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Thread: Why isnt T-Mobiles and AT&Ts mmwave equivalent to Verizons?

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by thotguy31 View Post
    .... TMO can't do 10x10 on B12....
    Except in certain rural markets.
    Donald Newcomb

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by JSchnee21 View Post
    Something was clearly wrong with that TMo mmWave test. Hard to say what given so many variables. Small cell, backhaul, device config, etc.

    Aside from VZW’s aggressive small cell deployment approach (for urban settings) the other key area they’ve got going for them is their fiber backhaul.

    No other carrier can come close.

    Hopefully, VZW spends big on CBRS and C-Band, then they, too, will have a layer cake (once DSS comes online).


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    Verizon has no coverage with their tiny obscure mmWave that only covers a postage stamp section of the 30 cities they have deployed it to. T-Mobile 5G in just Philadelphia is about 2.5 times the entire the size of Verizon combined 5G network coverage area in the entire USA. T-Mobile 5G also covers Manhattan NY with download speeds of 773 Mbps down that works inside building where a Verizon mmWave 5GHz can’t work. In the next few weeks T-Mobile will be adding fast robust deep bandwidth 5G to Detroit, St, Louis and Columbus. Who cares how fast Verizon mmWave if it is un-useable except standing still outside under their small cell. Verizon customers just need to move over to T-Mobile if they want to use their 5G phone in the next few years and taste some LayerCake.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    Except in certain rural markets.
    I meant Nationwide. I know there are limited areas they hold the B block.

    Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by cnotes20191 View Post
    https://youtu.be/gKVq0oVaKYQ


    https://youtu.be/gKVq0oVaKYQ

    Im not bashing either carrier. Just inquiring as to why its not even close?


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    Thats because the three carriers all have different goals and different resources available.

    T-Mo is more focused on having the largest 5G network. The have a lot of sub 6 GHz spectrum which doesnt go as fast but has a good range. They are using the slower band n71 for huge areas of 5G coverage and n41 (which doesnt go as far) but has more spectrum giving it higher speeds and has good penetration giving them speeds in the 200-700 mbps range (middle of the road). They are using mmWave in a few spots but thats pretty rare as of now. T-Mo focused first on 5G coverage, then middle of the road 5G, then lastly pure speed mmWave 5G. Once they got their hands on sprints spectrum they were able to roll out those middle of the road speeds very fast.

    Verizon is more focused on having the fastest 5G. They have very little sub 6 GHz so they dont have the same amount of spectrum that t-mo has (this will likely change with the upcoming spectrum auctions). They will eventually use some low band spectrum n5 or n2 to paint the coverage maps with 5G like T-Mo but it wont have fast speeds. They are however swimming in mmWave spectrum which doesnt go nearly as far but has extremely fast speeds and huge amounts of capacity which is why you see the 1-2 GBPs speed tests. Verizon also has a huge fiber backbone. Verizon focused first on mmWave pure speed 5G, soon they will deploy the low band slower 5G coverage. Lastly will be the middle of the road 5G. They dont have a choice in following that route because they dont currently have much of the middle of the road spectrum.

    AT&T seems to be in the middle of the road somewhere. Doing a little bit of everything and they are looking for a mix of coverage and speed.

    As far as that test itself it is likely just a technical error of some sort on t-Mos part or the site isnt fully activated or something. Also not that it explains the very slow speed on that particular test but Verizon tends to use 100 MHz chunks of spectrum on mmWave and according the the poster of that video the channel was only 50 MHz.


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  5. #20
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    At least in Philadelphia, Verizon then AT&T are king in speed.


    https://www.phonearena.com/news/t-mo...rison_id124622


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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by thotguy31 View Post
    I meant Nationwide. I know there are limited areas they hold the B block.

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    Which means, it's perfect to be dedicated to LTE, and just throw *all* of B71 into 5G.. which i'm sure was the plan all along (and most T-Mobile users are used to not using B71 for LTE anyway)

    But, we will see what happens with C-band auction now that Intellisat has filed for Bankruptcy, as Verizon was planning on buying most of their assets. That will at least delay what they can do a bit, as that'll all get tied up under restructuring. Intellisat should have waited until after the auction.

    https://www.lightreading.com/5g/inte...d/d-id/759674?
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by brad15 View Post
    Which means, it's perfect to be dedicated to LTE, and just throw *all* of B71 into 5G.. which i'm sure was the plan all along (and most T-Mobile users are used to not using B71 for LTE anyway)

    But, we will see what happens with C-band auction now that Intellisat has filed for Bankruptcy, as Verizon was planning on buying most of their assets. That will at least delay what they can do a bit, as that'll all get tied up under restructuring. Intellisat should have waited until after the auction.

    https://www.lightreading.com/5g/inte...d/d-id/759674?
    IMO b71 would be the perfect band for DSS. Its not that wide everywhere so you arent going to get those blazing fast speeds anyways. I know you get some loss with spectrum inefficiency but its the best of both worlds. You still get to paint the coverage map with 5G and you still have support for 4G devices.

    As far as the C-Band auction Im wondering if intelesats private investors is Verizon. Maybe they are investing in intelesat in exchange to rent their spectrum until the FCC auction. Its just a guess but I dont think the CBRS and C-Band auction will be as heated as everyone thinks. T-Mo wouldnt pass up on a deal for spectrum but with the acquisitions of sprint they really have no need for more spectrum now so I dont think they will be aggressive at all in bidding.


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  8. #23
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    T-Mobile will most likely just leave 71 for 5G, as once the decide they're done with a technology.. they're just done with it and shove everyone over as fast as they can to the newer/more efficient tech.

    With things like Jump on Demand, and yearly upgrades.. they were actually really smart as a lot of their customers swap phones enough it's not a big deal anyway.. whereas AT&T/Verizon have customers that tend to keep their phones longer, and all those biz accounts.

    It's going to be interesting to see what they do with Sprint in the mix now, as all those government and data accounts that are still stuck on CDMA/3G services, what's gonna happen with them as they're not going to be nearly as easy to nudge to a newer network.

  9. #24
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    It'll be interesting to see what happens; I don't think VZW are a bunch of dummies or that they like forgot to bid on spectrum. I think (whether they are right or not remains to be seen) they may be thinking the price for equipment is rapidly dropping, they've got wireless backhaul solutions developed now so in areas where backhaul is difficult some sites would only need power (and use wireless backhaul), so they have decided to spend less on spectrum and somewhat more on densififcation.

    It'll be pretty amusing if this kind of "turns the tables" for rural users; using VZW in rural markets has been almost a no brainer (here it's either VZW or US Cellular for coverage.) But with the same or more low-band than VZW (600 and 700 versus 700 and 850) and WAY more mid-band (most of Sprint and T-Mo's 1900, AWS, and Sprint 2.5? Yeah) I could easily see T-Mo getting so much higher rural speeds that they start drawing off VZW customers.

    I'm not complaining but for example along highway 151 VZW's band 13 sites were getting down to like 3-4mbps or so, the last time I went along there they'd started upgrading some sites (band 2, 4, 5, and 13 as far as I can tell) and they were up to like 20mbps. US Cellular from what I've heard runs like 3-10mbps too. Not terrible, but T-Mo's got probably double the spectrum of USCC and VZW put together here so should be pretty easy to beat them out on speed if they wanted to.

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    Any one know the spectrum holdings of the big three in North Carolina preferably the Triangle area and Charlotte? I know we have T-Mobile lowband here but its not better than lte. I dont know if sprint has a strong hold of midband here. Anyone know? I also know At&t has live a small amount of high band in Raleigh and Charlotte. Can I expect that to densify in the near future ? What about its low and mid band holdings here? I know Verizon has a small amount of UW in Charlotte and Greensboro. Im just hoping they dont forget about us by the end of the year. Im praying carriers want to show a great praise once the new iPhones are released


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