe those companies would raise their prepaid plans too if T-Mobile & Sprint weren't around to keep the prices low. The bottom line is T-mobile and Sprint can charge whatever they want for their service. There are no price controls. So if that's the issue blocking the merger, it's time to raise the rates. If they want the lower rates back, approve the merger.
    That's an utterly insane "plan" to try and somehow extort the government, and would not end well. T and Vz also have long term contracts with MVNOs, so even if any of the carriers wanted to do that, well, they couldn't. Even without long-term contracts, you can bet that T and Vz would be advertising hard to grab prepaid customers if that were to happen.

    You only think that way if you're an AT&T or Verizon supporter. They don't want a strong third competitor. They want two weak competitors who can't challenge them on coverage, who aren't a threat to take away their corporate customers, who have a higher overhead ratio and can't spend as much on capital expenditures. Yes, they very much don't want to have to compete against that. They like their perch and are doing everything they can, spinning it every way possible behind the scenes so that Legere doesn't have more resources to really come after them.
    You've got that 180 degrees backwards. People who believe that the T and Vz model of high prices for decent coverage in a lot of places is the best and only model would support the merger so that there would be three carriers with decent coverage and high prices. Having smaller competitors that have to be more disciplined about where they put their capital provides more options in the market overall.

    John Legere's wild success with T-Mobile, as proven by the net customer add numbers has proven that there is a market for a carrier that's in a sweet spot, even though T-Mobile's network is nowhere near T's or Vz's. He's hit that sweet spot, probably lost some of the lower-end customer to Sprint, and picked up a lot of mid-range customer from T and Vz. That has been a recipe for success, and John Legere has come out to be successful.

    All four carriers have different paths forward, and that's a good thing.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoxFan76 View Post
    If Sprint and T-Mobile merge, then the merged company will charge as much as T and Vz, and people will have no choice but to pay higher prices
    T and Vz also have long term contracts with MVNOs, so even if any of the carriers wanted to do that, well, they couldn't. Even without long-term contracts, you can bet that T and Vz would be advertising hard to grab prepaid customers if that were to happen.
    You contradict yourself in the same post. One one hand you say that T-Mobile will charge higher prices (you have no evidence of that.) And then you say that if T-Mobile and Sprint raised their prepaid prices, that AT&T and Verizon would advertise to try to steal away those customers. You can't have it both ways.

    The threat of higher prices is just what the fearmongers are using to try to prevent the merger from happening so that AT&T and Verizon can keep their top position.


    Those communities already have good Sprint and T-Mobile service
    And you would know that enough to make such a sweeping generality? Sprint's data rates are constantly the lowest of all carriers. Let me know which urban areas that Sprint wins in a RootMetrics study. Oh, but that's okay, because you're fine with low income customers getting subpar service. That's all they deserve, is that it?


    There is a market for people who don't travel as much,
    Well maybe they do travel. Maybe they take a bus to visit their children. But it's okay, because they also deserve worse coverage when they travel too because they're low income. Can't let them get any better service.

    If you're worried about overall coverage, then support roaming agreements to get that coverage as opposed to consolidation
    How does a consumer, "support roaming agreements?" As far as I know, roaming agreements are made by the carriers. They don't ask the consumer for input.


    People who believe that the T and Vz model of high prices for decent coverage in a lot of places is the best and only model would support the merger so that there would be three carriers with decent coverage and high prices.
    You're the one saying that T-Mobile would raise all of their prices. There's no proof of that. It's far more likely they would keep prices the same for many current customers and those customers would get better coverage that the combined company would provide. Legere would have more resources to steal away more market share from AT&T and Verizon and to do that, he will still need to charge less. They wouldn't switch if he charged the same.

    John Legere's wild success with T-Mobile
    The "wild success" still has T-Mobile at a very distant third in both number of customers and revenue. That's the fact. AT&T and Verizon knows that if the merger doesn't go through, T-Mobile will never be a real threat to them. Their only fear is if he gets on a more equal ground.

  11. #26
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    Sadly, Sprint is likely unable to survive and compete independently. They've just made too many bad choices along the way, from sticking to CDMA for too long with very late VoLTE adoption that will make it very challenging to convert to full LTE, owning a majority of Clearwire, poor network foresight (not properly built out in rural areas, and the 2500 Mhz Clearwire spectrum), and just dumb marketing such as combining an 18-month lease with a 12-month price guarantee on the plan (I've overheard customers decide not to purchase and walk out once they heard the advertised phone+plan rate didn't apply to the full 18-month term).

    They've really devalued their business with all of these bipolar promotions, free years, etc., which may have made Boost a more valuable brand name than Sprint itself is. As the phrase goes, I guess you just "can't fix stupid"...

    So while I don't like the merger from a consumer perspective, the reality that that Sprint will very likely fail without the merger. There has been PLENTY of time for a White Knight to come in to save Sprint, and to the best of my knowledge, nobody wants to adopt that dog with fleas. If Sprint fails, then the other 3 will buy the spectrum, and we'll still end up with 3 players. Given T-Mobile's appetite, they will likely buy a somewhat greater share of the spectrum than AT&T and Verizon, but we'll still end up with 3 carriers, but if Sprint fails and sells of spectrum, more will go to AT&T / Verizon than if the merger is allowed.

    ... and YES, DISH SHOULD FORFEIT THEIR SPECTRUM for squatting on it.

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    What makes you think that Sprint won't survive if the merger fails?

    I actually believe the opposite to be true. Sprint will invest, compete and survive.






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  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Limeybastard View Post
    What makes you think that Sprint won't survive if the merger fails?

    I actually believe the opposite to be true. Sprint will invest, compete and survive.






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    Quote Originally Posted by Limeybastard View Post
    What makes you think that Sprint won't survive if the merger fails?

    I actually believe the opposite to be true. Sprint will invest, compete and survive.
    Why haven't they done that already then? They will NOT invest because their owner which is Softbank will not give them any more money to invest. They only bought Sprint because they though they could merger with T-Mobile. This is their 2nd attempt and they know if it gets denied there is no chance of it ever happening so they will just let Sprint rot than to spend money on it.

    If Sprint it survives it will be more or less a regional carrier like US Cellular but larger. They'll focus on the top 30 markets and outside of that they'll bail and sell licenses to whomever pays them the most even if it's At&t or Verizon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Why haven't they done that already then? They will NOT invest because their owner which is Softbank will not give them any more money to invest. They only bought Sprint because they though they could merger with T-Mobile. This is their 2nd attempt and they know if it gets denied there is no chance of it ever happening so they will just let Sprint rot than to spend money on it.

    If Sprint it survives it will be more or less a regional carrier like US Cellular but larger. They'll focus on the top 30 markets and outside of that they'll bail and sell licenses to whomever pays them the most even if it's At&t or Verizon.
    You just answered your question in the first few lines of your first paragraph.

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