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Thread: 3G Shutoff Date?

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by LTENetwork View Post
    Verizon’s 3G is not HSPA. AT&T shut down their HSPA network already. I believe Tmobile is the last provider with HSPA available


    AT&T 3G is still active in many areas, so not totally shut down yet. T-Mobile still has 2G/Edge here but I have not seen HSPA+ for a while in my area.

    I've noticed in the past in very rural areas of Northern Michigan, B13 would drop off and I'd connect to 3G which would allow me to text but many times calls would be garbled or not connect and data was useless.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10mm View Post
    AT&T 3G is still active in many areas, so not totally shut down yet. T-Mobile still has 2G/Edge here but I have not seen HSPA+ for a while in my area.
    Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T's UMTS shut down takes as long as Verizon's CDMA shutdown. They seem to be in no hurry to expand n5/n2 to 10x10 (or be in a hurry to upgrade much of anything these days), even in areas that desperately need the capacity boost. They shut down UMTS in my area almost exactly two months after the claimed UMTS shutdown date, and to my knowledge still haven't expanded n2 to 10x10.

    T-Mobile still has GSM/EDGE and UMTS live here. But they also have a ton of spectrum -- enough to run 20x20 B66, another non-contiguous 10x10 B66, and a load of non-contiguous PCS spectrum (part of B, all of E and G) totaling 25x25. They can easily afford to fill in their PCS B holdings (only 5x5) with GSM/EDGE and run UMTS in the G block (I don't recall offhand whether UMTS recognized the expanded PCS G range, but fairly certain GSM1900 phones do not), while running another LTE channel in PCS E or G and stuff NR into n41 and n71. I don't keep track of T-Mobile here as closely as the other two, but I have a cheap MVNO SIM for them and they get very performant LTE speeds where they have coverage. Unfortunately, without NR support on the MVNO, their in-building coverage and capacity is quite poor.

    AT&T has begun deploying C-band as of 2-3 weeks ago, I've seen a total of two AT&T sites with 40 MHz of n77 live though. Verizon is still far ahead of them in radios on towers and has had actual C-band available since the "launch" date they negotiated with the FAA and airlines. Verizon doesn't need the capacity here as badly as AT&T does, but it doesn't seem to be slowing them down. Nor does AT&T seem to be concerned about how congested they've become.


  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by blkballoon925 View Post
    Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T's UMTS shut down takes as long as Verizon's CDMA shutdown. They seem to be in no hurry to expand n5/n2 to 10x10 (or be in a hurry to upgrade much of anything these days), even in areas that desperately need the capacity boost. They shut down UMTS in my area almost exactly two months after the claimed UMTS shutdown date, and to my knowledge still haven't expanded n2 to 10x10.

    T-Mobile still has GSM/EDGE and UMTS live here. But they also have a ton of spectrum -- enough to run 20x20 B66, another non-contiguous 10x10 B66, and a load of non-contiguous PCS spectrum (part of B, all of E and G) totaling 25x25. They can easily afford to fill in their PCS B holdings (only 5x5) with GSM/EDGE and run UMTS in the G block (I don't recall offhand whether UMTS recognized the expanded PCS G range, but fairly certain GSM1900 phones do not), while running another LTE channel in PCS E or G and stuff NR into n41 and n71. I don't keep track of T-Mobile here as closely as the other two, but I have a cheap MVNO SIM for them and they get very performant LTE speeds where they have coverage. Unfortunately, without NR support on the MVNO, their in-building coverage and capacity is quite poor.

    AT&T has begun deploying C-band as of 2-3 weeks ago, I've seen a total of two AT&T sites with 40 MHz of n77 live though. Verizon is still far ahead of them in radios on towers and has had actual C-band available since the "launch" date they negotiated with the FAA and airlines. Verizon doesn't need the capacity here as badly as AT&T does, but it doesn't seem to be slowing them down. Nor does AT&T seem to be concerned about how congested they've become.
    T-Mobile only has GSM/EDGE going in LTE guard bands, so they're literally not wasting *any* space on it that they'd not be using anyway. It works well here when stationary, but does not seem to hand off between sites well (I have a v60 on a prepaid SIM I as a nerd carry and test this stuff)

    HSPA here in Chicago I think is down to a single 3.8MHz carrier, and works well when it's needed.

    But in most places, T-Mobile has so much spectrum, it doesnt matter anyway to be honest... I think for T-Mobile, it's more about using that packet-only core, and dumping CS anything.

    Now, even the error messages are different on the CS vs IP networks, that happened about a month or so ago.. T-Mobile is legitimately ready to launch VoNR nationwide and be an IP-only based network... that core is fully up and operational and now handling VoLTE and VoNR calls.. it's only a matter of time at this point.
    T-Mobile: Magenta Amplified

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    Quote Originally Posted by Orlimar1 View Post
    So when Verizon shuts down 3G, will Verizon call quality/reception in large buildings decline? Will it be comparable to AT&T and T-Mo? The whole reason we've always had Verizon is their coverage and almost always being able to make receive calls indoors.
    Large buildings with reception issues usually have a multi carrier DAS to address this concern. Smaller buildings I’ve noticed use a LTE network extender which works well.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    yes instead of people complaining about what MIGHT happen they are pre-expletively stressing themselves out over perhaps nothing. I never understand this attitude. IF their service is bad AFTER the shutdown then sure complain. What if it
    isn't? Then they un-necessary caused themselves stress over nothing. In 236 days is the time to complain IF therr is anything to complain about. I suspect there won't be
    Actually from my understanding this “shutdown” has been ongoing for a few years now. As new towers are put up they only have LTE and 5G equipment and no CDMA, and as CDMA equipment breaks on older towers for various reasons, they’re removed or taken offline instead of repaired. The December 31st date isn’t an end date it’s a deadline. CDMA will be gone by December 31st. If it happens sooner then it happens sooner.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmtvaquero View Post
    Maybe, maybe not. I suspect that they aren't keeping it around for grandma who loves her old flip phone and is negligent about getting a new one. I imagine it has more to do with commercial and industrial equipment and older vehicles which depend on 3G to keep operating. It takes longer to replace some of this equipment than just an old cellphone.
    Verizon has been talking about sunsetting CDMA since 2016. They were supposed to shut it down at the end of 2019, then delayed it to the end of 2020, and then delayed it again to the end of 2022. 3 extra years for those industrial and commercial companies to figure stuff out. 3 extra years for the stragglers to get with the program. Times up.

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    Some areas that I frequent that used to have cdma now get bupkis. I wonder if Starlink will sell a sat phone since cellular has become worthless outside metro areas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ballo View Post
    Some areas that I frequent that used to have cdma now get bupkis. I wonder if Starlink will sell a sat phone since cellular has become worthless outside metro areas.
    Have you seen the size of the external antennas typically found on a satellite phone? Most users would not tolerate using that type of phone.
    Just another day in paradise.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Serial Port View Post
    Have you seen the size of the external antennas typically found on a satellite phone? Most users would not tolerate using that type of phone.
    satellite phones use higher frequencies than cellular.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballo View Post
    Some areas that I frequent that used to have cdma now get bupkis. I wonder if Starlink will sell a sat phone since cellular has become worthless outside metro areas.
    you'll be fine. If an area was that bad it would have been worth it to switch carriers anyway. I live in rural area( nearest town greater than 10K is over an hour away ) we get more than bupkis

  11. #101
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    Switch carriers? LOL, bupkis means bupkis. Also, I don't live in flatland. The older protocols are definitely better at navigating terrain

  12. #102
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    Looks like moves are being made, but who knows how long it'll take to see product. Also, 2ghz is barely a higher frequency than 3g (which uses 1.8)

    https://www.pcmag.com/news/spacex-pr...e-mobile-users

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballo View Post
    The older protocols are definitely better at navigating terrain
    More than likely, the older protocols are less efficient and/or more expensive for the carriers. Very few people still use a horse and buggy to go shopping today. I subscribe to the Darwin theory of "evolve or die".

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  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballo View Post
    Looks like moves are being made, but who knows how long it'll take to see product. Also, 2ghz is barely a higher frequency than 3g (which uses 1.8)

    https://www.pcmag.com/news/spacex-pr...e-mobile-users
    Let’s hope this doesn’t put us all a step backwards on cross carrier HD Voice and VoLTE interoperability call quality.

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