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Thread: Why is Verizon Always Number-One?

  1. #1
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    Question Why is Verizon Always Number-One?

    I have been a member of this forum for many years and have learned a lot of information about Verizon Wireless including:

    1. Verizon's plans are typically the highest cost of any wireless providers.

    2. Verizon deployed their cell sites spaced far apart because it was adequate for CDMA protocol. This puts Verizon at a significant disadvantage for newer protocols like 4G and 5G LTE, whereas other providers such as AT&T spaced their cell sites closer together and therefore should be able to realize better performance.

    3. Verizon is spectrum poor. Why didn't Verizon be more aggressive obtaining spectrum during auctions? AT&T and T-Mobile own much more spectrum.

    4. Verizon is more aggressive with throttling data rates than other providers, presumably because they have bandwidth issues due to lack of spectrum and want to give the best experience to customers that are paying for their premium plane.

    Given the aforementioned facts, how can Verizon be rated number-one by Root Metrics and other rating agencies year after year?

    There is obviously something that I don't understand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CellGeek View Post

    There is obviously something that I don't understand.
    True...............

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    Why is Verizon Always Number-One?

    Quote Originally Posted by CellGeek View Post
    I have been a member of this forum for many years and have learned a lot of information about Verizon Wireless including:

    1. Verizon's plans are typically the highest cost of any wireless providers.

    2. Verizon deployed their cell sites spaced far apart because it was adequate for CDMA protocol. This puts Verizon at a significant disadvantage for newer protocols like 4G and 5G LTE, whereas other providers such as AT&T spaced their cell sites closer together and therefore should be able to realize better performance.

    3. Verizon is spectrum poor. Why didn't Verizon be more aggressive obtaining spectrum during auctions? AT&T and T-Mobile own much more spectrum.

    4. Verizon is more aggressive with throttling data rates than other providers, presumably because they have bandwidth issues due to lack of spectrum and want to give the best experience to customers that are paying for their premium plane.

    Given the aforementioned facts, how can Verizon be rated number-one by Root Metrics and other rating agencies year after year?

    There is obviously something that I don't understand.
    1.) Has nothing to do with disqualifying a company from being rated #1.

    2.) CDMA has soft handoff (new tower acquired before old tower dropped) which INHERENTLY results in FAR FEWER dropped calls than GSM. GSM takes the leap to the new tower “hard handoff / blind handoff” and is much more susceptible to dropped calls. GSM carriers had to build a more tower/antenna-dense network to compensate for this, and STILL had more dropped calls.

    3.) Define spectrum poor. They have the biggest slice of 700 MHz that penetrates buildings better and provides longer range. Answers your question #2, as well.

    4.) Both Verizon and AT&T have 22 GB as their de-prioritization threshold for unlimited plans. What metrics are you basing your claim of “more aggressively” on?


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    Quote Originally Posted by CellGeek View Post
    I have been a member of this forum for many years and have learned a lot of information about Verizon Wireless including:

    1. Verizon's plans are typically the highest cost of any wireless providers.
    Rootmetrics is not based on price

    2. Verizon deployed their cell sites spaced far apart because it was adequate for CDMA protocol. This puts Verizon at a significant disadvantage for newer protocols like 4G and 5G LTE, whereas other providers such as AT&T spaced their cell sites closer together and therefore should be able to realize better performance.
    Not true at all. My area is more rural Verizon has far more towers than either at&t or T-Mobile an they are closer together. Yo have proof of this? This may have been true years ago but Verizon has been deploying on additional towers quite a lot of the last decade. I think this should be filed under "old wives tales"

    3. Verizon is spectrum poor. Why didn't Verizon be more aggressive obtaining spectrum during auctions? AT&T and T-Mobile own much more spectrum.
    One again not true and Verizon ha participated in most auction so I'm not sure what you are talking about. Other than the 600 MHz auction which auction didn't participate in? In most auctions they are #1 r#2 in spectrum gained. I guess you missed where they spent over $50 BILLION in the C-band auction which was about 2/3 of all the money spent. And got double what at&t did

    4. Verizon is more aggressive with throttling data rates than other providers,
    They do not do this

    Given the aforementioned facts, how can Verizon be rated number-one by Root Metrics and other rating agencies year after year?

    There is obviously something that I don't understand.
    These are about coverage not pricing. A lot of people like me are in more rural areas where T-Mobile has been garbage and still is. T-Mobile has only been here maybe 5 years while Verizon and at&t at least close to 20. T-Mobile chooses to use half as much spectrum here even though they have more and there isn't any kind of presence here. while T-Mobile now claims to be in half the Wal-Mart in the US the nearest one with any T-Mobile presence is 100 miles away despite having abut 2 dozen closer to me. The nearest T-Mobile store is an hour away in another state

    At&t could do better here however they have fewer towers. Also if they offered something better than 10 Mbps DSL( or many cases worse ) they'd have a wonder bundling opportunity. Nearest at&t store( not in a Wal-Mart ) is 20 miles a way )So like T-Mobile they show they really don't care. And when it comes down to it that sort of matters. When you tell me "No thanks I don't want your money" well Ok then I won't give it to you

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    Quote Originally Posted by VoIP2TDM View Post
    4.) Both Verizon and AT&T have 22 GB as their de-prioritization threshold for unlimited plans. What metrics are you basing your claim of “more aggressively” on?
    No offense but I would suggest brushing up on plans for both carriers because this is not true. Also I believe the OP seems to think when deprioritization( not throttling as the OP incorrectly says ) is being used by both Verizon is more aggressive about it. That may be true or not. Maybe the OP can clarify what they actually mean

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    Verizon is spectrum-poor because they decided in the mid-2010s to err on the side of densification. It was a hot topic of debate here around 2015. I agreed and still agree with Verizon, because a dense network with less spectrum will generally perform better than a thin network with lots of spectrum. I think their only major spectrum misstep was not going for the 2.5 GHz band when they had the chance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VVivian View Post
    Verizon is spectrum-poor because they decided in the mid-2010s to err on the side of densification. It was a hot topic of debate here around 2015. I agreed and still agree with Verizon, because a dense network with less spectrum will generally perform better than a thin network with lots of spectrum. I think their only major spectrum misstep was not going for the 2.5 GHz band when they had the chance.
    Other than 600 MHz what auction did Verion sit out? Considering I fervently been watching auctions since 2014 I'm not sure what people are talking about. And Verizon had legit reasons for sitting that auction out

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    No offense but I would suggest brushing up on plans for both carriers because this is not true. Also I believe the OP seems to think when deprioritization( not throttling as the OP incorrectly says ) is being used by both Verizon is more aggressive about it. That may be true or not. Maybe the OP can clarify what they actually mean
    There are people still on those plans. The CURRENT offerings can change all they want.

    https://www.att.com/help/wireless/data-usage/


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    Quote Originally Posted by VVivian View Post
    Verizon is spectrum-poor because they decided in the mid-2010s to err on the side of densification. It was a hot topic of debate here around 2015. I agreed and still agree with Verizon, because a dense network with less spectrum will generally perform better than a thin network with lots of spectrum. I think their only major spectrum misstep was not going for the 2.5 GHz band when they had the chance.
    Very true as regards densification, and if/when they are able to use the mid-band spectrum they bought, because of that densification they will be able to leapfrog T-Mobile and their mid-band coverage if they deploy mid-band to all their sites, because of T-Mobile's 20-mile site spacing, providing near-blanket coverage instead of polka-dots of 5-mile diameter coverage. AT&T will be able to do the same thing in some cases, although their network is not nearly as densely built as Verizon's. Verizon's 7-10 mile spacing has served them well over the years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mwdewey View Post
    Very true as regards densification, and if/when they are able to use the mid-band spectrum they bought, because of that densification they will be able to leapfrog T-Mobile and their mid-band coverage if they deploy mid-band to all their sites, because of T-Mobile's 20-mile site spacing, providing near-blanket coverage instead of polka-dots of 5-mile diameter coverage. AT&T will be able to do the same thing in some cases, although their network is not nearly as densely built as Verizon's. Verizon's 7-10 mile spacing has served them well over the years.
    Dunno what you're argument here is.

    In my own experience, i cannot throw a rock without hitting one of SEVEN T-Mobile towers, all within a mile in radius.

    The nearest att tower (and the only one ive found) sits just over a mile away and the nearest vzw tower that ive found is 12 miles away and across the water.

    This is all in south Seattle, so im sure its all area dependant and some areas get better densification from AT&t or Verizon than that of tmo. But here: in TMobiles back yard (their corporate office is less than 15 miles from me) - they worked extra hard to take that lead, especially under legere.

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    Drako Swiftclaw

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    Quote Originally Posted by VoIP2TDM View Post
    There are people still on those plans. The CURRENT offerings can change all they want.

    https://www.att.com/help/wireless/data-usage/


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    there are people on plans from 10 years ago that doesn't mean that's the norm. The plans that customers can actually get is what counts

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac32here View Post
    Dunno what you're argument here is.

    In my own experience, i cannot throw a rock without hitting one of SEVEN T-Mobile towers, all within a mile in radius.
    I my area you'd be lucky to find 1 T-Mobile tower within 7 miles

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    For me Verizon wasn't number one. I had tons of missed calls, data that wouldn't work, and text that came in late.

    Depends on the area. For some they may be great but it's impossible to say any one carrier is best everywhere and best for everyone. For me att has turned out to be best for me.


    So many factors involved

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    Last edited by daisydoo; 11-18-2021 at 07:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac32here View Post
    Dunno what you're argument here is.

    In my own experience, i cannot throw a rock without hitting one of SEVEN T-Mobile towers, all within a mile in radius.

    The nearest att tower (and the only one ive found) sits just over a mile away and the nearest vzw tower that ive found is 12 miles away and across the water.

    This is all in south Seattle, so im sure its all area dependant and some areas get better densification from AT&t or Verizon than that of tmo. But here: in TMobiles back yard (their corporate office is less than 15 miles from me) - they worked extra hard to take that lead, especially under legere.

    Sent from my S6003L using HoFo mobile app
    Your situation perfectly illustrates the difference between living in a metro area as opposed to living anywhere else. (And Seattle is T-Mobile's home market as well, so it is not surprising at all that it is well-served) T-Mobile has well-spaced sites where you live so they can offer blanket service and that is great, kudos to them for doing that. In other places, such as around where I live, their sites are situated 20 miles apart, which leaves gaps in coverage halfway between those sites and areas of weak signal at the mid-points. And because of that 20-mile gap, short-range spectrum such as mid-band cannot provide blanket coverage either because it does reach any farther than 2-3 miles at best from a site.

    It would serve no purpose at all for T-Mobile to install mid-band on the site that serves our town because it is located 6 miles from town and that mid-band signal would not reach anywhere close to here. It would be a waste of money. Only if they decide to located a site on one of the two existing towers IN town would putting that spectrum to use here be a viable proposition.

    AT&T and Verizon have much more densely-spaced sites so they are better positioned to use their mid-band spectrum to provide blanket coverage if and when it becomes available for them to use.

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    Quote Originally Posted by daisydoo View Post
    For me Verizon wasn't number one. I had tons of missed calls, data that wouldn't work, and text that came in late.

    Depends on the area. For some they may be great but it's impossible to say any one carrier is best everywhere and best for everyone. For me att has turned out to be best for me.


    So many factors involved

    Sent from my U705AA using HoFo mobile app
    See and this is why I left Sprint. Years ago, I could sit there and watch my phone on a table, with full bars, as I called it from a landline. The call rolled immediately to voicemail and I didn’t get the voicemail notification until hours later. Text messages, same thing.

    I much later found out, from my coworkers who had to enter a cell site for Sprint, that their bandwidth is maxed out 24/7, traffic queueing and dropping.


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