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Thread: sprint pulls virgin mobile

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    sprint pulls virgin mobile

    sprint pulls virgin mobile from walmart - https://www.fiercewireless.com/wirel...e-from-walmart

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    VM has been a sinking ship for years now. Surprised anyone still uses that brand

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    Since Sprint has agreed to give Boost and Virgin to Dish as a condition of approval of the merger, all the incentive to Sprint/TMobile is to run down those brands as much as they can get away with before handing then over to Dish, who will be a new competitor.

    So we can expect more of that wherever they think they can get away it.

    (Maybe it was cleared with Dish though - I do not know).
    Last edited by comintel; 11-14-2019 at 10:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qt0 View Post
    VM has been a sinking ship for years now. Surprised anyone still uses that brand
    I stopped caring about them at all when they announced they were going to shove away most of their customers by going iPhone-only.

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    Quote Originally Posted by comintel View Post
    ....all the incentive to Sprint/TMobile is to run down those brands as much as they can get away
    Giving the years-long history of Sprint boneheaded decisions about Virgin, I would suppose then that this plan is many years in the making.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotABiot View Post
    Giving the years-long history of Sprint boneheaded decisions about Virgin, I would suppose then that this plan is many years in the making.
    As odd as it may seem to many, I suspect that is the case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by comintel View Post
    Since Sprint has agreed to give Boost and Virgin to Dish as a condition of approval of the merger, all the incentive to Sprint/TMobile is to run down those brands as much as they can get away with before handing then over to Dish, who will be a new competitor.

    So we can expect more of that wherever they think they can get away it.

    (Maybe it was cleared with Dish though - I do not know).
    You do realize that DISH is going to be an MVNO of New T-Mobile for at least seven years post-merger, right? That means DISH will be buying 100% of the service they sell from T-Mo.

    Why in God's name would Sprint and T-Mo try to devalue or destroy those brands and potentially move those customers to their competitors or their competitors' MVNOs like Cricket or Visible?



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    Quote Originally Posted by elecconnec View Post
    You do realize that DISH is going to be an MVNO of New T-Mobile for at least seven years post-merger, right? That means DISH will be buying 100% of the service they sell from T-Mo.

    Why in God's name would Sprint and T-Mo try to devalue or destroy those brands and potentially move those customers to their competitors or their competitors' MVNOs like Cricket or Visible?

    Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
    Dish will be an mvno for UP TO 7 years at Dish's sole discretion but has no obligation to do so more than it wants or to leave its customers using the TMobile/Sprint network. Dish gets special rights that other mvno's do not have to do their own routing and piece together network parts. They will try and get as much as possible of their operation off TMobile/Sprint as soon as possible, especially where they get cheaper elsewhere. The whole MVNO agreement is just for transitional purposes.

    After you sell something to a competitor and the price is decided, you want it to be worth as little as possible to them, at least to the extent of crippling your competitor.

    Dish will probably fail and amount to nothing. You want to help them along in that direction.

    The major (hidden) goal is to ensure Dish fails. Once that happens, all mvno price levels can be floated up across all three remaining carriers to the benefit of all of them.

    Sprint and TMobile dominate mvno's and the business of people with Sprint phones is going to mainly come back to them, not to Cricket.
    .
    Anyway, the combined Sprint/TMobile has the option of making the whole mvno industry much less profitable since they are the ones setting prices on the low end.

    This is exactly what will happen with TMobile' new promised $15 for 2 GB prepaid plan (which grows to 4 GB if you stay on it) , which is guaranteed for I think 5 years. That will wipe out large swaths of the mvno industry. That is fine with the three syrviving carriers as they can have their own pet mvno's where needed (eg Visible) or just do prepaid business right under their own brands, or new ones.

    Visible is owned by Verizon and will be happy to go along with a three carrier oligopoly and a smoothly rising cost of mvno price levels as competition dies off.
    Last edited by comintel; 11-16-2019 at 12:43 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by comintel View Post
    That will wipe out large swaths of the mvno industry. That is fine with the three syrviving carriers as they can have their own pet mvno's where needed (eg Visible) or just do prepaid business right under their own brands, or new ones.
    off.
    Do you think MVNOs like Mint and Tello will be done post-merger?



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    Quote Originally Posted by luckystreich View Post
    Do you think MVNOs like Mint and Tello will be done post-merger?

    Sent from my iPhone using HoFo
    It will depend if they can adapt.

    Twigby is in trouble now.

    Tello remains to be seen.

    Ultramobile (Mint) is TMobile's favorite MVNO so they will probably survive regardless. They may have secret ties to TMobile. TMonile just gave their pay as you go business to Ultra to run for them. TMobile has sold UltraMobile service packages in TMobile stores.

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    Quote Originally Posted by comintel View Post
    Dish will be an mvno for UP TO 7 years at Dish's sole discretion but has no obligation to do so more than it wants or to leave its customers using the TMobile/Sprint network. Dish gets special rights that other mvno's do not have to do their own routing and piece together network parts. They will try and get as much as possible of their operation off TMobile/Sprint as soon as possible, especially where they get cheaper elsewhere. The whole MVNO agreement is just for transitional purposes.

    After you sell something to a competitor and the price is decided, you want it to be worth as little as possible to them, at least to the extent of crippling your competitor.

    Dish will probably fail and amount to nothing. You want to help them along in that direction.

    The major (hidden) goal is to ensure Dish fails. Once that happens, all mvno price levels can be floated up across all three remaining carriers to the benefit of all of them.

    Sprint and TMobile dominate mvno's and the business of people with Sprint phones is going to mainly come back to them, not to Cricket.
    .
    Anyway, the combined Sprint/TMobile has the option of making the whole mvno industry much less profitable since they are the ones setting prices on the low end.

    This is exactly what will happen with TMobile' new promised $15 for 2 GB prepaid plan (which grows to 4 GB if you stay on it) , which is guaranteed for I think 5 years. That will wipe out large swaths of the mvno industry. That is fine with the three syrviving carriers as they can have their own pet mvno's where needed (eg Visible) or just do prepaid business right under their own brands, or new ones.

    Visible is owned by Verizon and will be happy to go along with a three carrier oligopoly and a smoothly rising cost of mvno price levels as competition dies off.
    DISH, in the short to medium term, will be a customer, not a competitor, so most of your reasoning above doesn't really apply. As you say, the new $15 and $25 plans will apply enough pressure on MVNOs that T-Mo/Sprint doesn't have to sabotage Virgin or Boost before they transfer them to DISH. Giving up any MVNO customers intentionally *now* is just a bad idea. T-Mo (or in this case Sprint) owns 100% of those customers now. Why scatter them to the winds of chance, where only a third are likely to land back on T-Mo or Sprint? (Under the assumption that Verizon, AT&T and New T-Mo/Sprint each control about a third of the market directly or through MVNOs, so any churning customers have a roughly 2/3rds chance of landing on a competitor instead of under the T-Mo/Sprint umbrella.)

    DISH, despite the DOJ Settlement's dictates, is in no position to build a 5G network in the time frame the settlement specifies, and will probably just pay the paltry $2 billion penalty for non-completion, rather than spend the tens of billions it'll take to build a network from scratch. DISH will probably then sell or swap some or all of their $20 billion worth of spectrum to T-Mobile in return for continued access to T-Mo's network as an MVNO, assuming they want to stay in the wireless business.

    In a world full of competitors and MVNOs, it makes no sense to cripple or destroy those on your team, theoretically allowing your competitors and their partners to fill the vacuum.



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    Quote Originally Posted by elecconnec View Post
    DISH, in the short to medium term, will be a customer, not a competitor, so most of your reasoning above doesn't really apply. As you say, the new $15 and $25 plans will apply enough pressure on MVNOs that T-Mo/Sprint doesn't have to sabotage Virgin or Boost before they transfer them to DISH. Giving up any MVNO customers intentionally *now* is just a bad idea. T-Mo (or in this case Sprint) owns 100% of those customers now. Why scatter them to the winds of chance, where only a third are likely to land back on T-Mo or Sprint? (Under the assumption that Verizon, AT&T and New T-Mo/Sprint each control about a third of the market directly or through MVNOs, so any churning customers have a roughly 2/3rds chance of landing on a competitor instead of under the T-Mo/Sprint umbrella.)

    DISH, despite the DOJ Settlement's dictates, is in no position to build a 5G network in the time frame the settlement specifies, and will probably just pay the paltry $2 billion penalty for non-completion, rather than spend the tens of billions it'll take to build a network from scratch. DISH will probably then sell or swap some or all of their $20 billion worth of spectrum to T-Mobile in return for continued access to T-Mo's network as an MVNO, assuming they want to stay in the wireless business.

    In a world full of competitors and MVNOs, it makes no sense to cripple or destroy those on your team, theoretically allowing your competitors and their partners to fill the vacuum.

    Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
    "Under the assumption that Verizon, AT&T and New T-Mo/Sprint each control about a third of the market directly or through MVNOs"

    Not for the mvno market, as I mentioned:

    "Both Sprint and T-Mobile compete aggressively for MVNO subscribers.In this sub-market, the two companies together command an almost 60 percent market share"
    http://www.nwida.org/files/eventdriven.pdf
    .
    =======================


    "it makes no sense to cripple or destroy those on your team"

    I doubt they think Dish is on their team. The mvno agreement is just something they were forced into by DOJ, nothing more. I doubt the terms are profitable to the merging companies at all. Probably DOJ got to approve them and they are not too favorable to the merging companies. It is basically confiscation by the government and Sprint has incentive to make sure it does not work or set a precedent.

    As a business, you do not bet on a licensee/customer (Dish) that you expect to fail. That is not something you count as a plus just because they are giving you a fraction of the revenue you got from the assets you just sold to them.

    As to Boost, its value is in question too.

    See https://twitter.com/peter_adderton/s...73814464876545

    Virgin and Boost both have high potential to become valueless. The whole transfer is mainly for show as a sham attempt to claim Dish can be a viable fourth national carrier.

    But Sprint has zero incentive to facilitate the viability of a fourth national carrier (even if it does get some mvno revenue from the 4th carrier for a while while it is starting up).

    Of course, the merger may still never happen anyway.
    Last edited by comintel; 11-16-2019 at 04:58 AM.

  13. #13
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    Maybe there are issues with negotiating with WalMart? They sell several different carriers through their stores, but some seem to be more equal than others.
    iPhone X is my current primary phone. I have older model iPhones and Moto phones available on other lines. Currently prepaid, though would consider postpaid on right plan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    Maybe there are issues with negotiating with WalMart? They sell several different carriers through their stores, but some seem to be more equal than others.
    Sprint already pulled it from BestBuy and some other if not all retail already.

    It's barely a brand at this point and will disappear soon enough, likely being re branded either to Boost or some other name Dish decides on.

    Dish will transition every new Boost user to tmobile and move as many existing users to that over time.

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