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Thread: Band 5 LTE recently expanded to 10 Mhz DL citywide

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    Band 5 LTE recently expanded to 10 Mhz DL citywide

    I've noticed in the past week that Band 5/850 Mhz has expanded to 10 Mhz download citywide. Before there was a brief period in about 2018 where new sites and rebuilds were expanded to 10 Mhz, but otherwise all other sites were only 5 Mhz DL. Has anyone else in other areas noticed the recent expansion of Band 5? It looks like 3G is finally dead
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenoWirelessGuru View Post
    I've noticed in the past week that Band 5/850 Mhz has expanded to 10 Mhz download citywide. Before there was a brief period in about 2018 where new sites and rebuilds were expanded to 10 Mhz, but otherwise all other sites were only 5 Mhz DL. Has anyone else in other areas noticed the recent expansion of Band 5? It looks like 3G is finally dead
    Yes they are wideing B5. Every tower in my area has 10x10 now. I'm interested in seeing down the road if towers that don't have B5 on LTE get it too

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    Quote Originally Posted by RenoWirelessGuru View Post
    I've noticed in the past week that Band 5/850 Mhz has expanded to 10 Mhz download citywide. Before there was a brief period in about 2018 where new sites and rebuilds were expanded to 10 Mhz, but otherwise all other sites were only 5 Mhz DL. Has anyone else in other areas noticed the recent expansion of Band 5? It looks like 3G is finally dead
    About 4 months ago I started seeing LTE on B5 block A in the Phoenix, AZ area. Before then we had 10x10 LTE on B5 B block. Both B5 blocks now LTE, certainly evidence that 3G is going away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dffdce View Post
    About 4 months ago I started seeing LTE on B5 block A in the Phoenix, AZ area. Before then we had 10x10 LTE on B5 B block. Both B5 blocks now LTE, certainly evidence that 3G is going away.
    Yep vzw owns all the B5 spectrum in Phoenix as att owns none

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    Quote Originally Posted by dffdce View Post
    About 4 months ago I started seeing LTE on B5 block A in the Phoenix, AZ area. Before then we had 10x10 LTE on B5 B block. Both B5 blocks now LTE, certainly evidence that 3G is going away.
    Well that's good.. As when I lived in Phoenix, Verizon was always so congested on LTE.. I ended up using T-Mobile primarily for data, even though I've still got the gUDP plan.

    I remember even when I went to ASU, i'd miss calls all the time due to capacity and just randomly get a voicemail on a regular basis. I hope they've fixed that too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thotguy31 View Post
    Yep vzw owns all the B5 spectrum in Phoenix as att owns none

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    Verizon owns both block in several other places and att&t all of it in most of Texas and east cost of Florida and some others. Call me silly I think it's a win win for both of them to swap blocks in these places. For example Verizon has both blocks in Charlotte and at&t has both blocks in Orlando. Both CMAs are about the same size. It seems a swap is a win win

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Verizon owns both block in several other places and att&t all of it in most of Texas and east cost of Florida and some others. Call me silly I think it's a win win for both of them to swap blocks in these places. For example Verizon has both blocks in Charlotte and at&t has both blocks in Orlando. Both CMAs are about the same size. It seems a swap is a win win
    Swap out for what? Att already has B12,14 and 29 so there are good. Vzw only has B5/13 so 2 carriers of B5 is fair

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    band 5 in one area for band 5 in another carriers do this all the time. Att last time I checked the only offer lowband 5G on band 5. No no 5G for Charlotte I guess because they want to keep Orlando at 25X25. And Verizon can have a "win" in Charlotte over at&t but lose customers in Orlando. OK. Silly me for thinking carriers want NATIONWIDE coverage. So both carriers can be stupid while T-Mobile has lowband 5G EVERYWHERE

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Verizon owns both block in several other places and att&t all of it in most of Texas and east cost of Florida and some others. Call me silly I think it's a win win for both of them to swap blocks in these places. For example Verizon has both blocks in Charlotte and at&t has both blocks in Orlando. Both CMAs are about the same size. It seems a swap is a win win
    Having both blocks in Charlotte impact 5g there? Or is this LTE specific? I know Verizon and AT&T both have 5g there. That’s why I asked.


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    It's LTE-specific for now, VZW's 5G is entirely mmwave-band. Main sources of speed for mmwave are running 100s of mhz of spectrum, and running some massive MIMO setups (wifi typically uses 2x or 4x MIMO, so a 72mbps rate x 4 can get about 300mbps, these 5G mmwave systems are running like 128x MIMO).

    AT&T does use DSS (Dynamic Spectrum Sharing) so for them it means they'd potentially have that 12.5mhz (pair) less spectrum for low band than they'd have if they owned a chunk of band 5.

    Pre-LTE when the 2G and earlier 3G services only ran on cellular or PCS (band 5 and 2), having both hunks of band 5 was a big deal. Now there's a variety of sub-1ghz low-band, mid-band, etc. bands used by both 4G and (soon) 5G, if AT&T needed plenty of low-band spectrum they may well have just bought "extra" 600 or 700mhz spectrum there to make up for not having any 850.

    AT&T is running DSS (Dynamic Spectrum Sharing) to let 5G service run on existing 4G bands; I think it's virtually inevitable that VZW will run DSS 5G sooner or later too. So at that point it'll have whatever effect on 5G having 12.5mhz pair of extra spectrum has.

    So both carriers can be stupid while T-Mobile has lowband 5G EVERYWHERE
    I figure they'll both get DSS lit up over time; they don't have the luxury of having a band like 600mhz (good coverage but not heavily used yet) they could flip over to standalone 5G.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnotes20191 View Post
    Having both blocks in Charlotte impact 5g there? Or is this LTE specific? I know Verizon and AT&T both have 5g there. That’s why I asked.


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    As far as I know at&t is only using 850 for lowband 5G right now of which they have none in Charlotte. Anyone ele has some other info on that they are free to chime in

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    Quote Originally Posted by hwertz View Post
    It's LTE-specific for now, VZW's 5G is entirely mmwave-band.
    sigh. You people are really going to keep using this narrative until the day before Verizon launches it aren't you?

    AT&T does use DSS (Dynamic Spectrum Sharing) so for them it means they'd potentially have that 12.5mhz (pair) less spectrum for low band than they'd have if they owned a chunk of band 5.
    they just recently started to deploy thsi in many areas they have straight up split teh spectrum in half for 4G and 5G

    Pre-LTE when the 2G and earlier 3G services only ran on cellular or PCS (band 5 and 2), having both hunks of band 5 was a big deal. Now there's a variety of sub-1ghz low-band, mid-band, etc. bands used by both 4G and (soon) 5G, if AT&T needed plenty of low-band spectrum they may well have just bought "extra" 600 or 700mhz spectrum there to make up for not having any 850.
    great then they shouldn't have any qualms about selling their 850 outright to Verizon and not just the extra blocks. Since you claim they don't need it and at&t badly needs cash,

    AT&T is running DSS (Dynamic Spectrum Sharing) to let 5G service run on existing 4G bands; I think it's virtually inevitable that VZW will run DSS 5G sooner or later too. .
    yes like in several weeks Verizon has stated they will be launching lowband 5G this fall. But no one listens. Look at about the same time the new iPhone launches

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    You people are really going to keep using this narrative until the day before Verizon launches it aren't you?
    What narrative? VZW's 5G is mmwave-only for now, until the day they launch other 5G that's just how it is.

    great then they shouldn't have any qualms about selling their 850 outright to Verizon and not just the extra blocks. Since you claim they don't need it and at&t badly needs cash,
    I'm not saying they don't need it in markets they've got it, I'm just saying in the past having no band 5 meant you had a PCS-only service, now there's band 12, 13, 14, 41, etc., so not having band 5 somewhere is much less of an issue.
    I missed the post saying AT&T's current 5G is only on band 5; obviously, it'd have a big effect on AT&T's current 5G service to not have the band they're using for it...

    yes like in several weeks Verizon has stated they will be launching lowband 5G this fall
    Yep. Not a bad idea either, the DSS technology is new and from what I've read rapidly improving, I think it makes sense to take their time, field test, figure out if there's anything new needed in terms of tuning it properly to get the most out of it, before a widespread rollout.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hwertz View Post
    What narrative? VZW's 5G is mmwave-only for now, until the day they launch other 5G that's just how it is.
    Going to suck for you that within the next 60 days you can no longer use this argument


    I'm not saying they don't need it in markets they've got it
    Shall I quote you? "Att already has B12,14 and 29 so there are good."

    saying in the past having no band 5 meant you had a PCS-only service, now there's band 12, 13, 14, 41, etc., so not having band 5 somewhere is much less of an issue.
    Except when you've decided that it's only band you're going to launch lowband 5G on. And band 41 is T-Mobile band and it's 2.5 GHz

    I missed the post saying AT&T's current 5G is only on band 5; obviously, it'd have a big effect on AT&T's current 5G service to not have the band they're using for it...
    Hence my whole point about the swaps. If at&t is so good with other lowbands in Orlando for example then it couldn't possibly hurt then to part with one of those 2 850 blocks can it? Then it will help them in Charlotte by getting one of Verizon's excess 850 blocks so then they could now offer lowband 5G.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dffdce View Post
    About 4 months ago I started seeing LTE on B5 block A in the Phoenix, AZ area. Before then we had 10x10 LTE on B5 B block. Both B5 blocks now LTE, certainly evidence that 3G is going away.
    Are they using 20x20 bandwidth, or 2 10x10 channels?

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